Which copper isotope(s) are brass shell cartridges made of?

Discussion in 'General Handgun Discussion' started by jaketodd, Aug 18, 2011.

  1. jaketodd

    jaketodd New Member

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    Which copper isotope(s) are brass shell cartridges made of (63Cu and/or 65Cu)? Or is the copper 29Cu?

    Thanks,

    Jake
     
    Last edited: Aug 18, 2011
  2. gunfighterzero

    gunfighterzero New Member

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    probably depends on the cartridges, but i would i imagine most commercial companies end up with a mixture of all recycled brass and then purify it with an electroplating process and then hardness test it.
     

  3. dunerunner

    dunerunner New Member

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  4. jaketodd

    jaketodd New Member

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    :confused: I assume you are talking about 64Cu. However, that has a very short half-life according to the wikipedia page. Are you sure they don't use 63Cu and/or 65Cu? Those are the only stable forms of copper.

    Anyone?

    Thanks,

    Jake
     
  5. BB98338

    BB98338 New Member

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    Copper

    Hello Jake,
    The copper used in cartridges has all the naturally occurring isotopes in it. When copper is produced none of the isotopes are separated.
     
  6. dunerunner

    dunerunner New Member

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    I mean the base elemental Copper, Cu. On the periodic table of elements, Atomic number 29, group 11, period 4, block D, CAS registry ID 7440-50-8.
     
  7. jaketodd

    jaketodd New Member

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    But due to the very short half-lives of copper isotopes other than 63Cu and 65Cu, wouldn't there basically be just 63Cu and 65Cu in brass? Or, does the zinc stabilize all the isotopes? If so, does anyone know any approximation as to the percentages of 63Cu and 65Cu in brass?

    Thanks,

    Jake
     
  8. dunerunner

    dunerunner New Member

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    Just what are you getting at Jake? I always thought Copper, like Hydrogen was a fairly stable element. Are you thinking of the effect of a nuclear blast on cartridge brass?

    To my knowledge, the isotopes you are speaking of are man made and not naturally occuring, isn't that right?
     
  9. BB98338

    BB98338 New Member

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    Copper isotopes

    It's Elemental - Isotopes of the Element Copper
    Hello Jake,
    Here is the link I looked at showing the relative abundance of the copper isotopes. Natural copper would have this mix plus some minute traces of the others.
     
  10. jaketodd

    jaketodd New Member

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    The only two stable isotopes of copper are 63Cu and 65Cu and they occur naturally. Copper, as on the periodic chart of elements, is not stable and has a half life of 12.7 hours. See the link whom BB98338 posted most recently.
     
  11. Sniper03

    Sniper03 Supporting Member Supporter

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    Dunerunner,

    Certainly enjoying this Thread and conversation! :)

    03
     
  12. CHLChris

    CHLChris New Member

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    I'm glad I could be a part of this ChemistryTalk.com/forums/firearmsmetallurgy minute here at FirearmsTalk. That was esoteric, but enlightening.
     
  13. dunerunner

    dunerunner New Member

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    I still haven't a clue!! Don't care either. Just cuirous as to what the issue is and what it has to do with shooting or the stability of cartridge brass?

    So, what is Beta-minus Decay and Electron Capture...I know it changes the atomic number and those isotope which decay by these listed methods have half lives measured from hours to nano seconds.

    As long as the integrity of the shell casing holds up long enough for me to pop that irradiated zombie headed down my street, I'm OK! :D
     
    Last edited: Aug 22, 2011
  14. CHLChris

    CHLChris New Member

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    Did you notice that the two metallurgy buffs were both from the Seattle/Tacoma area and have the same post count? I think they were putting us on for fun.

    How about you guys go over to the introductions forum and tell us a little about yourselves. Your knowledge may very well be priceless in the future. Welcome...and that has no half-life, just a half-wit.
     
  15. robocop10mm

    robocop10mm Lifetime Supporting Member Lifetime Supporter

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    Regardless of the isotopes present, they will all degrade eventually to a standard atomic weight of 63.546. The introduction of Zinc should not change the half life of the trace isotopes greatly. Even if the radioactive isotopes are pesent, they do not simply disappear after a time, they degrade to non-isotopic Copper.

    I am not sure why this discussion even started.
     
  16. jaketodd

    jaketodd New Member

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    You guessed right: I am BB98338's father's brother's nephew's cousin's former roommate.