VA says it won’t follow New York gun law

Discussion in 'Legal and Activism' started by Bigcountry02, Mar 12, 2013.

  1. Bigcountry02

    Bigcountry02 Coffee! If your not shaking, you need another cup Supporter

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    Veterans Affairs says it won’t follow New York gun law!

    http://www.airforcetimes.com/news/2...-says-it-wont-follow-new-york-gun-law-031113/

    ALBANY, N.Y. — The federal Department of Veterans Affairs says its mental health professionals won’t comply with a new gun law in New York that requires them to report the names of patients they believe likely to hurt themselves or others.

    The reporting provision is set to take effect Saturday.

    Several veterans and their advocates say it would deter many from seeking counseling and medications to deal with post-traumatic stress disorder or other psychological issues. Veterans fear their rights would be taken away.

    Under the law pushed by Gov. Andrew Cuomo, the information would be used to determine whether someone should give up a gun license or weapon.

    VA spokesman Mark Ballesteros says federal laws protecting veterans’ treatment records take precedence.
     
  2. CaseyChadwell

    CaseyChadwell New Member

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    Not only does federal law take precedence, I would venture to say a document called the constitution takes precedence as well. I've worked in the mental health field at a psychiatric correctional hospital and they would encourage patients to speak their mind. Not to get them in trouble, but to get their feelings out.
     

  3. leam23

    leam23 New Member

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    I agree completely . However we can not cry for states rights and more precedent for states rights over federal law and statute and then say fed law is above state law.
     
  4. WNGMSTR

    WNGMSTR Troll Scout

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    Good point, either way they will have their will obliged. The litigation on all the new gun laws is going to be mind numbing over next several years.
     
  5. c3shooter

    c3shooter Administrator Staff Member

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    It is a bit more complex than that. The US Constitution is intended to be the Supreme Law of the land- followed by the state constitutions.

    If you passed a state law that homeowners could be required to billet members of the State National Guard in their homes, reinstating being hanged, drawn and quartered, re-establishing slavery, requiring US Senators from that state to be selected by the state legislature, and not popular vote-

    then Fed IS going to be above State law.
     
  6. JonM

    JonM Moderator

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    Just to be devils advocate here...

    I kinda have a hard time with people currently being treated with psychotropic medication being allowed access to firearms.

    I think there is some merit to looking at a way to get folks onto the no buy list that really are a credible threat to others. It wasnt to long ago when a lot of us here were blasting conneticut officials and colorado officials an arizona officials for not getting info on lanza holmes luaghner into the nics system.

    Then there is the case of chris kyle getting murdered by a ptsd person who prolly should have been on a nics list.

    I just think the issue runs deeper than a flat out its my right mantra or you cant have guns at all insanity. Something does need to be done but i truly dont think politicians have the intelligence or wisdom to solve it.

    For now our best effort is to encourge people to carry and to campaign for removing all "gun free zones"
     
    Last edited: Mar 12, 2013
  7. WNGMSTR

    WNGMSTR Troll Scout

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    If that door does open the govt. will bludgeon a massive portion of the population. The pill pushers that prescribe psychotropic drugs can compile a list in short order, confidentiality is going away with Obamacare.

    There is no doubt thay some shouldn't have access to a butter knife but using the the drugs as a marker would be an ugly mess for a ton of folks.
     
  8. Vincine

    Vincine New Member

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    Rational thought?! What’re you? Nuts?!
     
  9. JonM

    JonM Moderator

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    It makes me queezy either way. I dont like the thought of governments and lists but psycho meds are more likely to make conditions worse being used the way they are.

    Its a difficult thing as doctors as a group are against civil rights and so is the government.
     
  10. locutus

    locutus Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Federal law does trump state law.

    That question was settled once and for all time 150 years ago by Mr. Lincoln's "War of Northern Aggression."
     
