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Discussion Starter #1
I am amased at how many civilians will complain about the price for transfer.
Or how many newby's will do the transfer for just a couple of dollars. The comment is usually something like, well it only cost them a couple of bucks and a few minutes of there time.
Let me explain something here that the on line shopper and the FFL transferer does not seem to understand.
Who is taking ALL of the legal risk here? The seller or the FFL doing the transfer?
Thats right, the online store doesn't give a rats *** about Who he is selling to. Been there and done that a dozen times. Some gal buys 6 Mac 10's or maybe a nice little .22, pink pearl grips for her and a crome plated .45 with gold inlays (pimp gun) for her boy freind, what ever. You talk to her and ask a few SIMPLE questions, she doesn't know what caliber they are or ANYTHING about the purchase. DUHHHHH, Straw purchase cross your mind? Go ahead and do that transfer, how the hell do you sleep at night? If that gun spills blood, it is on your hands too. The seller sleeps just fine, made his profit and isn't liable for a damn thing.
When this happens, call your BATF Agent, have him come to your shop and do the transfer. They will probabley have an arrest shortly after.
 

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I am amased at how many civilians will complain about the price for transfer.
Or how many newby's will do the transfer for just a couple of dollars. The comment is usually something like, well it only cost them a couple of bucks and a few minutes of there time.
Let me explain something here that the on line shopper and the FFL transferer does not seem to understand.
Who is taking ALL of the legal risk here? The seller or the FFL doing the transfer?
Thats right, the online store doesn't give a rats *** about Who he is selling to. Been there and done that a dozen times. Some gal buys 6 Mac 10's or maybe a nice little .22, pink pearl grips for her and a crome plated .45 with gold inlays (pimp gun) for her boy freind, what ever. You talk to her and ask a few SIMPLE questions, she doesn't know what caliber they are or ANYTHING about the purchase. DUHHHHH, Straw purchase cross your mind? Go ahead and do that transfer, how the hell do you sleep at night? If that gun spills blood, it is on your hands too. The seller sleeps just fine, made his profit and isn't liable for a damn thing.
When this happens, call your BATF Agent, have him come to your shop and do the transfer. They will probabley have an arrest shortly after.
partner, your information seems to be flawed on this. transfer fee has nothing to do with selling a firearm, just with tranfering it to the buyer. still have to go through a background check, just the same as if they bought it from the dealer it was shipped to. same 4473 form is filled out, FFL calls in the information for a background check and if it's clear, they collect the tranfer fee and release the firearm.

you really are not making a lot of sense on this at all.
 

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Im no expert but what ax^ said is correct 100%. Even when you ship to an ffl dealer, they still do a backround check. Just like if you bought a gun at bass pro, cabelas, academy etc.
 

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Discussion Starter #4 (Edited)
I don't think you got my point. The FFL doing the transfer is the one responsible for the transfer. Not the seller. Weather it is a straw purchase or not falls on the FFL doing the transfer. He takes ALL the legal risk, not the seller. So why should he do the transfer for peanuts?
 

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spacegun said:
I don't think you got my point. The FFL doing the transfer is the one responsible for the transfer. Not the seller. Weather it is a straw purchase or not falls on the FFL doing the transfer. He takes ALL the legal risk, not the seller.
We understand what you are saying.,. But as long as that person answers all the questions on the form and passes the background check then the ffl will never be involved again with that gun..

A ffl has no risk as long as they cross their t's...

If they for some reason don't pass the check and the ffl says hey give me 200 more dollars and it's yours anyways.. Then that ffl would be on the hook...
 

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Discussion Starter #6 (Edited)
Damn, you still don't get it. Even if the check goes through and you KNOW in your heart that it is a straw purchase, how in good faith could you do the transfer? You can't. It is still illegal.
 

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spacegun said:
Damn, you still don't get it. Even if the check goes through and you know in your heart that it is a straw purchase, how in good faith could you do the transfer?
Then you say I will not sell you this gun... Every business has the right to not serve a customer.. Just can't be for a racist reason... Problem
Solved...
 

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I don't think you got my point. The FFL doing the transfer is the one responsible for the transfer. Not the seller. Weather it is a straw purchase or not falls on the FFL doing the transfer. He takes ALL the legal risk, not the seller. So why should he do the transfer for peanuts?
i do understand completely. the FFL is merely in possession of the firearm and transfers the firearm when the deal is completed. he has nothing at risk. the buyer fills out the 4473 form, the FFL dealer calls it in, if it clears, he collects his tranfer fee, and the buyer takes possession of the firearm.

and how is it a straw purchase? if by chance it were, and the buyer lies about the question, how could someone find fault with the dealer? they can't because he can't read minds and has no knowledge of the buyers intentions if he lied. do you even think that people who do buy gun legally and use them in the commision of a crime tell the FFL dealer they are going to commit a crime with that firearm? if it were a straw purchase and the buyer lies about it and the dealer releases the firearm or arms to the buyer, the burden is on the buyer if they are used illegally.
 

