supressor design

Discussion in 'NFA/Class 3 & FFL Discussion' started by truevil1313, Jun 26, 2008.

  1. truevil1313

    truevil1313 New Member

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    Can anyone post a sucessful supressor design for a .223. I am doing all of the BATF paper work, but my friend with the metal lathe wants to look over the design, before I send the ATF the money. I have seen pics. of the k-baffle design, but I have no measurments to go by. Will anyone help me out?
    Thanks in advance
     
  2. Dillinger

    Dillinger New Member

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    Unless you are applying for a manufacturers license, "doing the BATF paper work" doesn't allow your friend to make you a silencer. You are threading on some pretty thin ice with some people, the friendly feds, not known for their sense of humor and willingness to forgive....

    JD
     

  3. truevil1313

    truevil1313 New Member

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    I will be doing all of the work. He will just be an adviser. I have never used a metal lathe before, so I can use the advice. I dont feel like I am doing anything wrong. If I do the paper work, and then do all of the actual work, who cares who is there with me watching over my shoulder? At least that is my opinion.
     
  4. matt g

    matt g New Member Supporter

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    Yeah dude, you've got to go with an off the shelf suppressor. This thread will be deleted if it continues to appear that you're doing something illegal.

    It isn't a matter of who is doing the work. It's a matter of needing to have a manufacturer's license to make one yourself. You can't just DIY with a tax stamp.
     
  5. jeepcreep927

    jeepcreep927 New Member

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    Right on. I talked about this with Dillinger about F/A stuff a while ago. You HAVE TO HAVE a manufacturer's license to make it, and you HAVE TO maintain that license annually or you HAVE TO destroy anything you've manufactured or transfer it to a L/E agency. A class 3 alone allows you to OWN a suppressor/FA/AOW, not make one. Set aside a few (okay, a lot) of hours and check out BATFE's site for a very thorough lawyer speak explanation. In the end it boils down to what Dillinger and Matt said right outta the gate: You can't make one legally w/ out a manufacturer's license and also abiding by the stipulations of that license. And opinions don't matter when you are indicted in Federal Court.
     
  6. truevil1313

    truevil1313 New Member

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    In that case, i thank you all for setting me straight.
    I guess the next question would be, which off the shelf supressor would you all recomend? I have looked at several different ones and they seem to vary in price from $400 to $1600.
     
  7. jeepcreep927

    jeepcreep927 New Member

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    I wish I could offer some insight, but even as non-restrictive as Vermont laws are, we still can't own a suppressor. I have seen lately a lot of "new commers" to the market. Yankee Hill and Surefire are now marketing several models, along with Gem Tech, Bowers and AWC which seem to be pretty popular. From the little bit I have researched, there are a ton of options based on use, design (wet or dry) and baffle system. I never really looked into it since I can't have one. Good luck, and you're lucky to be in a state where you can.
     
  8. Dillinger

    Dillinger New Member

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    .223 right? For an AR? Or for a boltgun? I posted some pictures and a limited write up of an all inclusive AR upper that has a 10" barrel and an integrated suppressor. I don't believe it's on the market yet, but there are trial ones over in Afghanistan and supposedly one soldier has over 1,000 rounds through it without incident.

    I guess I would need to know what your intent for it is. Do you need a wet can or would a dry one work? Wet cans are quieter, but they are a bit of a hassle. Dry cans are easier to own and maintain, but not as quiet.

    Removable? Thread on or quik-connect?

    Give me a little bit better idea what you are looking for and I would be glad to point you in the right direction...

    Also, there is a fellow here named Mr. Clean. You might want to shoot him a PM because he has a WEALTH of knowledge about a lot of the available suppressors on the market. I believe he has owned, or tried, just about everything out there....

    JD
     
  9. truevil1313

    truevil1313 New Member

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    It would be for an AR. A dry can is what I have been looking at. I would just like to be able to shoot without hearing protection. At most, I would be predator hunting, so it does not have to be the most quiet one on the market. I am just looking for something that does work, easy to maintain, and does not cost as much as my AR.
    Thanks
     
  10. Dillinger

    Dillinger New Member

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    Here you go bro. Given your criteria, and what you want to achieve, here's my top couple picks:

    AAC Ranger 2 MSRP $495. It's a thread on, but it doesn't offer all the fast attach stuff that is popular today.

    AAC M4-1000 MSRP $595. This comes with a special muzzle break/flash supressor that you have to install, but once you do, this offers a Quick Disconnect Feature.

