New Bushmaster issues

Discussion in 'AR-15 Discussion' started by BWGRP, Mar 29, 2011.

  1. BWGRP

    BWGRP New Member

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    I just purchased a new Bushmaster XM-15 A3 upper. I went to sight the rifle in and at 25 yard I had to move the rear peep sight almost all the way to the left to hit the center of the target, probably 12 to 14 clicks. I thought this was pretty crapy so I did some research on the net and discovered this is a common problem with Bushmaster Rifles. Any way I called Bushmaster and they are going to have me send the Rifle back (they are paying to ship it) and they will re-index the barrel and fix the problem. Just a post in case some one else has the same problem. I am new to the AR platform gun so I have plenty to learn. Sound right to everyone?
     
  2. JonM

    JonM Moderator

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    not terribly common but it does happen. 20 years ago most companies used to test fire all weapons but it doesnt happen so much anymore. they would rather deal with the occasional return than the expense of testfire in some cases.
     

  3. mjkeat

    mjkeat New Member

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    Here I go again, lol.

    It depends on the company you buy from. My DD, Noveske and Spikes were testfired from the factory. BCM tests fires there rifles as well.

    Id tell them to keep it.
     
  4. IGETEVEN

    IGETEVEN New Member

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    Same as with RRA's, they are test fired as well from factory before sell. Good luck with the Bushy, they can be hit and miss at times, here lately though, more miss than hit. YMMV
     
  5. Quentin

    Quentin New Member

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    My DD and ArmaLite uppers both were test fired but with a stripped upper I don't know if they worry much about the sighting. The AR came with its own BCG while the DD was bought without one so I was surprised they test fired it.
     
  6. mjkeat

    mjkeat New Member

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    W/ the prices of BCMs Id return it and start over.
     
  7. 7point62

    7point62 Lifetime Supporting Member Lifetime Supporter

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    I think they've still got their ACR recall going on. Sorry to hear about problems with the XM15.
     
  8. pioneer461

    pioneer461 New Member

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    Hard to test fire an upper. Any machine that is made can slip past the QC folks at the factory. None are immune from an occasional lemon. Give them a chance to make it right, they want to keep your business.

    I also bought a Bushmaster XM-15 upper, for my frankengun, and it has been flawless from day one.
     
  9. mjkeat

    mjkeat New Member

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    Its very easy to test fire an upper however very few take the time to do it. Refer to the companies listed previously in this thread. Just like staking or just simply assembling a rifle properly. It cuts into profits so many refuse to do it.

    An occasional lemon is fine and expected from time to time. Some just have way more than others. When your QC is suspect (due to cutting into profit margins or just plain not caring) you're bound to have an orchard.

    A $600 rifle from some of these lower quality brands wouldn't be that bad. The thing is most of them charge just as much for their stuff as the more reputable places do. Theres a very reputable company that at times sells rifles for less than, and often in the same price range as you can get a lesser quality rifle for.

    If I can get a professional quality upper for $399 why go anywhere else?

    I would venture to guess your BM was around that same price.

    Ill echo something I found very smart. Flawless can be many different things. Flawless for 100 rounds, flawless for 10k over the last 10 years, and flawless through multiple 2k 2 day carbine class. Get what fits your needs. Not everyone attends multiple classes a year. I don't. But at the same time if I can purchase a rifle capable of extreme hard use at the price of a range weapon I'm going w/ the first option.
     
    Last edited: Mar 31, 2011
  10. bikemechanic53

    bikemechanic53 New Member

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    I had the same problem with one I bought in Jan. Bushmaster also told me they would fix the problem and emailed me a Fedex label.

    I sent the upper to them. They refused the shipment, so Fedex dropped it off at my mailing address. I've had it reshipped to them. But there is no longer any customer support. No phone support and no email responses. So I don't know if they have it, refused it, or threw it away..

    So I'd be very cautious about sending anything to them at this time. I'm not sure if I'll get my upper back or not, since they don't respond to anything.

    Tom
     
  11. mjkeat

    mjkeat New Member

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    If true this is absolutely ridiculous. How long until people stop supporting a company like this?
     
  12. Quentin

    Quentin New Member

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    That's inexcusable but it's not the first time I've heard such a thing about Bushmaster. No doubt it's partially due to closing the Windham, ME plant and moving. But you'd think they'd have learned something after they closed the Lake Havasu, AZ plant. A guy returned his Carbon 15 about that time and it got packed up and moved to Maine so it took many months for him to get it straightened out. At least I think he got it back. :eek:
     
  13. BWGRP

    BWGRP New Member

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    Results ?

    Thanks for the replies. Bushmaster has reported to me the barrel needs to be re-indexed. I agree this is kind of irritating. They are supposed to send me a label and ship the gun back to them and they will fix it under warranty. I read earlier that someone just sent the upper back. Does anyone know if thats what they will have me do? I will say that Bushmasters customer service has been great so far...... Time will tell for sure. This is a lesson to do more research before purchasing. I thought I did enough, guess not.
     
