Private Sales?

Discussion in 'Legal and Activism' started by xcoreyyyx, Jun 5, 2012.

  1. xcoreyyyx

    xcoreyyyx New Member

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    I have been thinking about obtaining some guns through private sales recently. It could be sketchy at times and I am not too sure on exact laws in the state of Maryland for private gun sales. I do not know where the red tape is and where the lines can or cannot be crossed. I know that in some instances like pistols you have to register the gun with the state police and in other instances they want you to sell through an ffl dealer. Any opinions on private sales? I feel that it would be nice to just pick up a few shotguns and rifles (maybe broken for cheap) that I could return to working order with a part or 2 and possibly keep for myself or make a nice profit to buy something that's worth my time. Thanks in advance.
     
  2. danf_fl

    danf_fl Retired Supporter

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    Selling firearms for profit without an FFL may put you in some hot water.
     

  3. xcoreyyyx

    xcoreyyyx New Member

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    It would be another private sale after I have replaced a part or 2 or just pushed it onto someone else. I am sure that it would pass in legal court if it ever went that far.
     
  4. willfully armed

    willfully armed New Member

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    And that statement clearly shows you are not a-

    Police officer
    Lawyer
    judge
    Federal agent


    You would be guilty of dealing without a license. The feds even require ameteur smiths to posess a license to be "lawful."
     
    Last edited: Jun 5, 2012
  5. mountainman13

    mountainman13 New Member

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    Typically speaking you are allowed a certain number of "transfers" or "private sales" in most states. Check the laws in your area for how many you are allowed (in ma its 4 in a year) and stay under that number and you should be fine. How much you buy or sell the gun for is nobody's business. Learn and follow the laws.
     
  6. xcoreyyyx

    xcoreyyyx New Member

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    Like I said, private sales have red tape and you don't really know where the line is drawn. With rifles and shotguns you can make a private sale (without registering through the state police) and your doing nothing wrong. If they are ARs or pistols, they want you to register the gun with the state police and certify the sale through an ffl dealer.
     
  7. xcoreyyyx

    xcoreyyyx New Member

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    Yeah, I don't think that guy lives in an area with private sales or he was just having a bad day. Either way I am looking into everything like I have before just to be sure or how many I can do and make sure always to exchange license numbers and a written statement signed just to be sure that in case anything goes wrong I will have it there.
     
  8. willfully armed

    willfully armed New Member

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    Not having a bad day, and C3, CMON!


    Corey, educate yourself. Don't be the guy that gets whacked for unlawful sales "cuz I figgered I'd be OK".

    I live in a free state, no registration, privatte transactions all day long
     
  9. c3shooter

    c3shooter Administrator Staff Member

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    Ladies and gentlemen- in addition to any STATE regulations that YOUR state may have, the FEDERAL goverment also regulates the sale of firearms.

    If you "engage in the business" of buying and selling guns, you must be licensed by the BATFE as a Dealer. This is 18 US Code, section 922.

    "Engaged in the business" means devoting time and attention to it to make a livelihood. There is NO magic number of sales that is permitted. Casual sales ARE permiited under Federal law. However, to be doing it to make an income, there HAVE been cases where the Feds prosecuted on the basis on ONE sale.

    Casual- neighbor likes my 12 g, and I never go bird hunting any more, so I sell him my shotgun. I like WW 2 guns- have an M1 Carbine. Get a NICER one, decide to sell my first one. THOSE are allowed without a FFL. If you are NOT a FFL, you can only sell to a resident of your home state, or to a FFL holder.

    E-I-T-B. I am selling beef jerky and costume jewelry at the flea market. Guy offers to sell me a Ruger Mk2 with a red dot sight for $100. I buy it, and put it on the table with a $250 price tag. The ATF did exactly that routine to an unlicensed seller. Court found he was "Engaged in the business".
     
  10. xcoreyyyx

    xcoreyyyx New Member

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    Exactly, I wouldn't be doing it for a profit. It would mainly be to grab guns for cheap for myself and probably eventually get rid of them when I cant fit anymore in my gun designated area of the house.
     
