Need shtf firearm collection augment advice

Discussion in 'General Rifle Discussion' started by Scheeler1, Dec 5, 2013.

  1. Scheeler1

    Scheeler1 New Member

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    Firearm prep help

    I am in need of some advice. I am looking for some some suggestions at 2 different budget levels on what I should buy to solidify my weapons for home and person protection.

    The main scenario I am looking to prepare for is WROL (without rule of law) in protection need as follows:
    - bug in
    - protect home and family from looters, hooligans,
    - economic/currency collapse or hyperinflation
    - extended power outage
    NOTE: I will have 3 people that could be armed in a shtf scenario

    What I have already:
    Make. Model. Cal. Rounds other info
    Marlin 336 lever 30-30. 70 w/cheap 3-9x40 scope, sling tube 6+1
    Rem "model 34" bolt 22lr. 2500hv . Tube fed, iron sights, 14+1
    Rem. 1100 pump. 12ga. 450 (7.5) Knoxx stock, 18.5 barrel, iron sts, sling, 7+1
    Moss 183kb. Bolt. 410ga. 50 Long barrel w/choke, iron shts, 4+1
    Rohm RG38. Revlr 38 spc 100fmj,20 hp. holster

    My prep budget is really tight to supplement my arms...here is what I think I need:
    +1 rifle semi-auto + X ammo, thinking 22lr rem 597 w/4 30 rnd clips?
    Maybe a handgun semi-auto + X ammo, thinking an inexpensive 9MM w/2 clips?
    - more ammo? 30-30? ~100 rnds @ $120, more 410? ~100 @ $40 and 38 spc? ~100 LRN/TMJ @ $50?

    Budget 1: $500-$600
    - rifle only?
    - must consider cost of ammo :(
    - how much ammo to last 12 months

    Budget 2: I could stretch to $800-$900 if there would be a marked gain in protection value
    - rifle only or rifle + handgun?

    Finally I can spend ~60/mo on more ammo until shtf :) but what kind and cal?

    Thank you all so much in advance!
     
  2. MisterMcCool

    MisterMcCool Well-Known Member Supporter

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    A decent, new AR could be found for near $700. Used for a bit less. We don't know when the rule of law will cease; you could start with a receiver and build as your budget permits.
     

  3. txpossum

    txpossum New Member

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    I think that were you are the most deficient is in the handgun category. Buy a good, reliable handgun. I would suggest either a .357 magnum revolver -- Colt, Smith, or Ruger -- or a (and I can't believe that I, the 9mm hater) good 9mm semi-automatic.
     
  4. JTJ

    JTJ Well-Known Member Supporter

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    A house in the burbs is not defensible. A couple of Molotov Cocktails would do you in not to mention incoming rounds with nothing to stop them. You need a group, neighbors, friends or relatives to pool resources. A common community effort is what is really needed. You better start filling lot of sandbags.
    The 12 gauge is the only gun you have that is combat ready. The 70 might make a longer range sniper (300 yards is plenty). The 336 is a little hotter than an AK but does not have the fire power. A second shotgun and lots of 00 along with some slugs would be the most reasonable and useful. An AR15, Mini14 or an AK which may be over your budget although I have seen some good prices on AR's lately. You can get ammo for AR's and AK's and prices have come down. Easier to find than 22lr and 22mag right now. Handguns are harder to use than carbines or shotguns so look at long guns more than handguns. Think of the handgun as a backup not a primary. A good 22lr semi auto is always useful.
     
  5. clr8ter

    clr8ter New Member

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    Agreed, but the op didn't say he lived in the Burbs. If it were me…..I'd sell the lot, and buy the following, in this order; Hi Point carbine, used Glock, (both will take the same mags, and ammo), used scoped rifle in 308 like a Savage AXIS, used Mossberg 12 Ga shotgun, and as much AMMO for everything as possible.

    That is the cheaper list. If I had more money, I'd buy Beretta 92/96 & CX4, and upgrade the Savage, and a slightly more tweaked combat shotgun, maybe a semi. And as much AMMO as possible.

    If I was going to strip it to the bare minimum, I'd go used Hi Point, used Glock, and as much AMMO as possible. Probably in 40, maybe 9mm.

    For a year…..too much ammo isn't enough. $60/mo sounds like a good place to start. I'd go with probably 9mm, 40, 45, 12 GA, and 308.
     
    Last edited: Dec 5, 2013
  6. eatmydust

    eatmydust New Member

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    One of our fellow members just posted this site yesterday - gunwatcher.com. Go to the site, type the weapon(s) you are interested in, in the search window & find guns, prices & sellers, across the country.

    I just searched AR-15, and the least expensive fully assembled 5.56 Nato AR-15 platform I found was an EXTAR EXP 556 5.56 PISTOL @ $459.00 w/$20.00 shipping, add FFL charges and you've got a <$500 AR-15 from gunsamerica.com.

    If not an AR-15 or AK-47, I recommend another Marlin 336, in .30-30, for commonality & familiarity.

    As far as a9mm auto pistol, an S&W SD9VE, NOT SW9VE for around $350.00 is a good deal, or a Ruger P95 at around the same price. 32 round magazines are available for both of those pistols.

