[Dillinger]

So I posted this graphic in another thread and it got acouple of chuckles and a comment that got me to thinking. And then I couldn’t let the idea go anddecided to offer it up for reasonable, adult discussion.

Assuming the worst, and assuming you have all yourtoys: Your guns, your ammo, your Jeep or other off road monster-piece, YourBoB, your best friends/family that youtrust and assuming you have a secure perimeter –

How long do you reasonably think you could survive without outside help? In other words, how long before you slip up and end up in thered? As much as we all want to believewe are in the best shape of our lives, we are the best shots in the realm, weall have the stamina of a Norse God, the patience of a Saint – sooner or later everyone lets their guard down. You haveprobably done it 10 times today during your workload or home lounging act.

I believe you have to factor in

· Water – How do you attain more, because you don’thave enough now?

· Food – Nomatter what you think, you don’t have enough – active people consume WAY morethan you would think. Fighting for your life qualifies as an “Active Lifestyle”…LOL

· Insurrection– What if everyone doesn’t see things the same way?

· Common fatigue – Even with guards, sleeping in unfamiliar terrain is going to affect everyone differently.

· Disease – A simple cold could turn into pneumonia in nothing flat.

· Injury –one twisted ankle or broken bone and then what?

· Pregnancy (?) – Maybe you don’t have any plansin your household, but what about anyone you let behind the lines?

· Boredom – Sitting around watching the same perimeterday after day when you know there are luxuries out there?

· A need to explore and find others (?) – What ifyou see other campfires or hear shots/shouts from just over the next hill orvalley?

· Survival Guilt and PTSD (?) – Maybe you are made of stone and it won’t affect you, but can you say the same for everyone in your party? Is the accountant who is really ag ood friend and great bar-b-que companion up to battling for his very life whenhe has never expressed an interest in camping before?

As for me and mine, I have to admit I am thinking after 1 to 2 months, we are going to be in serious trouble without help. In all honesty we have a great position with tons of fresh water (lake nearby) and access is pretty restrictive. Food is pretty good and there are other, like minded folks around, all with off road, heavy duty vehicles and I know guns are not a shortage. There are also a lot of kids and I don’t see parents leaving them behind, so that is a lot of mouths to feed.

We have several large ‘Marts’ around (Wal, K, etc.) so if wego early, we could stock up, but we still need to keep the food good and usable. I have a gas line plumbed generator that is twice the size I need for my house, so plugging in a couple of freezers wouldn’t be a problem (provided the gas stays on – it’s automated in our area so I am hopeful, but it’s a simple conversion to run on propane).

I don’t come down to the defense so much as the need toeventually breach our own perimeter and explore, look for others who might have things to trade, skills we don’t have (I am certainly no doctor nor can I playone on TV ).

Familiar terrain won’t be a problem, but what about unfamiliar terrain?

Who do I take with me?

Who do I leave behind to possibly take over / stage a coup’on the compound?

Do we become nomads? Moving from place to place? Or dowe stay, exhaust the land we are on before we try to haul everyone halfway across the state in an effort to meet up with other survivors?

Open for discussion -

JD

 

[pagj17]

Right now? I've got three to five days unless things go incredibly my way.

 

[ScottA]

Sailboat and fishing gear and I'm good to go. Now I just need the sailboat.

 

[partdeux]

I'm already screwed, no friends, no secure perimeter, limited water. Plenty of food and ammo, but no real survival skills.

 

[trip286]

Honestly, if I have everything on my wish list, I can hold out indefinitely.

If I can make it to my bug out location, 6 months to 6 years, depending on the variation of possible unforseen circumstances.

Realistically, with what I have right now at my home, a few days. And I would likely have to depend on raiding, which could cut my time VERY short.

 

[Dillinger]

Right now? I've got three to five days unless things go incredibly my way.

