re-loading

Discussion in 'AR-15 Discussion' started by johnrhino123, Aug 5, 2012.

  1. johnrhino123

    johnrhino123 New Member

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    looking for successful recipies for .223. shooting kel-tec plr-16. mostly want to drive tacks!!
    thx
     
  2. jjfuller1

    jjfuller1 New Member

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    25.1gr of h335 with Winchester 55gr fmj. Cci primer . Does good for me
     

  3. JonM

    JonM Moderator

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    depends on the twist rate of your barrel. my RRA has a 20inch barrel with a 1:8 twist and it LOVES sierra 69grn hpbt matchkings over 24 grains of varget
     
  4. steve4102

    steve4102 New Member

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    If you want to "drive tacks" then you have to pay for it. That means quality bullets like Sierra, Nosler etc. Cheap bullets are cheap for a reason and will not drive tacks. I believe your Kel-Tec is a 1-in-9 twist, so it should stabilize most bullets from 50 to 69 grains. For "driving tacks" I would suggest Sierra 53gr Match and 748, CFE223, Tac, X-t/2230 or just about any other powder that works for the 223. What I'm saying is the first thing you need to load tack driving ammo is a tack driving bullet, cheap FMJ's ain't it.
     
  5. ryguy00

    ryguy00 New Member

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    if you really want to drive tacks, forget the sierras, noslers, and hornadys. Check out what the benchrest guys are shooting. 1/10th of an inch 5shot groups at 100 yds sound more like what you're looking for? You need to be looking for barts and berger bullets. I'm warning you. Bullets are NOT enough. Properly sized to your chamber LAPUA brass, cci benchrest primers, and some vihtavourhi (spelling?) powder are gonna be what you need. Ohh, and a $5-6k rifle not counting scope will have you there. Pillar bedded and blueprinted stolle or bat action set in a mcmillan stock and piped through a shilen or kreiger barrel and topped with a fixed 36x leupold is what you're gonna be looking for. Don't forget the 2oz jewel trigger too. And you're gonna need a good rest and some sandbags too.

    It all depends on what "tack driving" means to you. Sub inch at 100yds? Half inch? Quarter? Tenth? Each has different requirements from gun, ammo, optic, and shooter in order to achieve that level of accuracy.

    I'm confident that quarter inch groups and larger can be accomplished with a semi auto if the shooter is willing to put the time and money into it. 1/10th inch is bolt action territory.
     
    Last edited: Aug 5, 2012
  6. AgentTikki

    AgentTikki New Member

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    And every barrels gonna be different, so you'll have to experiment till you find one that your gun likes.
     
  7. Txhillbilly

    Txhillbilly Active Member

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    I'm sorry,but your Kel-tec PLR-16 pistol will never be a tack driver.You can build some good tailored loads for them,but the short pistol barrel length really affects their accuracy at ranges over 50 yards.
    I've had one for several years,and have handloaded many different bullets/powders/primer combinations.If you find a load that shoot's anywhere close to 1moa you have a winner.Most will be around 1.5-2moa with these guns.
    They are very fun to shoot,but they are not a "Tack Driver" by any means.
     
  8. steve4102

    steve4102 New Member

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    Barrel length affects a lot of things, things like velocity, muzzle lift, sight picture, etc., but accuracy is not usually one of them. A quality barrel is a quality barrel short or long and a POS barrel is a POS short or long.

    Here is a little test on barrel length, Velocity and Accuracy in 223. As you can see even the shortest barrel was still very accurate. Note even cut to 10 Inches the rifle was still shooting .6 MOA.

    http://www.accuratereloading.com/223sb.html
     
  9. JonM

    JonM Moderator

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    as velocity decreases so does spin on the bullet. this means that the accuracy envelope greatly decreases as the barrel length decreases. when a bullet drops below the speed of sound it transitions the sound barrier and has a very big destabilaztion effect meaning a huge loss in accuracy when that happens. the heavier the bullet the less effect this transition has.

    so yes shorter barrels decrease accuracy but not within that barrel length's envelope
     
  10. steve4102

    steve4102 New Member

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    What is a barrel length envelope?
     
  11. JonM

    JonM Moderator

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    The distance that the round stays above the speed of sound . Yes you can hit targets further than that distance but not with any predictable accuracy. It also depends on a particular bullet's ballistic coefficent, bullet design, bullet weight, charge weight, as well as atmospheric conditions, and elevation above sea level

    Thats what is meant in military manuals as a firearm's effective range, m16 is right about 650m, m60 about 800m, m9 pistol 65m etc (im not 100% sure on the exact current effective ranges just giving examples) maximum range is the range at whicha particular firearm is capable of being fired
     
    Last edited: Aug 7, 2012
  12. Txhillbilly

    Txhillbilly Active Member

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    First off,Jon did a good job of explaining things.
    Now the weapon that the OP is wanting to be a "Tack Driver" is this-

    [​IMG]

    Not exactly the most precision made weapon in the world,and definitely not a "tack driving" quality 223.
    It is very fun to shoot,and beyond the word LOUD,ear protection is a must have with these guns.
    Shooting mine with a bipod on a bench with rear bag,I only have a few loads that will shoot close to 1 moa,most are in the 1.5-2 moa range off a bench.
     
  13. johnrhino123

    johnrhino123 New Member

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    ok thanks, guess my use of the term "tack driver" was an exageration!!!! i really dont expext this gun to sub moa at 100 yerds. maybe 25 yrd though. txhillbilly, care to share your few loads that come close? i have been re-loading for a few years mostly .44 and 9mm
    thanks all
     
  14. locutus

    locutus Well-Known Member Supporter

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    If I wanted a tack driver, first I'd buy a tack driver rifle, topped with a Zeiss or Schmidt & Binder scope. Then a bench rest loading set up including an in-line arbor type press and custom dies cut with the same reamers that the rifle's chamber was cut with.

    Then I'd start thinking about bullets. Just my $.02:p