Need Some Help Here!

Discussion in 'Legal and Activism' started by Vikingdad, Jan 6, 2013.

  1. Vikingdad

    Vikingdad New Member

    14,922
    0
    0
    I have been going back and forth with this "friend" of mine over gun control. Prior to Sandy Hook he has been a good friend, but now the gun control debate has caused a rift. I'm OK with cutting ties, but he does offer a good debate and I am short on some hard facts regarding NRA demographics. All I can offer if personal experience rather than statistics etc., I went to the NRA.org website and did a search but nothing came up on membership demographics. Here is the most recent of his contributions:

     
  2. Vikingdad

    Vikingdad New Member

    14,922
    0
    0
    Now, personally I know many people who are wealthy (one of my regular E-trap partners shows up at the range in his Ferrari every Wednesday), some of my regular shooting buddies are artists (my best and closest friend and his wife are well known artists, she is internationally acclaimed in her area- she has taught her art all over the world), millionaires, doctors (one is a black, millionaire neurosurgeon who also has a Phd and another is a Jew, doctor and lawyer who is married to a Chinese national!!) , physicists (one of my regular shooting buddies is a physicist) and even surfers (I don't shoot with my brother very often, but he is a 2A supporter and an avid surfer- all of his kids are avid surfers- and my brother is a doctor!) or organic farmers (yours truly) etc.. It is almost eerie how he points out those specific types of people!
     

  3. TankTop

    TankTop Well-Known Member Supporter

    2,473
    49
    48
    How many people are members of any organization, I'd like to know how many people belong to the NAACP and pay dues? At the end he mentions a couple professions that somehow make us great, what an arrogant sob, what about the majority of people who get up every morning and go to a job they hate to support their families! FACT, gun ownership is primarily by white people, most cars are also white??? Most speeding tickets are written to white automobiles, most of America is also white!!! This guy is taking a bunch of arbitrary facts and attempting an argument by stringing them together. Why don't you ask him what percentage of people are on government assistance vs gun ownership. Tell him to go put his energy into something that has meaning and not to go after one of the largest demographics by percentage followed closely by poverty...
     
  4. paintsplat

    paintsplat New Member

    264
    0
    0
    I know a doctor that hunts, and has a ccw, and a couple of almost millionaires that carry, several women that carry and hunt. This one sounds fishy
     
  5. ctshooter

    ctshooter New Member

    1,159
    2
    0
    I find it kind if funny how people think what they do when it suits their need. It wasn't all that long ago that swearing on tv was an absolute no no, but now it is rather common place, and those that support the 1st said yay. Then thing progress and porn is now for all intent and purpose main stream, and video games have moved from pong to call of duty and now those same people that cheer for the 1st amend. Point their fingers in disgust.

    Bottom line is people are people and we all have different views on things, and you are never going to change his mind on the 2nd amend. But remind him that if you start playing with things like the amendments it becomes a slippery slope and soon all will be on the chopping block.

    Just my 2 cents
     
  6. robertb6112

    robertb6112 New Member

    451
    0
    0
    Hunter s Thompson was a writer that owned guns, and Ted nugent is a musician that owns guns haha. There prolly not good examples
     
  7. Vikingdad

    Vikingdad New Member

    14,922
    0
    0
    This is part of my reply

     
  8. Vikingdad

    Vikingdad New Member

    14,922
    0
    0
    And here is another one of his rants:

     
  9. c3shooter

    c3shooter Administrator Staff Member

    21,448
    566
    113
    As you are aware, your acquaintance is fact shopping to support his argument.

    Has there been a shift in demographics in the US? Yes- but it is urban vs rural. While folks that live in the "downtown" areas may be gun owners, it is not like the country where the majority of houses have at LEAST one gun.

    In reading through what you posted, my biggest concern is the elitist attitude that realy shines brightly. So the folks that matter are "artists, writers, thinkers and musicians".

    That right there is a large part of the problem. Yes, I dove hunt with doctors. I target shoot with folks that could buy and sell me out of petty cash (and I am well over the poverty level) But he seems to feel comfortable directing how other adults can spend their earnings, huh?

    He should remember that attitude the next time the toilet backs up, and he needs a plumber- or a carpenter, electrician, a mechanic, etc. Be sure to discuss that with the person that is turning a wrench. Might be a good idea to wait for them to put down the wrench.

