Patriot Act, Section 215

Discussion in 'Legal and Activism' started by Bigcountry02, Mar 11, 2011.

  1. Bigcountry02

    Bigcountry02 Coffee! If your not shaking, you need another cup Supporter

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    This was on ammoland and GOA. I can scream to New Mexico Senators & Representatives till I am blue in the face, fingers hurt from typing; but, they support the anti's cause!

    Will Congress Lay the Groundwork for Gun Confiscation?

    Will Congress Lay the Groundwork for Gun Confiscation? - Gun Owners Of America

    Within the next 90 days, Congress will vote on whether to reauthorize legislation to specifically allow the government potential access to millions of gun records (4473’s).

    Section 215 of the PATRIOT Act, which must be reauthorized soon, is of particular concern.

    This section allows the FBI to seize business records -- including the 4473 forms that gun buyers fill out. The only significant caveat is that the FBI must claim that the seizure of records is needed pursuant to “an authorized investigation.”

    But since a secret court is required to rubber-stamp the government’s request (unless it fails to make even a specious case), the FBI can easily abuse its authority. The Inspector General found that, between 2003 and 2006, the FBI may have violated the law over 6,000 times with respect to their authority under various provisions of the PATRIOT Act.

    So just imagine that it’s your gun records that have been seized. Under such circumstances, the gun dealer is specifically prohibited, under penalty of law, from telling you that the FBI has confiscated the records of your firearms purchases. Under the PATRIOT Act, any limitations on the use of the seized records shall be at the sole discretion of the Department of Justice.

    Talk about the fox guarding the hen house!

    It is imperative that Congress protect gun owners from rogue government agents who would abuse their authority to register gun owners.

    We’ve already seen the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives attempt to register gun owners recently when they tried to require certain gun dealers to report anyone who, within a five day period, tried to purchase two or more semi-automatic rifles (that are .22 caliber or greater and can accept a detachable magazine).

    Historically, gun registration has been a prelude to gun confiscation, as documented by the Jews for the Preservation of Firearms Ownership almost 20 years ago. They showed how several foreign governments in the Twentieth Century had used gun control -- and quite often gun registration -- to confiscate firearms. In each case, such confiscation was a prelude to genocide.

    ACTION: Contact your two senators and insist that any language to reauthorize Section 215 also contain language to protect 4473’s from the Obama administration’s scrutiny. You can use the Gun Owners Legislative Action Center at http://www.gunowners.org/activism.htm to send your legislators the pre-written e-mail message below.
     
    Last edited: Mar 12, 2011
  2. pandamonium

    pandamonium New Member

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    E-mail sent to my gun grabbing-rights denying-liberalarse-commie dimocrap senators. Not that it will change their socialist attitudes.

    Rep Lobiondo is pretty good, not super great but in NJ pretty good is ok with me! Thanks for the heads-up Bigcountry!
     

  3. ballfan4141

    ballfan4141 New Member

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    the nra will never allow the goverment to take away out right to own guns. but we are all good people on the forum and now might have to pay because of those who are not.
     
  4. 556plinker

    556plinker New Member

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    Big deal, so what? The gov't knows what type of arms that I have, they know what I have in my bank acct, they know my date of birth, soc. sec. #, what type of car I drive and how much I make on a yearly basis. If they want em, come and take them. I applaud this because it brings us one step closer to settling the 2A issue for millenia. Don't be scared my fellow gun loving totin Americans we shall prevail. I say ban' em all tomorrow and lets see whose got nuts? Got Nuts?
     
  5. JTJ

    JTJ Well-Known Member Supporter

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    The NRA is not an armed militia. They can only help get pro 2A legislators elected, lobby and work the courts. If emergency powers were invoked and the Constitution suspended, the NRA officials would probably be the 1st ones arrested. The big question is whether the military would go along with it and fire on American Patriots.
     
  6. bkt

    bkt New Member

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    I got nuts. And while I'm not itching for a fight, I sure would like some resolution instead of continuing this stupid game of giving-and-taking individual rights.
     