An honest response, which is what I was hoping for. Thanks Pagj! *respect*

I think you need to evaluate these things and have a Plan B or even down through Plan G, because while Zombies are probably the least of your worry, that doesn't mean the next big Katrina type incident isn't likely in your lifetime.

We have Mt. Rainier in my backyard, basically, that is OVERDUE for an eruption. Luckily we bought on a big hillside overlooking a valley that will probably be awash with molten hot, liquid magna. LOL

If that happens the ash cloud is supposed to be dense enough to choke the life out of most of the Puget Sound, so all the food stores & fresh water in the world aren't going to help much if we can't breathe.

One thing I am looking at is a diesel vehicle so we can exit stage right should that happen. The roads East are going to be packed, but at least we will be able to get there.

Anyone else want to offer up some things you are looking at adding/improving in the future to help your cause?

JD

 

[Dillinger]

Thanks for the responses guys!

Sailboat and fishing gear and I'm good to go. Now I just need the sailboat.

In the event of anything short of a Katrina like storm I expect the harbor will be filled with a ton of prospects for you to 'appropriate'.

I'm already screwed, no friends, no secure perimeter, limited water. Plenty of food and ammo, but no real survival skills.

And with this realization you now have a short, concise roadmap towards some things to work on.

In the survival section there was some threads that were titled "Caveman Course' or something. It was a set of basic knife skills that we started a few years ago but it kind of died on the vine. In spite of that, there was some REALLY good information there about starting a fire, cooking without a stove and some other skills that you might want to check out.

Honestly, if I have everything on my wish list, I can hold out indefinitely.

If I can make it to my bug out location, 6 months to 6 years, depending on the variation of possible unforseen circumstances.

Realistically, with what I have right now at my home, a few days. And I would likely have to depend on raiding, which could cut my time VERY short.

Can you get to your BoL in any weather? Do you have a vehicle that can run in any extremes? Or a horse?

Raiding. Good call. I have pretty much resigned myself to the fact that my group will need to raid stores and shops with food and basic supplies early and hope for the best. Waiting until the 3rd or 4th day and you could be walking into a hornets' nest of people who converted the local Piggly Wiggly into their personal castle.

JD

 

[rjd3282]

Some of us will be screwed no matter how much water and food we have. I need heart medicine. If things stay bad for much more than months I'm SOL unless I can raid a pharmacy.

 

[vincent]

If something were to happen right this moment, I'm ska-rood...unless the 'C' in LCR stands for cheeseburger...

Anyone know a good recipe for .22 stew? That I have plenty of...

My prep list has been streamlined to bare essentials but not nearly enough checkmarks as of now...a month or so when things may or may not fall into place, It'd be a better situation...but yeah...

I'm an inclined plane wrapped helically around an axis...

 

[Marlinman]

Thanks for the responses guys!

In the event of anything short of a Katrina like storm I expect the harbor will be filled with a ton of prospects for you to 'appropriate'.

And with this realization you now have a short, concise roadmap towards some things to work on.

In the survival section there was some threads that were titled "Caveman Course' or something. It was a set of basic knife skills that we started a few years ago but it kind of died on the vine. In spite of that, there was some REALLY good information there about starting a fire, cooking without a stove and some other skills that you might want to check out.

Can you get to your BoL in any weather? Do you have a vehicle that can run in any extremes? Or a horse?

Raiding. Good call. I have pretty much resigned myself to the fact that my group will need to raid stores and shops with food and basic supplies early and hope for the best. Waiting until the 3rd or 4th day and you could be walking into a hornets' nest of people who converted the local Piggly Wiggly into their personal castle.

