what gun and caliber

Discussion in 'General Handgun Discussion' started by speedy16, Mar 11, 2008.

  1. speedy16

    speedy16 New Member

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    I am new to handguns and was wondering if anyone could shed some light on this for me

    I haven been looking every where and I have choose between .40S&W or a .45ACP i was wondering what everyone thinks about both calibers I have heard good things about both.

    I have choosen a few guns if anyone could help with this also.
    HK45, USP, USP Tactical, USP Expert, MK23

    this would mostly be for home safety and maybe CC

    thanks for the help
     
  2. DoubleAction

    DoubleAction New Member

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    I like the .40 S&W for several reasons, one being the 357 sig. The conversion barrels from the .40 to the 357 sig is available for the pistols I use. Those being the Sig Sauers. I looked into buying into the same conversion set ups with the HK and was told that HK does not offer conversion barrels to go from one caliber to the other. You might want to check on this yourself, in case things has changed since then.

    Since I also like the .45 acp, I have pistols for that caliber as well, in the 1911s and the Sig Sauer P-220.

    Choices are somewhat more reasonable when you're buying something like a dog. Since you're looking for a carry piece, you might look through the various manufactured pistols before making a final choice.
     

  3. hillbilly68

    hillbilly68 New Member

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    Speedy, hit a search and I think you will find a lot of info on this.
    Bottom line is shoot what you can shoot accurately and are confident with. Rent, borrow, ask to shoot as many different types that you are interested in.
    Both calibers are excellent for their intended purposes. Personal preference (this is opinion only) is the .45 in a 1911 frame.
    Good luck with your choice, and welcome to the forum.
     
  4. speedy16

    speedy16 New Member

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    I have been fascinated with guns since I got my rifle and well I feel more comfortable and steady holding a handgun compared to my rifle.

    so if you have any other suggestions on handguns I am open to them.

    I am not concearned with the price of ammo either and I am a big guy with big hands
     
  5. robocop10mm

    robocop10mm Lifetime Supporting Member Lifetime Supporter

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    I say " shoot the largest caliber you can shoot well". The .40 is a compromise between the capacity of the 9mm and the ballistics of a .45. On paper, all three are about the same. In the real world (actual shootings) they "seem" to be about the same. IMHO we should not look at best case scenario to best cae scenario (all three expand properly and penetrate properly), we should look at worst case scenario to worst case scenario (all three fail to expand). In other words, they become FMJ's. Which one is better? Is the .45 230 gr FMJ better than the 9mm 115 gr or 124 gr FMJ? I say absolutely yes! The .45 will leave a bigger hole and because of its mass will penetrate more deeply.

    With all that said, I have to admit that the gun on my hip is a .40 loaded with 180 gr Gold Dot HP's. A compromise? Sure, but one I am willing to make right now. In uniform, I do not compromise. I carry a 10mm loaded with 180 gr Gold Dots loaded to 1300 fps. That is magnum power in a semi-auto pistol.
     
  6. Samhain

    Samhain New Member

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    I like my S&W M&P .40 compact.
    Both the .40 & .45 cal are very good for home defence.
    Like others have said shoot as many as you can, and pick the one that fits you best. Guns are like movies, you may think one is great, and I may not like anything about it.
     
  7. Dillinger

    Dillinger New Member

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    I own an H&K USP Tactical in .45ACP - pictures in my gallery. I notice that several of your choices are of the H & K brand, so I feel I should caution you just a bit.

    H & K has a mystique about them - they are in every video game, every movie and they know it. Their customer service is not the best and their service after the sale is lacking. Keep that in mind before you spend some hard earned cash.

    Now, as for the weapon itself. My Tactical came rated to handle +P loads from H & K, which is something that a lot of manufacturers won't do without changes to their product like a recoil spring, and even then it will compromise your warranty. I have put about 2,000 rounds through it and never had any problems. It comes with adjustable sights, which I personally find useless on a pistol, I prefer fixed night sights. What good is adjusting for a wind variable that is only present on one day shooting? The pistol is big, almost too big and this is from a design that was "downsized" from the MK-23. I am over 6ft, wear XL gloves and even my hands are "too small" for this weapon to be handled properly in my opinion. To eject the magazine, I need to either use my off hand thumb, or rotate the weapon off target to press the latch that drops the magazine. While not a big deal, I feel that it's inconvenient and not the safest of actions to give up that firm handshake on the butt of the weapon just to replace mags. The trigger pull is good, with almost zero over travel right from the factory, but once again it's not a 1911, so it lacks in my opinion. :cool:

    This is not a carry weapon, unless "carry" is on your hip, in a tactical thigh rig. The weapon weighs almost 2 pounds unloaded and that is a lot of weight to pack around all day on your hip or in a shoulder rig. Plus the profile is huge, so unless you are "working" in a ski town with a lot of heavy layers, or you are a member of the trench coat set, this will stick out like a sore thumb.

    You can carry in position 1 with this weapon, which is a plus in my book. The frame mounted safety is one of two and is crisp with a positive "on" & "off".

    As a home defense pistol, in a safebox next to the bed, it's a great piece of kit. 12 rounds of +P will put anyone in line for a dirt nap, plus it has in integral frame rail to put a SureFire X-200 to light up the night.

    For a carry gun, I would recommend you look elsewhere. For a good home gun I would recommend a shotgun first, but this pistol has several pluses that make it cool to own and it always garners attention when I break it out at the range. Comes with ( 2 ) 12 round mags, several replacement rubber "O" rings for the barrel and a neat black, tactical nylon carrying case.

    Best of luck in your shopping efforts.

