This deal with the NRA

Discussion in 'Legal and Activism' started by freefall, May 26, 2019.

  1. freefall

    freefall Well-Known Member

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    I know there's a thread about this in the politics section. But it's not politics, it's the very definition of "legal and activism" and deserves a wider forum.
    I hear varying stories of what's gone on, is going on, and should go forth.
    From the NRA itself, "everything's cool, Wayne NEEDS multi-thousand $ suits, we're united and everybody else is full of it."
    From the other side, " Wayne is hosing us, he's blowing our $ to high heaven, it's torch and pitchfork time!"
    Anybody have the straight poop? I don't even know where to look for it. I have thought that Wayne is a grifter on the magnitude of the Clintons for several years, but that's just because I ask myself "would I buy a used truck from that guy?"
    At any rate, I and TLMrs are both life members, we can vote but have not a clue who's on the side of the angels. If anyone here has any insight on the issues here, I'd like to know. And I'm NOT looking for a lot of crap about "NRA SUX, you're an idiot if you belong!" If it hadn't been for millions of guys like me paying the freight all these years a lot of you scoffers would've never owned a gun.
    But it's like being an old-time democrat. They loved their country, they just thought taxes should be apportioned differently. But the grifters got control of their party, and now they don't know whether to dial 1 to defecate or 2 to go blind.
    And I wonder if maybe we as a community shouldn't come up with a message to send to the NRA. "We, the members of FirearmsTalk, representing X members feel that you should" do whatever we feel they should do. This is how activism works. We should do our part.
     
  2. partdeux

    partdeux Well-Known Member

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    BoD is subservient to the executive management. We can't depend on BoD fixing this.

    Tom Gresham, show has been a huge public supporter of NRA has been talking about the NRA and what he knows from his contacts almost weekly.
     
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  3. alsaqr

    alsaqr Well-Known Member Supporter

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    IMO: Great idea. i'll sign on.
     
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  4. freefall

    freefall Well-Known Member

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    I have been listening to Tom Gresham, but have heard no concrete ideas.
    Something needs to happen, and I am convinced must come from ground up.
    We need a Trump!
     
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  5. freefall

    freefall Well-Known Member

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    At any rate, let us kick it around. What do we want the NRA to do?
    I say:
    1) Advocate for our God-given right to bear arms.
    2)Educate the citizens of the USA in how to safely and effectively use them.
    3) Support politically those who support our right to bear arms.
    4) Heap ridicule on those who do not.
    What say you?
     
  6. PaBushMan

    PaBushMan Well-Known Member

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    Im a member of the NRA.GOA and Pa's firearms owners against crime. The more pro gun organizations we can support the better IMO. No group is perfect but all have there good deeds done too,
     
  7. alsaqr

    alsaqr Well-Known Member Supporter

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    The BOD is full of celebrities and do nothings who prefer the status quo. Some BOD members have businesses that the NRA supports with advertising.

    Formerly it took a petition with the signatures of 250 members to nominate a person for the board. That all changed a couple years ago when members supported a by laws change. Now about 700 signatures are required.
     
    Last edited: May 27, 2019
  8. kfox75

    kfox75 Well-Known Member Supporter

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    I like the overall idea Freefall, but, I see a huge issue with it, that has to be addressed. It centers on #3, and comes down to, what are our rights, and what constitutes an infringement of those rights?

    There have been threads in the past asking just those questions, and they all reminded me of asking what time it was, back when everyone wore a watch. Ask 10 people, usually, you got a minimum of 8 different answers. What is an infringement to Jim Rau may be perfectly acceptable to Chainfire, and may fall into a gray area for Dallas53, but could be SOP for Balota.

    And almost always, s*** goes south in a hurry.

    How do we go about letting the NRA, or any other 2A group, know what we want as a collective group, when we can't even get on the same page? So,me are far right, 2A alone, no other laws needed, some are at the other end, the more the better, and many of us are in the middle, looking for that Goldilocks zone, where LE and the Feds can prosecute, without it hampering the free man.

    So, with that being the case, just what do we tell the NRA, and how do we decide who is throwing away our rights?
     
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  9. freefall

    freefall Well-Known Member

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    Ergo, we need to discuss. If a bunch of gun cranks can't decide what's infringing on their right what chance do we have of convincing Diane Feinstein to leave us alone?
     
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  10. Mister Dave

    Mister Dave Well-Known Member

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    I asked the same questions around town (so to speak) and got a salad where I was looking for beef.

    Here's what I THINK I know.

    NRA is a money shovel. It's very little a legal activism organization. They file a suit here or there, but other organizations are much more litigious than the NRA (GOA, SAF, etc...).

    Shoveling money at politicians who are 2A protectors may be a good thing. You could see it as a preventive measure. If they can prevent the need to litigate then.... But it's hardly something you can quantify.

    When I look at the executive compensation at the NRA I get very angry, even more so when I hear that Wayne isn't paying for his own clothes.

    NRA-ILA can kiss my butt until that stops. I'll keep my annual membership going, but that's all.

    And they spend that annual membership pumping me for cash every other week. I have an unopened envelope from them sitting on the kitchen table right now. I just shredded the last one last week. I think they're wasting a lot if not all of my membership dues.