    The company I work for has over 100 civil engineers on staff. They may not make our country "great vibrant and prosperous"- but they come in real handy to keep bridges and buildings from collapsing- so that the intelligentsia can drive their eco-friendly vehicles down to have a barrista make them their favorite coffee.

    In the meantime, the Aurora theater shooter and the Clackamas Mall shooter were both college students. Ask the person if perhaps we should correlate colleges to a threat to the US. Yes, it is silly- so are his postulates.
     
  10. c3shooter

    c3shooter Administrator Staff Member

    21,448
    566
    113
    Sorry- forgot to make an observation-

    Since they feel that gun owners are a minority, then he is expressing that only the rights of the MAJORITY are to be preserved. The rights of a MINORITY are.... unimportant? Immaterial?

    Rather cheesy attitude there...........
     
  11. TankTop

    TankTop Well-Known Member Supporter

    2,473
    49
    48
    Actually that is the very reason we have a bill of rights, so that the majority cannot vote away the rights of the minority.
     
  12. ScottA

    ScottA FAA licensed bugsmasher Lifetime Supporter

    7,141
    0
    0
    That first post just simply didn't make any sense. He's got you running down a bunny trail that has nothing to do with the issue.
     
  13. Jpyle

    Jpyle New Member

    4,828
    0
    0
    Agreed, your friend is engaging in an Alinsky type method that sets up a straw man argument that most NRA members are rural, white, conservative, uneducated Bible thumpers ( sound familiar) then sets about to argue how they are out of step with emerging demographics of the country AND he sets up gun ownership as being equivalent to being a slave owner. He of course has no facts to support this conclusion but I am sure he would spout the same horse**** to describe the Tea Party, a lie that has been dispelled in print numerous times.

    The objective of this style of dishonest argument is to invent a fictitious opponent and present that opponent to the general population as being worthy of ridicule, persecution and eventual elimination from society. Hitler did it with the Jews, Stalin did it with the Ukraine, Pol Pot did it with Cambodia, now the left is trying it against gun owners, conservatives in general will be next. Google Cynthia Chase in New Hampshire.

    Just a couple of observations:

    Your friend compares the NRA membership to the entire US population, not to the adult population...kinda dishonest.

    His list "contributors" includes millionaires. Well millionaire is not an occupation, what if the millionaire made his money selling guns?
     
    Last edited: Jan 6, 2013
  14. Vikingdad

    Vikingdad New Member

    14,922
    0
    0
    More from him. I am no longer going to protect his identity. Have at him if you like. I am getting worn down. It should be known here that he is a recent immigrant from France.

     
  15. TankTop

    TankTop Well-Known Member Supporter

    2,473
    49
    48
    image-2192604666.jpg

    Enough said, you just can't fix stupid
     
  16. Vikingdad

    Vikingdad New Member

    14,922
    0
    0
    Check this out- just tonight.

    ZING!!
     
  17. Jpyle

    Jpyle New Member

    4,828
    0
    0
    And by bad form I mean F*&k you. :D Your friend is unfortunately sounding like an obnoxious ******* who doesn't have time for the unsophisticates in fly over country. He has his head up his azz and is convinced of his own moral superiority.
     
  18. Vikingdad

    Vikingdad New Member

    14,922
    0
    0
    But wait! There's more! These posts were stacked with no response by me in between)

    My response (and then I am going to bed)

    (Vikingdad) Karim, I have traveled extensively all over a large part of this country. I love all of it. I continue to live here not because of the politics but in spite of them. I was born and raised here. Now cut with the elitist and condescending crap like "its for your own good." I could just as easily say that the Second Amendment is "for your own good", but that would be condescending and I wouldn't stoop to that level. You were the one who invited me to "go away", I did not. I was the one who said it was bad form for you to say it.
     
  19. Vikingdad

    Vikingdad New Member

    14,922
    0
    0
    Another insane rant from Karim:

    I would like to have a contest on the best response to this. But perhaps it would be silence.
     
  20. Mosin

    Mosin Well-Known Member

    7,450
    356
    83
    Every modern country doesn't have a constitution guaranteeing an uninfringed right to bear arms....
    Bye...