    If you are dead set on another .22lr rifle, go buy a Ruger 10/22, they have recently begun manufacturing their own 25 round magazines. Don't go waste your money on after market mags, apparently most are crap.
     

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    Last edited: Dec 5, 2013
  7. therewolf

    therewolf New Member

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    You have more than enough guns.

    Get water.
     
  8. txpossum

    txpossum New Member

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    I think that, considering his budget, a 30-30 is fine. I also disagree that in an home defense situation, a handgun is only a backup. There are several scenerios where I would choose a good handgun over a rifle. He has a decent rifle and shotgun; he needs a better pistol.
     
  9. John_Deer

    John_Deer New Member

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    The Inuits live in a SHTF situation all the time. One of their favorite cartridges is the 22 wmr. They take Alaskan game with the first shot 75% of the time. One of the main sources of income for the Inuits is polar bear pelts. They use a 22 wmr because it doesn't damage the pelt. They shoot the polar bear in the heart with a 22 wmr. Then they follow the polar bear until it dies. Sometimes it takes 15 minutes for the polar bear to bleed out and die. A 22 wmr puts 300 ft lb of energy on the target.
     
  10. JonM

    JonM Moderator

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    world goes to sht one of my main guns will liekly be my lyman great plains 54cal blackpowder for hunting.

    another one im counting on is my marlin 1895gbl as it is quite easy to load and functions well with blackpowder as well as smokeless. 45colt is the same way.

    ive got a great loading setup including being able to mold my own bullets.

    prolly the single best survival weapon is the ability to use a bow and arrow.
     
  11. JTJ

    JTJ Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Is this something new? Since when does Hi Point take Glock mags. Hi Point comes with a 10 round proprietary mag and there is an after market 15 round that may or may not work. Aside from being ugly it is their main drawback. The Kel Tec Sub 2000 can be configured to take several different mags but are very hard to find.
     
  12. hq357

    hq357 New Member

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    Ive never seen a hi point with glock mags I think he just made it up
     
  13. nitestalker

    nitestalker New Member

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    What percentage of the population will be attacking private homes? How many home owners will resist? If you were to live in a community of 100,000 population how many of these will be considered enemies?
    Does this mean civil police departments will be dissolved by these hordes? After professional trained police are rendered useless then untrained citizens will save the city? :confused:
     
  14. hq357

    hq357 New Member

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    Never seen the hi point carbine take glock mags I think he made that part up in a shtf situation the most important rifle. Would probably be an ar15 or ak I would go with the ar since it fires the 556 and is used by nato if **** hit the fan you'd be more likely to find 556 on a dead combatant if your rifle ever breaks or you need replacement the parts and pieces. Are everywhere if you found a full auto upper some how you can just slap it onto your lower the recoil is lighter and easier to control for women the 556 has killed since vietnam the ak is also a good option ammo is cheap and is plentiful parts and pieces may be harder to find but the ak has less moving parts that are less likly to break. Both are good then id get a 9mm since its also a NATO round. Glock would be a good choice since everyone has one if you have a little more money I suggest you get the glock 23 40 cal 40 cal is used by lots of police departments and a lot off ammo is issued in 40 so there's probably an armory inside an old police station also you can buy a 9mm barrel for the glock 23 and shoot both 40 and 9mm so you'll have 2 guns in one! Also id get a shotgun with a shorter barrel for home defense and use the other one for hunting, a mosin nagant can be had for around 120$ ammo is usually cheap and has killed lots of germans would make a great burial rifle!
     
  15. WillWork4Ammo

    WillWork4Ammo New Member

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    If I could only take 2 guns with me in a SHTF situation,it would be my Glock 17 and AR. 9mm will do the job and is much cheaper than most centerfire ammo.
    I love my Hi-Point carbine.But for a SHTF gun?No way.With only 10 round magazines available for it (Not counting the ProMag 15 round magazine,which isn't very reliable)I would have to constantly change magazines.Not that I'm slow at changing magazines,but I would rather have the AR that can hold a higher capacity.
    A AR or AK is a must for SHTF.
     
    Last edited: Dec 6, 2013
  16. Vikingdad

    Vikingdad New Member

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    Welcome to the Forum Scheeler1, stop by the introductions thread to say hello and tell us about yourself.
    We call them magazines around here, not clips. (thought I'd get that in before anybody else did!;)) but no big deal there.

    I myself don't tend to prep for a given scenario. In my opinion that can get you into a narrow focus when you really should be looking at just getting prepared for, well, whatever might come up. Around here we generally prepare for earthquakes because that is by far the most likely scenario,and pretty much an earthquake can bring on almost everything that one might need to be prepared for. Have some food that stores well stocked up get a few extra cans of everything you already have in the pantry whenever you are grocery shopping. Even if it is one can a week, over time that adds up. At some point you start rotating out the older cans and replacing with (two or three) fresh ones. Ammo works the same way. Buy two boxes, shoot one and put the other in your preps. After awhile start shooting 1 box out of stock and replacing it with 2 fresh boxes from the store.

