need a safe- what do you guys think

Discussion in 'General Rifle Discussion' started by moneymaker17, Mar 24, 2011.

  1. moneymaker17

    moneymaker17 New Member

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  2. therewolf

    therewolf New Member

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    If you can get a scrummy POS gangbox cheap, it won't look like you

    have guns locked up in a shiny, clean, new safe.

    OTOH, there's a few inexpensive safes out there, I'd go for something which is affordable to you, but able to hold more than you already have, to
    make room for new acquisitions...:D
     

  3. Jesse17

    Jesse17 New Member

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    My thinking on gun safes is a locked closet is as good (or better) as a cheap gun cabinet. They are neither fire-proof, nor much of a theft deterent just like a cheap gun cabinet. On the other hand they don't take up floor space, don't draw attention, can't be carried out, and you probably already have one for the cost of a lock.

    I wish I could afford one of those jumbo fire-proof safes.
     
    Last edited: Mar 24, 2011
  4. Txhillbilly

    Txhillbilly Active Member

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    Unless you are prepared to spend several thousand dollars for a real safe,most gun safes are nothing more than a sheet metal cabinet with a heavy azz door hung on them.

    An inexperienced thief might not try to get into a gun safe,but a real thief will be inside one in just a few seconds with a large pry bar or sawzall.

    If you just want something to keep the kids out of,the StackOn unit might work.But it will not deter a thief from your weapons.
    You'd be better off reinforcing an interior closet with a heavy duty frame and solid core door with top and bottom dead bolts and a locking door knob.
     
    Last edited: Mar 24, 2011
  5. spittinfire

    spittinfire New Member Supporter

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    I've been keeping my eye out for a small safe I can put into my closet as that is the best place I have in my current location. My safe will be fire resistant, alloy me to anchor it to the wall/floor to a person can't just carry it off. I personally would not get a cabinet because they offer almost no protection against these things.
     
  6. DocWard

    DocWard New Member

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    Cannon, Liberty and other reputable makers sell numerous models for less than "several thousand dollars" that are solidly built. I read in a firearms magazine recently about a Cannon safe that some crooks tried to break into, to the point of making it impossible for the owner to open. Cannon paid for TWO different locksmiths to work on it to get it open, then, honoring their warranty, replaced it. I don't recall the model, but I recall checking it online and it costing less than two grand.
     
  7. blitzen25cat

    blitzen25cat New Member

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    Heritage makes a decent safe. I had one for about 11 years now and had a small problem with a loose lock 2 years ago. I called the company and the sent someone to repair it in a couple of days free of charge. Best regaards
     
  8. boatme98

    boatme98 New Member

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    As others have said, a cabinet is not a safe. If your goal is to keep children from your guns, a cabinet is o.k. If you're looking for security, go with one of the other options mentioned.
    A lot of gun stores will do a layaway for you on good safes, making a better product more affordable for you. ;)
     
  9. Txhillbilly

    Txhillbilly Active Member

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    I have a Cannon and a Liberty gun safe,and if I wanted to,I could get into them both in a couple minutes with my Sawzall and a prybar.
    The sides,top,and botom of just about any "Gun Safe" is made out of 10-14 gauge sheet metal.The door is the only thing on a "Gun Safe" that is sturdy,and most of them can be opened by taking two wrecking bars and prying at the side and top at the same time.

    I'm not saying that they are not good products,but they are no where near a safe.
    I used to have a real safe,it was an old bank safe that was given to me.It was about 7' long x 6' high x 3'deep with double doors about 1' thick.It was on cast metal casters about 10" tall x 4" wide.
    It took a 5 ton wrecker to pick it up and move it out to my house,and I had to use a tractor to push it into my garage.As far as I know it is still in that garage,I left it when I moved 11yrs ago.

    [ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nBhOjWHbD6M&feature=related]YouTube - Security on Sale Gun safe Prying video[/ame]
     
  10. M14sRock

    M14sRock New Member

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    A cabinet will deter a "smash and grab" thief, but not a determined pro.
     
  11. c3shooter

    c3shooter Administrator Staff Member

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    Moneymaker- if that is what you can afford right now, it is better than trying to hide your guns on the top shelf of the closet, or in a dresser drawer. Yes, I have been thru the days of "need a new washing machine, kids have school fees, and I need new brakes on the car".

    DO understand that is not a safe. Level of security is about that of a filing cabinet, fire protection is zero. Will keep a curious 6 yr old from picking up a gun, MAY confound the 14 yr old that is embarking on a life of crime. That's about it.

    Having said that, I have a couple of the Stack-Ons. They are filled with 22 rifles that cost under $100 each. Bolts for those are bagged, and in the REAL safe. If you get that one, place it where it wil fit flat against a wall, and use at least 4 lag bolts to attach it to the studs in the wall. Place on 3/4 inch boards to control moisture wicking in from below.
     
  12. DocWard

    DocWard New Member

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    Most of the safe cabinets on the less expensive models that I have seen are in the 12 ga. range, and I agree, a determined criminal can breach them. That is one of the reasons location needs to be considered as well as mounting, particularly with the less expensive safes. Every safe manufacturer and review of safes I have looked at have recommended mounting the safe to the floor. Preferably a concrete floor. Some of the reviews recommend placement in a closet if possible, both for added security and to make it more difficult to breach.