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Damn, you still don't get it. Even if the check goes through and you KNOW in your heart that it is a straw purchase, how in good faith could you do the transfer? You can't. It is still illegal.
how could someone "know" in their heart that it's a straw purchase? now if the buyer says something that doesn't jive with the answers given, then he can refuse to release the firearm in question. he can inform the BATF and have them check it out if he suspects it's a straw purchase. then th burden of proving it's not is on the buyer.

how many firearms have you purchased? i know that over the past 30 something years i have purchased hundreds! i have sold hundreds! in the state of Texas, i can do a face to face private sale. i can sell a pistol, rifle or shotgun, any legal firearm without going to an FFL. as long as i know that the buyer isn't a prohibited person, i can sell to them. now hypothetical situation, if i know my BIL has been to prison, well common sense will tell you, i should know that, so therefor if i sell a pistol to him, it's going to be bad for me if he gets caught with it. now if this is a complete stranger, then i can't do a background check, so i have no knowledge of his prison record.

now the way i protect myself in private sales, i will only do them with people i personally know who are family or close friends. i have done them in the past with complete strangers, but i don't anymore.
 

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Discussion Starter #11
Read the first post again!!!!!!!!! You are pretty sure this person has no idea what they are buying. Pretty sure it is for a gangbanger. Yes, the woman was approved. Are you telling me that you have NO MORALS or a conscious?
It is still your responsability to prevent a straw purchase.




i do understand completely. the FFL is merely in possession of the firearm and transfers the firearm when the deal is completed. he has nothing at risk. the buyer fills out the 4473 form, the FFL dealer calls it in, if it clears, he collects his tranfer fee, and the buyer takes possession of the firearm.

and how is it a straw purchase? if by chance it were, and the buyer lies about the question, how could someone find fault with the dealer? they can't because he can't read minds and has no knowledge of the buyers intentions if he lied. do you even think that people who do buy gun legally and use them in the commision of a crime tell the FFL dealer they are going to commit a crime with that firearm? if it were a straw purchase and the buyer lies about it and the dealer releases the firearm or arms to the buyer, the burden is on the buyer if they are used illegally.
 

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Read the first post again!!!!!!!!! You are pretty sure this person has no idea what they are buying. Pretty sure it is for a gangbanger. Yes, the woman was approved. Are you telling me that you have NO MORALS or a conscious?
It is still your responsability to prevent a straw purchase.
where are you pulling this stupid crap from? don't you know they have limits to the amount of firearms that can be transfered in a certain time period?

i'll ask the question again, how many firearms have you ever purchased? do you even understand what you are talking about?

READ MY LAST POST! if the FFL dealer suspects that's it's a straw purchase, he can, REFUSE to release the firearms. if the background check clears, he has no reasonable suspicions that it's a straw purchase, then he isn't liable if it turns out it is.

do you have any common sense? are really this dense in the brain?
 

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^^
axxe55 got it right breaking it down yet again. Good job again axxe.
thank you Corey. i think this guy has thick head and mush for brains. can't seem to understand simple English.

kind of wondering whether he is some liberal anti gun nut that decided to invade the forum.
 

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thank you Corey. i think this guy has thick head and mush for brains. can't seem to understand simple English.

kind of wondering whether he is some liberal anti gun nut that decided to invade the forum.
^^
I kept checking all the new posts and it was like he kept finding things wrong with the answers you all were all giving. Like he was just trying to pick a fight or something. I just kept shaking my head and not contributing to the discussion because I saw that it was leading absolutely nowhere. haha.
 

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^^
I kept checking all the new posts and it was like he kept finding things wrong with the answers you all were all giving. Like he was just trying to pick a fight or something. I just kept shaking my head and not contributing to the discussion because I saw that it was leading absolutely nowhere. haha.
kind of hard to reason with someone when they can't seem to understand plain English. we ain't using Latin or Chinese here to explain it in. soory Corey, but i am calling it for what it is, the guy is just not playing with a full deck!

if he still can't comprehend, then someone else will have to explain it to him. i have better ways to spend my time than to argue with an idiot.
 

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axxe55 said:
thank you Corey. i think this guy has thick head and mush for brains. can't seem to understand simple English.

kind of wondering whether he is some liberal anti gun nut that decided to invade the forum.[/]

I think you might have nailed it Axxe. It sounds like he's just trying to start an argument. Asking if he knows something's wrong with the sale but he sells it anyway how would he deal with it? Seriously if the dealer in question knows something's wrong they don't complete the sale. It's called honesty and integrity, if you don't have it then please avoid guns in general.
 

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kind of hard to reason with someone when they can't seem to understand plain English. we ain't using Latin or Chinese here to explain it in. soory Corey, but i am calling it for what it is, the guy is just not playing with a full deck!

if he still can't comprehend, then someone else will have to explain it to him. i have better ways to spend my time than to argue with an idiot.
^^
I've met quite a few people like this that I do not know how they are getting away with some of the things they are doing. For example, one of my friends is a complete idiot. I know of his idiotic nature, so I do not ever, EVER, invite him to the range with me and my other shooting friends. I will never put one of my guns in his hands just from some of the dumb things he says and does. Some people just don't get it. Oh well, just keep those kinds of people away from me. haha.
 

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axxe55 said:
thank you Corey. i think this guy has thick head and mush for brains. can't seem to understand simple English.

kind of wondering whether he is some liberal anti gun nut that decided to invade the forum.[/]

I think you might have nailed it Axxe. It sounds like he's just trying to start an argument. Asking if he knows something's wrong with the sale but he sells it anyway how would he deal with it? Seriously if the dealer in question knows something's wrong they don't complete the sale. It's called honesty and integrity, if you don't have it then please avoid guns in general.
thanks Bear. exactly right you are. i have seen my gun dealer refuse sales because something wasn't right. this idiot must think all gun dealers and FFL holders are just selling guns to every criminal that walks in off the street! personally i'm thinking the guy has never even bought a gun before and just doesn't have the first clue at to the steps it takes to legally buy a gun.
 
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