    Yankee Hill Machine Phantom MSRP $535. This price includes their flash suppressor that also offers a Quick Disconnect Feature.

    Now, those are NOT the best suppressors on the planet, but I have handled all three and I have shot two of them. They are very good, solid, sound suppressors that work. They won't break the bank and both companies stand behind their work.

    Let me know what you think of those -

    JD
     
  11. truevil1313

    truevil1313 New Member

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    Thank you so much, I have looked at two of those already.
    Thanks again
     
  12. Dillinger

    Dillinger New Member

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    No problem. I don't know what your experience level is with suppressors, so forgive me, but no suppressor is going to be totally silent. A wet can is going to be quieter, and the ones I recommended are dry cans - they will take a lot off the sound, and if you load subsonic ammo it will help, just don't expect to be shooting it in the backyard without a sound. :D

    Think along the lines of a quiet electric nail/staple gun...

    JD
     
  13. KingTiger

    KingTiger Member

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    I've got the AAC M4-2007 model that I'm happy with. It uses the Phantom flash hider for quick attach/detach, it'll also support the newer Blackout flash hider also. This one is FA rated, the M4-1000 is not. Both have a spring loaded retaining clip which ensures the can will never unscrew unintentionally, which is a very important feature in my opinion and helps ensure peace of mind. I've never seen any subsonic .223, I guess because it would just be a .22 LR then. It sounds like a .22 rifle when shooting normal .223 rounds and is close to being hearing safe. It definitely takes a large part of the super-sonic crack away and makes shooting alot more pleasureable for me.

    [​IMG]
     
  14. truevil1313

    truevil1313 New Member

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    I have had the chance to play with one while i was in the Army, so i know that they are not movie quiet on a 5.56. We did get the chance to play around with a supressed .22 as well, that was loaded with subsonics, and that WAS movie quiet.
    I live on 55 acers out in the country and I have set up a range that i can shoot out to 600 yards. I have never tried shooting that far yet, but it is set up so that i could if i want to. My biggest problem is i have one neighbor that is a little old lady, that has a dog that gets very scared of loud nosies. The dog will burry its self under her house, and then not come out for days. When ever I am going to do some shooting( more that 2 or 3 shots) i have to call her so she can drug her dog and lock it up. I would like to be able to avoid all of this, so this is why i have started looking at supressors again. I guess i will have to get one for my 7 rem mag as well.
    Thanks for everyones help and advice, i guess i need to get going on the ATF forms.
     
  15. matt g

    matt g New Member Supporter

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    The Gemtech and AWC are both pretty popular models. Being that I'm from Kalifornia though, the state has deemed that it is dangerous for me to posses such items and as such, I have no experience with either.
     
  16. Dillinger

    Dillinger New Member

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    I would personally never field a Gemtech product because the Q/A, and overall product reliability, has not been good for a long time. They are popular because they make affordable Glock suppressors and have a market name. Also, based on a side by side price comparison, you can get any of the ones I listed, with a great rep and warranty, for the same, or possibly even lower, price....

    Just info from what I have personally witnessed and handled myself...

    JD
     
  17. matt g

    matt g New Member Supporter

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    Good to know, I'll keep that in mind. Didn't Sig run the Gemtechs for a while too?
     
  18. Dillinger

    Dillinger New Member

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    I believe they did matt, but I don't believe they are currently. I just checked their website and they are only offering two models with threaded barrels, their 226 Tactical and their Mosquito line, neither one offers a suppressor with the kit, so I would suspect they are recommending a couple of brands.

    JD
     
  19. Dgunsmith

    Dgunsmith New Member

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    YHM makes a great product with a great waranty and good db reduction.

    La France is the quietest but $ 800 is the cost.

    Supressor designs are available via the US Patent office but copying the design would be foolish !

    Buy one is a good recommendation..and the safest for 223 pressures !
     
  20. THE_REPUBLICAN

    THE_REPUBLICAN New Member

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    Does any company manufacture a silencer that will fit the bushmaster 5.5'' flash suppressor?

    And from earlier- A class 2 SOT will enable you to build a silencer, and your friend could help. And I believe that you are allowed to keep anything you make that is not a machine gun after you give up the SOT (unless you built the mg before May 19, 1986) But considering that the SOT is $500/year, a crapload of paperwork, and possibly trouble-causing (If you are just doing it to build things for you and you don't have a legitimate business, like selling to LE, you will get busted for tax evasion) It is a far better value to buy off the shelf.