    While I was a little surprised the "criminals" in the video were able to access the safe so quickly, I did note that the first thing they did was push it over. Why? Several reasons. First, a better angle of attack when jabbing with the pry bars. Second, the ability to attack the door effectively both high and low. Third and foremost, leverage. They were able to use their body weight effectively with the pry bars in order to force the doors. If they can't tip the safe, it suddenly becomes a much harder, more challenging process. Translation, it will take longer, and time is their enemy. While the narrator from Rogue Safes indicated the two were not professional criminals (I hope not!), clearly they knew what they were about and what to do.

    I've seen sawzalls in action, and have used them a few times. While I know they are impressive pieces of equipment, I also know they make one heckuva lot of noise. Also something criminals usually prefer to avoid. Noise means curiosity and attention.

    That sounds like a near ideal safe from a security standpoint, other than having an actual "safe room" with rebar reinforced concrete and a vault door, dehumidifier and air recirculation. (Hey, I can dream, can't I?) From a practicality standpoint, I can't imagine something like that for someone like me. There is no place I could put something that size, unless I wanted to park outside.

    At the end of the day, I believe buying something along the lines of a Cannon, Liberty, or one of the other safes, mounting it in the best, most secure area one can, and doing as little as possible to advertise one's ownership of firearms is better security than a nice gun cabinet, an inexpensive gun locker, or simply hiding them. Buy the best you can afford, be smart, and upgrade when possible.
     
    Last edited: Mar 27, 2011
  13. DocWard

    DocWard New Member

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    I should mention that after fifteen or so years as an assistant prosecutor, most of the burglaries that I have known about locally have definitely not been "professionals" in the sense that they are committed by someone skilled and knowledgeable. They do tend to be repetitive offenders, though. The "smash and grab" that was previously mentioned is the most common by far. Hit the house, look for the obvious--computers, jewelry, gaming consoles, guns that are not well hidden-- and get out fast.
     
  14. IXLR8

    IXLR8 New Member

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    I know it is not as aesthetically pleasing, but the location and mounting of the safe can increase its protection significantly. If you can face the door towards a wall with exactly enough room to open it, you have reduced the effectiveness of any pry-bars in trying to open it. Making sure it is properly secured to the floor is mandatory step. Make sure you read about the trials and tribulations of the people securing it the floor, the anchors are more difficult than you think to properly secure. They tend to want to walk up when tightened.

    My fiend who is a locksmith told me that 90% of troubles that people have with home safes, has to do with electronic locks. The S&G level 2 dials are a pretty safe bet.

    I someone knows you have a safe, then they will be properly equipped to open it. It will never stand up to a direct attack.
     
  15. Jesse17

    Jesse17 New Member

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    Quoted for truth!

    I know someone who has a 'not so moral' past, who told me that he has hauled a full size acetylene/oxygen cutting torch with him to rip someone off. :eek:
     
  16. moneymaker17

    moneymaker17 New Member

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    the way i look at it is. i just need something to put a lock on. keep it orginized. "out of reach" im sure if a burgular did come, they would hit my garage instead of my room. until i can find a true good bank safe. i really dont want any of these knock off safes. a while back my aunt moved into a four closer, they had a safe in there. me and my dad were curous. so we started to crack it open. (we did) nothing inside :(.. anyways that safe was about 2 feet tall and proble 400 lbs had about 1/2 steel then concrete then more metal. it took us 20 mins to get it open. my whole idea is go big or go home, unfournalty i dont have the funds to go big. so im going to go with just a storage unit. until i can find a bank safe on craigslist or such.
    i gladly appriate all the help and thoughts though!
    you guys are great and very helpful.
    best fourm ive been on
     
  17. therewolf

    therewolf New Member

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    I agree, OP, some lockup is better than none at all.

    Northeastern Tools, Home Depot, Lowes, all carry lockable cabinets...
     
  18. Overkill0084

    Overkill0084 Active Member

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    I've got one of those cabinets. As far as security goes they are simply a pretty good cabinet that locks. I use mine for storing my airguns. I ordered the top box that goes to it for additional ammo storage. I have a cheapy "safe" for the firearms. I've pretty much outgrown it, I intend to obtain a proper high quality safe in the very near future. A determined thief will eventually get in to anything if he want's to bad enough. I like to think that the monitored alarm system + the locking storage will discourage all but the most determined burglar.
    Worth noting, those cabinets aren't cheap. Have you considered looking for a used safe?
     
  19. rjgnwdc

    rjgnwdc New Member Supporter

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    more then a safe

    I have a decent safe that's mounted both in the floor and to the wall in a closet in my basement that's locked and ADT security systems in the house it's a new wireless system so they can't just cut the phone line. I feel fairly secure that first off the alarm is going off as soon as they breech any door or window if that don't do it then the motion detectors will pick them up and set the alarm horns off and make the call to the ADT monitors, if they get past all that then they deserve whatever they can get.it's all insured anyway. I just don't see a professional burglar breaking into "Joe working stiff neighborhood" for a bunch of guns.