  11. WebleyFosbery38

    WebleyFosbery38 New Member

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    Im not on board with many of the psychotropics the Medical community starts ramming down our kids throats before they can even pronounce the word. A State Government that has no respect for any of our Natural rights isnt on my list of those I trust to determine the effective and reasonable application of prudence and judgement against Vets with mental defect. Most of my life they denied the existance of Shell Shock, now their F'n experts? Hell, they could say we were all crazy for volunteering to fight their wars in the first place, we shouldnt be trusted with guns, we must have some death wish or something like that!

    I say good for the VA, hope they keep the faith when BHO orders them to disclose anything the state requires...
     
  12. bluez

    bluez Well-Known Member

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    One crazy guiy doing massacre even every year will cause less damage to this country then gutting the 2nd amendment.
    More people will be killed by bad guys than people die at massacres even if we had one every month.
     
  13. crazycharlie2

    crazycharlie2 New Member

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    If they pass a Fed law that requires the VA to release info it will be released.
    Off this topic on the VA, Rush Limbaugh's meds were released way back when. Where was the ACLU on that one. Doctor/Patient privelaged info can be gotten around if you know the trick or have friends in high places.(political)
    The wackos should be reported, but the anti-gun wackos if they get their way
    you can be sure the reporting system will be abused by our fearless leaders.
    I'm just thinking out loud. I have no solution.
     
  14. Tackleberry1

    Tackleberry1 New Member

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    John,

    All good points but IMHO... the problem is not access to guns, it IS the use of psychotropic medication... Even with it's use, I'm only aware of a small handful of Vets who've done anything wrong with a gun.

    I think the evidence supports the idea that these drugs have far more detrimental effect on "developing" minds... "children"... than they do on those taking them in adulthood.

    Many veterans live with "bad stuff" from our days of service but I personally don't know any who take medication for it. I'm sure some do... and we recently had a vet commit "suicide by cop" in Portland OR... but these are a miniscule exception to the rule where 999,000 out of every 1 million vets return home and never hurt a sole.

    Your absolutely right that the answer does NOT lie in politicians hands. Personally I believe that banning the psychotropic medication would save far more lives than any new gun law.

    Tack
     
  15. Tackleberry1

    Tackleberry1 New Member

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    I do...

    The solution is to recognize that "crazy" and "evil" are a part of the human condition and NO law will ever change that.

    Once this is understood it becomes quiet easy "for anyone" to understand that the only thing capable of stopping a threat, is an armed citizen. Period.

    Tack
     
  16. Holmes375

    Holmes375 New Member

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    Right on the money.
     
  17. leam23

    leam23 New Member

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    I understand fed law versus states rights . My point being that with a lot of current talk being thrown around about gun legislation beings states rights , Fed law etc ... We can not have our cake and it it too in this point and time. In relation to the OP comment as opposed to the off topic rants that tend to happen
     
  18. leam23

    leam23 New Member

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    We can not say we will follow federal law when it comes to protection of vets med records in regards to mental health and accessibility to weapons and then argue our points for states rights over 2a. As a side note because others seem to rant in inappropriate forums .... I take offense when. People mention that LEOs would not be as committed to a physical cause/fight for 2a rights as a military vet . As an LEO I'm as dedicated to to 2a preservation as anyone and publicly swore an oath to defend OUR constitution ( state and federal ) against all enemy's foreign and DOMESTIC . Thank you
     
  19. leam23

    leam23 New Member

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    If lost souls on here truly believe that they should follow fed law over state law then they have clearly been mislead by the intentions of the patriots that founded this republic.
     
  20. unclebear

    unclebear New Member

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    It's really BS, my great uncle served in Korea he was infantry. When he came home he had issues yea like he hit the deck if someone whistled too loudly type of issues. Two things that man never went any where without his 1911 and his knife. He even slept with his 1911 on his side and he died with it at his side.

    I don't care what those jack wagons think in the government, you can't sit there and put a man through hell fighting for his country and the constitution and then say you can't have the basic human right to defend your self and your family. That dog just don't hunt, my uncle told me something once I won't forget you don't go through hell and expect to leave it behind it comes with you where ever you go.

    I don't know what in the hell the people in charge are thinking but they need to think again in that state. You can only kick a dog so much before it bites you.