  14. jeminyned

    jeminyned New Member

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    My BM Upper (sittin on RRA Lower) is like that too, Dammit! How much trouble would it be or what is involved in changing-out just the barrel with one from a more reputable manufacturer?? Does head-spacing have to be done? Any answers will be greatly appreciated.
     
  15. ktmboyz

    ktmboyz New Member

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    A friend of mine got the same rifle this year late jan if I recall, his had the exact problem. He returned to our ffl and got a NIB 20" target rifle that was ok. I have also heard from a firearms inst that purchased a lot of rifles from bushmaster for their dept and had problems with over half of them. Most had loose barrel nuts or not aligned correct, some had gas issues with short stroking malfunctions, Needless to say they were not impressed. With all these problems croping up I would say the BM quality has gone to S**T
     
  16. Sniper03

    Sniper03 Supporting Member Supporter

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    Unfortunately not uncommon! This is a result of first of all not testing rifles before they are packed and shipped. And also quality control at the facility. Not properly fixturring the front sight assembly with the Index Pin when drilling and installing the front sight housing. In addition when they speak of re-indexing the barrel. It usually constitutes striking the front sight housing with a raw hide mallet. To move the front sight assembly slightly one way or the other. For example one company that will remain unmentioned at this point in the past sold 65 each ARs to a Sheriff's Department and 56 of them had the same problem you mentioned in fact about 20+ of them was unable to be sighted in at all due to the fact they did not have that much windage adjustment. And the aperture was clear over to the right against the Rear Sight Aperture Housing. The company did fix them using the Malatizing procedure mentioned above. I later found out they had sent well over a thousand plus rifles out with the same problem in the same time period. So for some this is a continuing problem. Which in this situation I was contacted by the Range Master at the Sheriff's department who had received a letter that there was not that much wrong with the rifles but they did make the necessary adjustment. The Sheriff wanted them sent to me for evaluation since he wanted to know what was going on. They had used the mallet method to adjust. I pulled the barrels off of the samples (10 each) and found the aluminum square slot in the upper receiver where the index pin goes had the aluminum flowed to one side due to the strike on one side of the front sight assembly. They did correct the problem! But the technique did not set well with the agency. I understand now some of those companies may be possibly making a radius half moon cut instead of the square slot for the index pin so they can adjust them as mentioned above and no one can tell they struck the front sight since there will be no visible sign? Not to mention this same company had frequently put rifle front sight housings on carbine rifles causing an elevation adjustment problem. In these cases the Front Sight Post almost unscrews completely out of the Front Sight Housing and you still do not have enough adjustment to bring the point of impact down. I addition some have a problem with the lack of staking on the carrier keys and over sized gas ports. I hate to bad mouth any company but as Quentin stated there is no excuse for this type of quality no matter what company it is. I have a friend who has been sent there to correct the issues mentioned above and I assure you he will!. And as mentioned there have been some significant changes in that portion of the industry.

    03
     
  17. Quentin

    Quentin New Member

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    Malletizing procedure... I've got to remember that one! Gives me an image of technicians with mallets chasing around a bunch of bushamsters! Kinda like WackaMole... :D Sorry, couldn't help myself. :p

    Sniper03, thank you for that detailed information. If that kind of crap happens to LE shipments then no wonder civilians get problem guns too. Only thing is so many slap on a RDS and don't see the alignment problem until later.

    You don't have to say who the second manufacturer is but I suspect ArmaLite, DPMS or Bushmaster since they routinely use the A2 height FSP on flat tops instead of F-marked FSBs. I had to buy a Bushmaster taller front sight post for my ArmaLite to solve the problem of the factory front sight unscrewed enough to wobble around when zeroed at 50 yards. A lot of people don't know they have that problem until they replace their commercial height rear sight with a standard height model.

    Sad that some manufacturers ironed out these problems long ago yet too many companies follow along blindly, even making the same mistakes or not using quality assemblers.


    ETA:

    Quick fixes that one LE dealer routinely performs on Bushmasters: http://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=13532
    I imagine he'd send back barrels that need reindexing.
     
    Last edited: Apr 3, 2011
  18. jpattersonnh

    jpattersonnh Active Member

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    That is really too bad. In the 1990's I bought a BM DCM because of the accuracy and qaulity. I paid big money back then, but it has been stellar all these years. We are talking standard A2 DCM as the A3 did not exist.
     
  19. BWGRP

    BWGRP New Member

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    Huh

    Is this re-indexing something that a decent gun smith or armorer can perform? I am still waiting for the return label from BM, WISKY TANGO FOXTROT if you know what I mean. If I could have this fixed local I would rather do that. This will of coarse cost me but I don't know if I want to send my rifle to those hacks. Any one know?????????
     
  20. WoodysKJ

    WoodysKJ New Member

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    By definition you trusted them enough to buy the gun, they should be able to do the work on it. How can the same guys become HACKS after you purchased the gun? The company screwed up by not test firing. Make them make it right. Don't buy from them again, but make this right.

    I would send just the upper, not the whole gun. You have shot this and it does function properly, just shoot around corners, right? so why send the lower? Unless they require it for the SE# and the warrantee.

    This should never have happened, but since it has I would make them pay for every part of making it right.