  11. xcoreyyyx

    xcoreyyyx New Member

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    Again, thanks for being concerned about how I am doing things and thank you for the info you all have shared.
     
  12. therewolf

    therewolf New Member

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    Look at it like this.

    If you were to walk into a LGS, and say to the FFL

    there "Sell me a gun." and he were to say "NO",

    for any reason, then a private purchase by you

    would probably be a BAD IDEA. IANAL, and

    using free advice from an internet, without

    being advised, prior, by legal counsel, is also poor idea...


    But, you live in Md. Maybe, as you get older, you could

    seek a living in a gun-tolerant state. I did.;)
     
  13. xcoreyyyx

    xcoreyyyx New Member

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    ^^

    Oh trust me I know what you mean by this statement. It absolutely sucks living here sometimes. Some laws are just so out of whack. I expect to get out of here shortly. Anyone got a spare room? lol:D
     
  14. JTJ

    JTJ Well-Known Member Supporter

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    If you think Maryland is bad, try California. No private sales. Every firearm goes through an FFL.
     
  15. xcoreyyyx

    xcoreyyyx New Member

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    Yeah, I have heard about that but really I do not see why people are so uptight about guns. Like if someone really wants one they will find one. I did a whole report on it for college but oh well. I like my guns and I shall never give them up.
     
  16. Vikingdad

    Vikingdad New Member

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    Yup. That's how we do it here. No private party transfers without an FFL handling the paperwork.
     
  17. WebleyFosbery38

    WebleyFosbery38 New Member

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    Boy, that just makes things too easy. Someone with the title of Elected official gets a bug up their butt and collects them all with no problem even if its not constitutional. Someone I recently met lost 700+ weapons including longarms when her dads shop was "secured" by the local Sheriffs office after his death. Took them all, locked them up and a big flood destroyed every one of them. They had legal right to secure the Pistols but not the non-auto rifles, shotguns and Muzzle loaders. She could have legally sold them herself without an FFL in NY, even the pistols once provenance was cleared by the ATF. They destroyed his entire inventory.

    They took them all and they are all ruined now and the taxpayer will pay for that twice; First to pay off the damages they caused by neglect, next they have only scrap-iron to show for it. Lastly, the pristine showpieces he had will never be owned again, just melted down into plowshares!
     
  18. wjnfirearms

    wjnfirearms New Member

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    Bottom line is that you have received good advice so far. Now, one could speculate on how you might get caught flipping multiple guns over time. It's kinda like assuming. As the saying goes, "It makes an a$$ out of you and me". Never assume that since you are a "private citizen in a free state" that you won't get caught and charged with selling firearms without a license. Here in Pennsylvania, long gun sales are not regulated. The intervention of a dealer is not mandatory for rifles and shotguns. You can go to virtually any flea market on any given weekend and see guns for sale on tables. The guys who are taking chances are the ones with multiple rifles week after week and I know they do not have an FFL. The person that is selling his Remington 700 that he doesn't shoot any more because he doesn't go deer hunting these days is safe. The guy that is selling guns over and over again is taking chances.

    What you have to consider is if the risk is worth the reward. Especially in this political climate and the fact that there are enough anti gunners out there that have no hesitation to drop a dime on people, do you really want to take the chance? Personally, I wouldn't. It sucks for sure, but maybe a reality check is in order. No offense.
     
  19. xcoreyyyx

    xcoreyyyx New Member

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    ^^
    This doesn't sound right at all for me. Normally, when a person dies their stuff goes to their children or whoever they want it to go to. All of the guns should have then put into the daughters name and she would personally own the guns (unless the dad was selling them for someone and they expected a % of the sale). Then she should have been able to do as she pleased with them. This sounds like it could be a lawsuit?
     
  20. xcoreyyyx

    xcoreyyyx New Member

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    ^^
    Thanks for the input. I wouldn't really be flippping them. I might have said that I would sell them for profits but I would probably want to keep most of them. I definitely see where you are coming from though. I wouldn't want to take a risk on it all. Maybe eventually get rid of a few that I have doubles of or dislike after I shoot for awhile but not like one after the other. Thanks again.