    Extended power outages depend on where you live. Here in California where I live we can get by with a wood fire to keep us warm in the winter and for cooking. Wood works for all of that. A generator is helpful too. Be sure to have gas and to keep it fresh (same as with the canned goods and ammo- but best not store it all in the same place).

    Economic collapse? Unless you can start hoarding gold and silver you best invest in ammo. That will get you more "bang for your buck" IMO because you can trade it or use it as necessary. Gold and silver are more so you can preserve some wealth for when stability returns. Other items that are not expensive now would also make good trade items. Things like tobacco and booze. Small bottles of booze will go a long ways when none is available. In the 1989 earthquake people were drinking up everything in sight for weeks afterwards. It is particularly valuable if you yourself do not drink (or don't drink much).

    OK, on to the guns! It appears by your post that you are more or less just getting started and/or you don't really have a ton of money to spend on it. Is that correct?

    Sounds to me like you ought to focus on getting more ammo for what you already have. The 30/30 is a fine gun. I would probably want that over an AR-15 platform if I had to choose, but that is just me. On the other hand the 5.56/.223 ammo is more readily available and cheaper too.

    If you are dead set on what to get next I would replace the Rohm with a better handgun, perhaps selling it or trading it in. I am partial to Ruger in many ways, but again that is just me. A good 9 mm would probably be a good choice again cost of ammo being the main driver here. Most of my semi-autos are .40 cal Glocks. But I also have some other calibers. That having been said I am not a huge Glock fanboy myself. I prefer a good revolver actually and Ruger makes some really good ones that are quite affordable. .357 Magnum is a good choice there as you can also shoot .38 Special which is less expensive (though not as cheap as 9mm).

    Its getting late and I am rambling. I'll let someone else take it from here.
     
  17. clr8ter

    clr8ter New Member

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    Crap. You're right. I screwed that up, I did mean to say the Sub 2000. Sorry. And I did also forget about the limited availability. I should have bought the one offered to me brand new for $300 3 years ago…..
     
  18. DrFootball

    DrFootball disappointed & disgusted, But DETERMINED... Lifetime Supporter

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    What My "podcast Partner" Vikingdad Said, but I'll add a few nuggets. When Wife & I decided to move to the Great Southwest, It was just as much for liberty and freedoms as for Health Restoration. Before Buying anymore Arms & Ammo. Make sure you have a full supply of the meds you & other Family members take. Most times, if you tell your doc you need a high er dosage because of "vacation" or "extended Travel" you can manage to store some extra! Also Someone else Mentioned WATER!!! We have a two fold system. A treatment Tank with RO(reverse Osmosis) function, and we store Bottled as much as possible(out of direct sunlight, or the plastic breaks down!!!). Next: The Handgun. Most Prob. you will need two more. As TXpossum Said: a 9MM & a 357, which will allow you to practice with 38 Spl. rounds. if you say that "three" of you will be armed, you each need a Handgun. As for what your budget can handle, search around for deals on Used but Good to Very Good condition Handguns. At the Last Gun show I attended, I saw someone walk out with 3 Browning HP copies(I think from Israel) for $750. You should be able to get a Ruger P95 for $300 or less... The 22LR Rifle: I also agree with My Man EMD, if your getting a Ruger 10/22, try and stick with the Factory BX25 Mags from Ruger. They also make a "triple" 10 round loader for the standard rotary mags. Also, the New Ruger American Rimfire Bolt action takes 10/22 mags. and can be had for a reasonable price. Also, Mossberg 702 is a decent semi-auto 22LR rifle, and CDNN makes 25 rounders for it, that are reasonably reliable. Out of the 4 I have 3 run perfectly, the 4th runs,..but won't feed without a FTE (failure to eject) if the mag is full,..so that one gets "down" loaded to 20 or 22 rounds. DO NOT BUY the Mossberg 715-718 AR-22 clone...you do not want this Gun. Everyone I know who has one has "issues." If your going to get a Dedicated 22LR AR Gun get the S&W MP-15-22! The extra $ will be well invested. Best of luck, glad to have you aboard! Please check out our Podcast.
     
  19. austin92

    austin92 New Member

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    Never seen a rem 1100 "pump"
     
  20. chloeshooter

    chloeshooter New Member

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    geez I hope you don't spend too much time worrying about this, as it's a better bet you will either win the lottery or get hit in the head with a meteorite. that said, I'll play along

    you need a rifle that can be effective for long distances as well as short. Your 30/30 is only good out to about 200 yards; get a .30 caliber such as 30-06 or .308. That way you can disable vehicles as well as protect yourself in a larger perimeter. A 30-06 can take out a car engine at 300 yards, as well as take out bad guys from as far as you or your scope can see, basically. You can also get yourself a couple of Mosin Nagants and a boatload of ammo for less than $500. Heck get the carbine version so the noise and fireball scares away the 'bad guys'.

    if you think you can hold out for a long time against a group of armed folks intent on taking you down....you can't. you can buy time perhaps to get the heck out of dodge, but if you have no survival training all you will end up doing is using your weapons to take food from other people, once you get painful hungry. you don't want to be that guy. especially in my neighborhood :p