Shotgun in a video game

Discussion in 'General Shotgun Discussion' started by CJx, Oct 30, 2013.

  1. CJx

    CJx New Member

    182
    0
    0
    I want to discuss the shotgun in a video game America's Army:proving Grounds with you guys here on the forum, who are knowledgeable and aficionados.

    The shotgun in this video game, is, in my opinion (I would say fact), a complete joke. I have already tested the shotgun in this game (00 Buckshot U.S Army standards), and at 20 yards the shotgun will not hit a player at all with the rare exception of a single stray pellet connecting.

    At a mere 10 yards, the shotgun in this game will take approximately 10% of a players health away, meaning it takes approximately 10(ten) 00 Buckshot rounds to kill or incapacitate a player, at 10 yards!

    At about 7 yards or less, the shotgun "magically" steps back on the stage and will 1-2 shot incap players.

    This game is called America's Army:proving Grounds, and that is the kicker. This game is developed and funded by the United States Army its self.

    Players in this game defend the shotgun as I described it in above, and my question is, is this an accurate representation of what a U.S. Army Remington 870 14" Barrel 00 Buckshot shotgun would do in real life?

    Please do note that I have actually tested the distances and figures I stated above, and am not just estimating or fabricating them, that is what the shotgun really does in this game.

    *Disclaimer- I posted this in the shotgun section because I want to discuss real life shotgun ballistics vs. the shotgun in the United States Army video game, there will be no complaint from me if this topic is moved to a different section.
     
    Last edited: Oct 30, 2013
  2. Argyle_Armoring

    Argyle_Armoring New Member

    891
    0
    0
    Are your targets in the game wearing any type of body armor or just hadji's in togas?
     

  3. CJx

    CJx New Member

    182
    0
    0
    No, not in this game. All they have is a health bar that starts at 100%
     
    Last edited: Oct 30, 2013
  4. Argyle_Armoring

    Argyle_Armoring New Member

    891
    0
    0
    Well, I don't have a health bar so it all depends on what is covering your target's body.
     
  5. CJx

    CJx New Member

    182
    0
    0
    This is true. I think it's safe to say that there is nothing functioning as body armor in the game, so it's basically as if players are just wearing clothes.

    But there is the fact that the shotgun completely misses people at only 20 yards, not a single pellet will connect. I don't this this enigma directly relates to body armor.
     
    Last edited: Oct 30, 2013
  6. Argyle_Armoring

    Argyle_Armoring New Member

    891
    0
    0
    A 14" Remington 870 with a 3+1 magazine will lose a lot of it's patterning at 20 yards so yes, it is possible that only a 1 or 2 pellets would make contact with your target. I would say your effective range with the 14" 870 would be at 10 yards and closer. I'm sure some on here will disagree with me but that's what opinions are for.
     
  7. JonM

    JonM Moderator

    20,110
    19
    38
    The operatibe word is game. Its made to be playable and fun as a recruiting tool. Its not a depiction of real life weapon systems as they work. If the game was depicting real life you would only ever get one chance to play. Die in game and the server would never ever let you log back on.

    There is no depiction of the terrible wounds and decades of therapy wounded go through to recover if they ever do.
     
  8. orangello

    orangello New Member

    19,156
    0
    0
    14"? That's pretty short for regular army, isn't it? I thought they got the Mossberg with the metal trigger guard M590 or something? Doesn't it usually come with the 18" barrel good for another couple of yards on the pattern?
     
  9. CJx

    CJx New Member

    182
    0
    0
    The game description for the weapon says 14". Also orange, I do not think a 14" inch barrel 870 would lose its pattern that drastically at 20 yards, I would say more like 50 yards from the videos I've watched, since longer barreled shotguns can hit man sized targets at 100 yards semi effectively. Would the army really employ a weapon that was only effective at such a short range? That would seem to be quite a crutch if a shotgun were only effective at 10 yards.

    And seeing as the Army has access to premium ammunition and barrel chokes, and the time and resources to test the weapon system, I would think that they would have a shotgun that is effective out to at the least 35 yards, I would think 50 yards.
     
    Last edited: Oct 30, 2013
  10. Jagermeister

    Jagermeister New Member

    6,811
    1
    0
    I get a good 30 meters with my 590 Mariner with both 0 to 00 buck on paper targets. I take out fox at that max range too.
     
  11. John_Deer

    John_Deer New Member

    6,624
    2
    0
    Most people shot by a shotgun loaded with 00 buckshot in the torso inside 20 yards don't survive the encounter. You are playing a game that quite possibly could have been created by someone that has never fired a weapon. Even if the game designer is a weapons expert, it wouldn't be much fun if you are "killed" by the first shot.

    My neighbors son thinks he is weapons expert because he does quite well with video games. I brought a 22LR single action revolver for him to shoot. When the gun went off he dropped it. His tanned face was pale white. To his credit he did pick the pistol up and empty it out. He even settled down for a lesson on how to clean and care for a SA revolver.
     
  12. CJx

    CJx New Member

    182
    0
    0
    I know the lethality of a shotgun especially inside 20 meters. I'm not advocating for the shotgun in the game to be a 1 hit kill at 20 meters.

    I made a hypothetical damage scale of 50 yards- 10-15% damage, 35-40 yards 20-25% damage, 20-30 yards 40-45% damage, 10-19 yards 45-50% damage, 1-9 yards 50-100% damage, out of 100% starting health. I think that would be a far more accurate portrayal of a real shotgun while still making it balanced
     
    Last edited: Oct 30, 2013
  13. Axxe55

    Axxe55 The Apocalypse Is Coming.....

    7
    2
    0
    i think you need to go and shoot some shotguns with different loads at different distances with different lenght barrels. then you would have a more realistic understanding of how shotguns work, vs. a video game.
     
  14. orangello

    orangello New Member

    19,156
    0
    0
    I hear that bear cubs make an excellent and reactive target. :D
     
  15. Axxe55

    Axxe55 The Apocalypse Is Coming.....

    7
    2
    0
    but it's still a real shotgun!:p
     
  16. orangello

    orangello New Member

    19,156
    0
    0
    Of course, it would be cruel and torturous to use a fake one. "Bye, bye baby bear...[click]...[maniacal laughter]"
     
  17. CJx

    CJx New Member

    182
    0
    0
    Alright, well you can keep thinking that a 14" barrel shotgun would lose all its range at a puny 10 yards, and that the Army would even use such a PoS weapon... and I'll keep looking for the strange universe you pulled that idea out of :confused:

    Oh, and I'll shoot your bear any day of the week, right in the brain, first shot, (maniacal laughter)
     
    Last edited: Oct 30, 2013
  18. SSGN_Doc

    SSGN_Doc Well-Known Member

    6,926
    66
    48
    And there's the problem.
     
  19. CJx

    CJx New Member

    182
    0
    0
    I LoLd-----
     
  20. robocop10mm

    robocop10mm Lifetime Supporting Member Lifetime Supporter

    11,380
    1
    0
    With a cylinder bore barrel, OO buck will generally spread at a rate of 1"/yard from the barrel to the target. 20 yard range - 20" pattern. You shold expect at least 50% hits at that range. 14" or 20" barrel really does not matter much at all. Some of the newer "tactical" loads will do better than that. Federal Tactical OO buck will cut that pattern in half.

    Against an un-armored adversary the 14" 870 and OO buck is VERY lethal at 20 yards. Remember, the game is written with parameters set out by some Army brass who favor rifles over shotguns for combat. They do not want new recruits thinking a shotgun is superior to their M-4