  7. anm2_man

    anm2_man Member

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    Plinker has it square on. They already know much about everybody. The key is "When they use their new found power !" Thats when our reaction will be important.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Mar 13, 2011
  8. Yunus

    Yunus New Member

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    I'm a bit confused. Has this been something in the Patriot act since 2001 or is this something new?

    /I'm against it either way, just curious
     
  9. Bigcountry02

    Bigcountry02 Coffee! If your not shaking, you need another cup Supporter

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  10. 06ranger

    06ranger New Member

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    Letter sent to my senators and hopefully they listen because i just recently purchased my 9mm pistol, and ar-15 and really don't want to have to give them up because they are scared about thugs who don't care about the law and assume everyone who owns/carries a gun legally is going to turn on the united states government
     
  11. AIKIJUTSU

    AIKIJUTSU New Member

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    We've got to keep working on sending 2A supporters to Congress and the state legislatures. Hiding a Glock 22 under the mattress and trying to use it when they drive a tank thru your house is not going to be much help. Also, some of the loudmouth macho hero's who don't even bother to vote might give some consideration to actually doing something, like investigating the candidates' voting records and vote for the right ones.
     
  12. fudo

    fudo New Member

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    when I was in the military, I thought that the best way to protect my country was to work for the government. I served to keep guys like obama & Co. out of our country. Now I believe that opposing the government is the best way to protect my country. It just about breaks my heart.:(
     
  13. bkt

    bkt New Member

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    Well, if you're a fan of individual liberty and free-market capitalism then opposing the government we have today (at all levels) makes sense. Our system of government works great as long as the electorate has some understanding of things. They don't.
     
  14. mkett39

    mkett39 New Member

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    It is funny (not ha ha ) That this gov. we have today talks about supplying weapons to the rebels in lybia to fight for their freedoms but want to disarm us and take our freedoms.

    The BATFE allowing weapons to be purchased and cross the border to mexico for the cartels to kill people and try to blame the american gun dealers.

    Barrack
    Arming
    Terrorist
    Foreigners
    Everywhere

    Our country is going down the sh!tter.

    This is something I heard one day. I was standing in line waiting to buy my wifes cig's and my chew. (recently passed law that we as a people cannot get our own tobacco in the smoke shop--employees have to go get it) Someone mentioned how crazy this was and a lady said," I don't mind it doesn't bother me."
    I replied "It is that right there that allows our government to keep taking our rights away because someday it will be something you do care about but it will be to late."

    That is the biggest problem with a whole host of people is they just go along with whatever is decided for them. It is sad really sad.
     
  15. AIKIJUTSU

    AIKIJUTSU New Member

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    The so-called "Patriot" Act is an unconstitutional "proclamation" to allow the federal gov't unlimited authority to do surveillance on anybody and everybody without a warrant. It is not keeping U.S. citizens safe from anything. It is designed to keep a corrupt government safe from its citizens.
     
  16. mes227

    mes227 New Member

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    The two Patriot Acts were the biggest affront to our Constitutional rights since martial law was declared 70 yrs ago, yet it's the darling of many Republicans. They're part of the reason that I am now registered Independent.
     
  17. opaww

    opaww New Member

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    I am against the Patriot Act, it reeks to much like Nazi Germany when Hitler was giving unlimited power to his SS and gustapo
     
  18. alsaqr

    alsaqr Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Right on.

    How in hades can an a law that allows warrantless searches of ones home and allows folks be jailed for years without charges be constitutional?

    "Patriot Act" my butt. It's feel good crap whose real purpose is to spy on Americans.
     
    Last edited: Apr 18, 2011
  19. Brie

    Brie New Member

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    The vote...

    I'm doing a paper for school on how Section 215 is effecting libraries and was surprised to see gun owners aren't real happy with it, either (to put it lightly).

    after reading the discussion, I have two questions. And please, I am NOT asking these to start an argument; this is to clear up some ambiguity on my part.


    According to the vote a larger percentage of Republicans voted for the extension than did Democrats. This coupled with the fact that the Patriot Act was started under the Bush administration, why are people blaming the Democrats/liberals? One person said he is no longer a registered Republican, but what about others?

    Thanks!
     
  20. opaww

    opaww New Member

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    It is not an issue of Republican or Democrat, But rather who has the power and can controll American Surfs