JD

Me and a few ex military-mostly spec ops guys retired will get together and anyone that I KNOW can join us. We have it all pretty much figured out. We have mres out the wazzoo. Fresh water we can handle because there is 4 fresh water springs around. We have 3 big solar panels for power plus a wind mill one guy brought out from someplace in Nebraska. As to guns and ammo-i think we got that covered since the Shop is right in the middle of the area. plus all the guns each person brings. Fresh green food we can handle w the garden. As to meat......that will get chancey after a few months. Raiding......well that several of the guys specialty of you catch my drift defense is easy for us since a) we have hellacious fields of fire b) there is 2 very VERY good shots at long range including me c) we have all close combat veterans d) we have booby traps all ready to go....just needs to be armed. All get checked monthly for repair. I think we got it good if that area goes down we have plans kinda similar for another area w double and triple plans on how to get to the other area.

 

[Dillinger]

Some of us will be screwed no matter how much water and food we have. I need heart medicine. If things stay bad for much more than months I'm SOL unless I can raid a pharmacy.

I have meds I take daily as well, and that is a concern. Luckily my health care is set up with 90 day supplies via mail, so each time I get a new shipment I syphon a few off and put them in a labeled zip-loc bag. It's not a great amount, but if I stagger the dose and don't try to run around like He-man, I should be okay for the first month.

Raiding is again something that I think needs to be planned at the earliest you can safely do so. Someplace that has food and medical supplies is a must. Even if you take over a Walgreen's or a Rite Aid, you will at least have access to junk food and meds.

If something were to happen right this moment, I'm ska-rood...unless the 'C' in LCR stands for cheeseburger...

My prep list has been streamlined to bare essentials but not nearly enough checkmarks as of now...a month or so when things may or may not fall into place, It'd be a better situation...but yeah...

I'm an inclined plane wrapped helically around an axis...

I laughed at the cheeseburger, then I had to break out a slide rule and my Rube Goldberg Dictionary to decipher the last comment.

This thread was designed as a way to assess what you have and what you might want to look for in coming months, so you are right on track. Sounds like you have a plan, you just need a little more time.

Thanks for the replies guys! Keep 'em coming.

JD

 

[partdeux]

I have a simple rhetorical question, if it gets to the point where we need to have a defensible perimeter, spider holes, aka mad max, how many people even want to live in that environment?

 

[Marlinman]

I have a simple rhetorical question, if it gets to the point where we need to have a defensible perimeter, spider holes, aka mad max, how many people even want to live in that environment?

Want to? Damn few. Will and gladly to survive? Alot.

 

[Dillinger]

Me and a few ex military-mostly spec ops guys retired will get together and anyone that I KNOW can join us. We have it all pretty much figured out. We have mres out the wazzoo. Fresh water we can handle because there is 4 fresh water springs around. We have 3 big solar panels for power plus a wind mill one guy brought out from someplace in Nebraska. As to guns and ammo-i think we got that covered since the Shop is right in the middle of the area. plus all the guns each person brings. Fresh green food we can handle w the garden. As to meat......that will get chancey after a few months. Raiding......well that several of the guys specialty of you catch my drift defense is easy for us since a) we have hellacious fields of fire b) there is 2 very VERY good shots at long range including me c) we have all close combat veterans d) we have booby traps all ready to go....just needs to be armed. All get checked monthly for repair. I think we got it good if that area goes down we have plans kinda similar for another area w double and triple plans on how to get to the other area.

I would definitely say you are ahead of a lot of us with what you have access to and the peeps you know. That is good. How far apart are you all? Do you work/live all in the same area or would it be a days' hike to meet up?

My hope is that people will continue to offer both pluses and minuses in their siituations to get others thinking about what might be a good course of action for them. Not everyone lives next to a hospital or has access to 15 different calibers and a boatload of ammo, but perhaps they get an idea from someone else on preps that can make a difference.

A national survey has the average household incapable of surviving past 24-30 hours with what they have on hand in the event of natural disaster! Hence the reason you have seen all those billboards and ads for 3 Days worth of supplies on hand sprouting up since Katrina happened a few years back.

In the PNW we have been fortunate enough, or maybe unfortunate enough if you weren't prepared, to see what happens when power goes out for 8, 10, 14 days.