    D
     
  8. NGIB

    NGIB New Member

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    I used to own a few .40s but I have settled on two main calibers for my semis - 9mm and .45 - but this is just my preference. Between these 2 calibers I can find just about any platform I want from small concealable to full-size guns.

    Nothing wrong with the .40, and if I only could own one handgun it would probably be a .40 as it's a good compromise. As far as platform goes, I have poly framed, 1911s, Sigs, etc. Here's one of my current favorites, a Rock Island Compact .45 - very reasonably priced (<$400) and a great shooter...

    [​IMG]
     
  9. matt g

    matt g New Member Supporter

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    Truer words were never spoken. The best decision that I ever made was to swap my USP for my Kimber.
     
  10. Tupelomadman

    Tupelomadman New Member

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    The 1911 is the all around best choice for the well trained, practiced shooter. But that said, those who are not well versed on the 1911 would be well advised to do one of the following things; (1) Go to an approved defensive shooting school (best choice), or (2) Carry a premium DAO pistol (XD has the same bootstrap safety that the 1911 has) and not fiddle with the manual thumb safty. Either way, there is no subsitute for practice, practice, practice.
     
  11. timdog

    timdog New Member

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    I agree on the 45 over the 9, but disagree on a 45 penetrating more deeply because of it's mass. The 9mm (true with the 40sw as well) has more speed and less mass/size, meaning less frictioned surface and as a result can pass through a body with a greater chance of not being impeded. A 45 being bigger has a better chance of hitting hard bone and the surface of the round slows it down very quickly. It is also a sub 1000fps bullet, where the 9 and 40 exceed that.
    I have a 45 for BG's and a 9 for more range shooting (9's ost about 5-8 cents a round cheaper off the internet).

    Tim
     
  12. kirby62

    kirby62 New Member

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    Hey Speedy, I noticed you said you have big hands. I own a full size HK tactial USP and like it for two reasons. One I like the large grip and two I didn't have to get it threaded for my knight can. I've shot 150 rounds out of it and haven't had any problems. But there too much money! Have you tried a Glock? There great guns to learn with. Once you can shoot well with a Glock you can shoot any hand gun well.
     
  13. Dillinger

    Dillinger New Member

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    Actually Springfield is making a whole line of frame mounted, thumb safety model XD's. Rumor has it:

    They are accurate too!

    The shooter is Rob Leatham. You might have heard of him. He has won the USPSA Championship like 21 times. :eek:
     
  14. speedy16

    speedy16 New Member

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    has anyone had any experience with the sig sauer P250 I mean I can start with a small caliber and move to a larger caliber since the barrels are interchangeable
     
  15. kirby62

    kirby62 New Member

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    Sig isn't answering their phones right now. Their customer service is like HK's With the money you're goin put out for that gun and another barrel, you could buy two smith and wesson pistols and 9mm and .40. A guy in my local shop just paid 389.00 for a s&w two tone .40 new
     
  16. robocop10mm

    robocop10mm Lifetime Supporting Member Lifetime Supporter

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    You kind of missed the point. Penetration is a product of mass and velocity. Velocity is lost very quickly in a body. An FMJ bullet will not lose mass (not much at least). The mass is more important than velocity (within reason). A .45 has a far better chance of preaking through bone than a 9. That is why really big game hunters use large, heavy, non-expanding bullets at relatively low velocity for tough thick skinned game like Cape Buffalo. You do not hear about African hunters using .300 Weatherby's with steel core bullets for rhinos.

    Don't get me wrong. I have a 9mm and have no hesitation carrying it. Good bullets (Gold Dots) properly placed are very effective. I no longer carry my .45. It is a bit large for what I need and only holds 8+1. I feel more comfortable with 14+1 of .40. 9mm's have more failures to stop than any other LE sidearms (maybe .38spl is up there but that was before decent bullets were invented). FMJ's in a 9mm are notorious for punching small holes in people that do little damage. 9mm's (even in HP form) can and do ricochet off bone. .45's tend to punch through bone to the vitals underneath.
     
  17. tombirdman

    tombirdman New Member

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    45acp or 9mm

    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Listen to this guy !!!

    My personal experience is that 40s snap and are sharper.
    Forty fives seem to be more of a push. I have 6 45acp and one Sig 229 Dak in 40.

    Forty is going down in popularity - where 45acp & 9mm are gaining again.
    Nine because of the expansion and shock modern ammunition is giving.
    Look on U-Tube and you will see plenty of expansion tests.

    I use to test ammo for a living.
    Ten mm and 40 would both penetrate a 55 gallon drum of water when shooting straight down into it from a ladder. Accuracy test from 25 yards using a RANSOM REST showed the 45 to be much more accurate.
    So there is my 2 cents. Keep on researching ! Either one will do the job with proper bullet placement!
     
  18. jmohme

    jmohme New Member

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    My preference is 40 over the 45.
    My reasoning is that I have a Glock 22 and a Glock 19, and even though the G22 is a slightly larger handgun, it still handles and shoots almost identically to the G19.
    I can take both to the range and burn through a couple hundred rounds of cheap 9mm in the 19 and then seamlessly switch over to the 40 and get the same results out of one 15 round magazine of 40's.
    This may not be the case with other brands or models, but it is what I have observed with mine.
     
  19. therewolf

    therewolf New Member

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    IME, a lot of beginning shooters do well with

    a 1911. 45ACP is a large caliber, but that

    doesn't seem to matter.


    Really, you should get a good 22LR pistol,

    and do some training at the range, first.
     
  20. Mercator

    Mercator New Member

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    Whichever handgun you choose, go with a 9mm. It will cost less, and you want to practice a lot. Your road to accuracy will be shorter than with a 40+. If you want to have it the easiest way, start with a 22. Nothing inspires you like an early success.