    Yes, I think the NRA needs to clean up its act. I'm not an Ollie fan, but I think he was onto something - something we all maybe should be concerned about.

    I read in one place that Childress was backing Ollie. If it was true (I never know what's true on the 'net) then there really is a problem. Childress will punch you in the mouth for insulting him, but going against Wayne & company isn't his style unless there is a real problem.
     
    Last edited: May 27, 2019
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  11. Mister Dave

    Mister Dave Well-Known Member

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    And about NRA executive compensation:

    Wayne LaPierre Net Worth (link)

    I'm sorry, but that's obscene.

    I can't find Kayne B. Robinson on their 2017 IRS form 990, but around page 16 the numbers are sickening. Pour through it at your leisure.

    https://www.documentcloud.org/documents/5300476-NRA-2017-990.html
     
    Last edited: May 27, 2019
  12. Dallas53

    Dallas53 Well-Known Member Supporter

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    I have to agree wholeheartedly with Kfox on this one. For the most part, there is no unity among the collective members that belong to the NRA, or any other gun rights association.

    You couldn't get ten people to agree on gun rights, as to what they should, or shouldn't be. I have seen that pretty much play out right here on FTF, as well as many other gun forums over the years.

    Lets throw in the subject of bump-fire stocks, or suppressors, or fully auto firearms. Or hell, the dreaded "assault rifle" or the deadly "high-powered sniper rifle" and you can really raise the hackles of many gun owners.

    IMO, the media couldn't have done a better job at gutting the membership of the NRA, than it's members are doing themselves.

    If the membership would pull together, and find common ground, then the attacks by the media would be meaningless, and useless and would do absolutely nothing.
     
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  13. Mister Dave

    Mister Dave Well-Known Member

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    From Only Guns And Money: https://onlygunsandmoney.blogspot.com/2019/05/the-resolution-from-nra-meeting-of.html
     
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  14. Mister Dave

    Mister Dave Well-Known Member

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    "For the time being, I think it would be prudent for disgruntled NRA members and critics like me, to back off a little and see what happens. There's nothing that a minority of the board could do to change the course of events that are on their way, and continuing to press them on the matter, doesn't help the cause. It is to be hoped that we will at least see the tentacles of Ackerman McQueen steadily untangled from all NRA business, and some significant reforms imposed on how the association deals with contractors and consultants." -- Jeff Knox

    Full story: NRAAM 2019, Full of Sound & Fury, Signifying Nothing? Recap for the Record

    Also of note:

     
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  15. alsaqr

    alsaqr Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Mister Dave found the bones in the NRA closet. While the NRA leadership waxes fat on NRA members money those same members are told the awful "liberal" politicians will destroy the NRA unless we dig deeper into our pockets. IMO: The NRA is being destroyed from within.

    La Pierre has wasted tens of millions on lawsuits, clothes, travel, propaganda and Lord knows what else. The New York state prosecutor is investigating the NRA for violations of their tax exempt status. The prosecutor is claiming the NRA played fast and loose with donated funds.

    Don't count on the NRA BOD to do anything. Years ago NRA BOD member and retired Texas Ranger Joachim Jackson jumped on TV and shilled for an "assault weapons" ban. The BOD defended Jackson until he died.



    This is the stuff that Oliver North presented to the BOD:

    https://twitter.com/StephenGutowski/status/1127050028638441472

    Meanwhile back at the NRA puzzle palace La Pierre is spending $90,000 per day on lawyers.
     
    Last edited: May 28, 2019
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  16. Mister Dave

    Mister Dave Well-Known Member

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    Let's be clear here. What's reported is not looking good, because when it bleeds it leads. I certainly could have found (and did find) some really slanted material - there's no lack of it. I tried to locate the more fair material, and that which comes from 2A advocates.

    But what we'll have a lot of trouble finding are specifics on what the NRA does right. The NRA is not very good at transparency, good or bad. I think it's because they don't want to give intel to the enemy. It was just this way in a recent meeting I read about from an eye witness. NRA chose not to discuss the kerfuffle publicly fearing that every word spoken would be amplified and twisted.

    I posted the Jeff Knox quote because I agree with it. It's time to sit back, relax and see what comes of this. North isn't the only one bringing up issues.

    I'll be paring back the donations as described above. That will be my message. Yours may be different.
     
    Last edited: May 28, 2019
  17. alsaqr

    alsaqr Well-Known Member Supporter

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    i've belonged to the NRA for 60 years. After contributing for decades until it hurt
    i stopped after La Pierre and his minions began ranting about stuff outside the NRA charter. Also changed my will, eliminating a large donation to the NRA.

    IMO: Only a membership revolt will change the NRA.

    i will keep my life membership in the NRA, that's all.
     
  18. locutus

    locutus Well-Known Member Supporter

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    A good start would be weeding out the Knox family.

    Neil Knox damned near killed the NRA years ago with his demented egomaniacal fanaticism. Time to chase off the rest of the Knox clan.
     
  19. partdeux

    partdeux Well-Known Member

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    Wayne's salary is lifetime. His pension will be over a million dollars each and every year.
     
  20. Mister Dave

    Mister Dave Well-Known Member

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    I heard that and didn't want to believe it.

    Next time you hear someone (or are someone) rightfully complaining about executive golden parachutes, remember this one.