People LOSE THEIR MINDS!! And that is just power, they will have access to things like running water and can go to stores or restuarants or even a hotel on a circuit that has power. Imagine 10,000 of your closest neighbors with no resources and a limited ability to care for themselves and a family they love in peril.

Just sayin'

JD

 

[pagj17]

I have a simple rhetorical question, if it gets to the point where we need to have a defensible perimeter, spider holes, aka mad max, how many people even want to live in that environment?

Beats the alternative...

 

[ScottA]

Honest assessment of how long me and mine could endure a SHTF scenario... not very long without some kind of social order. Social order could be better maintained in a small town than where I live right now. If I can get everything I need to my parent's place, we'd be in pretty good shape for a few weeks at the least.

The water would be my ultimate bug out plan, but I'm very short on preparations. I would like to change this in the near future, but even that would require some warning. If it's in the warm months, head to the great lakes and out the St. Lawrence. If it's the cold months, I'd have to get south. Both have significant issues.

None of the problems I see in implementation can't be solved with money. A stocked 50 footer on the gulf. A Cessna 210 at the airport. Put the major pieces in place and we'd be good indefinitely.

 

[Dillinger]

I have a simple rhetorical question, if it gets to the point where we need to have a defensible perimeter, spider holes, aka mad max, how many people even want to live in that environment?

I would guess that maybe 0.01% of the populace WANTS to live in that situation. The amount of people who would be WILLING to accept it as a way of life as opposed to death would be higher I would imagine.

I don't think anyone is truly prepared for Mad Max time. While it would be nice to beat my chest and say I am all prepared and I have nothing to worry about, the fact of the matter is, I am hardly prepared to be a lone gun against the world.

But with a thread like this my hope is that people will evaluate what they have and what they need for a short term, societal collapse like we have seen during riots and floods and earthquakes.

All of which have been very real in the past few years, just very few have been here in the US.

JD

 

[Marlinman]

I would definitely say you are ahead of a lot of us with what you have access to and the peeps you know. That is good. How far apart are you all? Do you work/live all in the same area or would it be a days' hike to meet up?

My hope is that people will continue to offer both pluses and minuses in their siituations to get others thinking about what might be a good course of action for them. Not everyone lives next to a hospital or has access to 15 different calibers and a boatload of ammo, but perhaps they get an idea from someone else on preps that can make a difference.

A national survey has the average household incapable of surviving past 24-30 hours with what they have on hand in the event of natural disaster! Hence the reason you have seen all those billboards and ads for 3 Days worth of supplies on hand sprouting up since Katrina happened a few years back.

In the PNW we have been fortunate enough, or maybe unfortunate enough if you weren't prepared, to see what happens when power goes out for 8, 10, 14 days.

People LOSE THEIR MINDS!! And that is just power, they will have access to things like running water and can go to stores or restuarants or even a hotel on a circuit that has power. Imagine 10,000 of your closest neighbors with no resources and a limited ability to care for themselves and a family they love in peril.

Just sayin'

JD

We all live w in 60 miles of the place. We would meet up in twos and threes along the way. My house is the last jumping off place. All of our preps have been built upon for bout 10 years now so I guess you could say we are a work WAY into progress. We all have the vehicles and capabilities to get there. We all know back ways in. Admittedly only me and my mentor knows the true back ways in but once we all got in those would be shown.

 

[Dillinger]

We all live w in 60 miles of the place. All of our preps have been built upon for bout 10 years now so I guess you could say we are a work WAY into progress. We all have the vehicles and capabilities to get there. We all know back ways in. Admittedly only me and my mentor knows the true back ways in but once we all got in those would be shown.

Yeah I would have to say you are WELL ahead of the curve on this one, which is good. *respect*

 

[Marlinman]

Yeah I would have to say you are WELL ahead of the curve on this one, which is good. *respect*

Thank you. I edited that since my phone didn't put that in.