Muzzle energy ?

Discussion in 'General Rifle Discussion' started by Green Lantern, Jan 13, 2020.

  1. Wambli

    Wambli Well-Known Member

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    Oh absolutely!!! But my old Ruger #1 in .458 WinMag with the old style red hockey puck hard rubber butt pad was a beast. Same chambering in my CZ Safari bolt action was easy to shoot. Lots of variables out there.
     
  2. freefall

    freefall Well-Known Member

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    I had a .375 #1 with the red hockey puck.
    Unpleasant.
     
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  3. OldManMontgomery

    OldManMontgomery Active Member

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    No. Muzzle energy has nothing (directly) to do with it.

    Recoil is roughly figured by comparing the momentum of the rifle "Ejecta (bullet and wadding and powder weight)" by the muzzle velocity of the ejecta. That product is then compared to the inertia (resistance to movement or 'negative momentum' so to speak) of the shooter.

    This is modified - and I doubt there's a formula for it - by the shape of the stock and such. There are some stock designs which bash the stock into one's cheek bone upon recoil. Not pleasant.

    Bodies (shooters) of lesser weight tend to get pushed. Heavier people tend to have the rifle run in to them. That's a bit of oversimplification, but easy to picture.

    A corollary to this is the more resistance to recoil by the shooter's position will cause more feeling of recoil. Standing freely is the least amount of recoil by a given rifle/load. Shooting from a bench rest and leaning forward into the rifle will feel more strong and prone is greatest. No. Putting one's shoulder up against a tree (behind) to block any movement at all is worst. But it is a good reason not to shoot an 'elephant rifle' from prone.

    This is also why some of the Brit gun makers who built the huge rifles in the early 20th Century used 'standing rests' to proof and sight in their arms. (I use a tripod and a 'U' shaped wooden piece I cobbled together when shooting the few 'dangerous game' rifles I have.)

    But muzzle energy alone doesn't mean squat.
     
  4. Maineiak

    Maineiak Active Member

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    Muzzle energy is directly proportional to recoil...also is the projectile weight
     
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  5. Oldoutlaw

    Oldoutlaw Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Yep, it sure does. How you doing out there my friend?
     
  6. Maineiak

    Maineiak Active Member

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    :) doing good and staying safe:) hope you are too!!
     
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  7. Oldoutlaw

    Oldoutlaw Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Trying the best we can. And doing pretty good at we think.
     
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  8. Maineiak

    Maineiak Active Member

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    So...finally got around to sighting in my "new to me" P95, and I am really liking the pistol. When I got it, the front sight was painted red and green, and the rear sight was shifted to the left. I removed the paint and adjusted the rear sight. I can now bust a clay target at 15 yards on the first shot:)
     
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  9. Maineiak

    Maineiak Active Member

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    I am glad to hear you are doing good:) The snow is melting up here so it helps with the mental health, and other stuff we have to worry about now:)
     
  10. sheepdawg

    sheepdawg Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Here's one you'd love, looks like any K98k but notice it has a muzzle brake. This is a Swedish m/40 anti tank gun in 8X63. It wasn't very popular with the Swedish servicemen who were lucky enough to get to shoot it.

    m40 anti tank.jpg
     
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  11. Oldoutlaw

    Oldoutlaw Well-Known Member Supporter

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    The wife and mine P95's are deadly accurate. More so than some of the newer fashion guns.
     
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  12. Oldoutlaw

    Oldoutlaw Well-Known Member Supporter

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    And it damaged more than one soldiers shoulder!
     
  13. Oldoutlaw

    Oldoutlaw Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Yepper, like the upcoming floods we expect on the Mississippi River.
     
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  14. sheepdawg

    sheepdawg Well-Known Member Supporter

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    The Mississippi is already almost three miles wide at Memphis. Keep your snowmelt.

    Sorry for the thread drift.
     
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  15. RaySendero

    RaySendero Active Member

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    Interesting topic! Energy, Momentum, Recoil and Felt Recoil

    Yet I got lost trying to use this calculator:
    http://huntamerica.com/recoil_calculator/

    Somebody help with this:
    For an 8.5lb 30-06 with 180 gr bullet at 2,700 fps and 50 gr powder
    it figures:
    Recoil Energy of 19 ft-lbs
    Recoil Velocity of 12 ft/sec

    If I input the powder charge = 0
    it figures:
    Recoil Energy of 8 ft-lbs
    Recoil Velocity of 8 ft/sec

    If I do powder charge at 0, but add 50 gr to bullet wt (230)
    it figures:
    Recoil Energy of 14 ft-lbs
    Recoil Velocity of 10 ft/sec

    If I do powder charge at 100, but drop bullet 50 gr to bullet wt (130)
    it figures:
    Recoil Energy of 25 ft-lbs
    Recoil Velocity of 13 ft/sec

    WHY is a gr of powder effecting recoil more than a gr of bullet?
     
    Last edited: Apr 8, 2020
  16. Pasquanel

    Pasquanel Proud to be an American Supporter

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  17. oO_Rogue_Oo

    oO_Rogue_Oo Well-Known Member

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    One other factor as it relates to "time"; powder burn rate. The difference between a push and a sharp hit. Not all ammo will recoil the same even at the same bullet weights and velocities. This really comes into play as a reloader but holds true for factory ammo too in a lot of cases.
     
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  18. JTJ

    JTJ Well-Known Member Supporter

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    You should have tried the #3 with the curved metal butt plate in 45-70. 405 grain @ 2000fps. It could be loaded to 458M-200fps. The Browning single was a lot worse but pretty. Thin rounded curved metal butt plate. A guy I knew was in a hurry to get a shot with his 45-70 Browning and did not quite get it shouldered correctly. Broke his arm.
    There was a 45-70 #3 for sale in Phoenix at a good price. I passed.
     
  19. oO_Rogue_Oo

    oO_Rogue_Oo Well-Known Member

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    I have a Hi-Wall 45/70 and I LOVE shooting that thing. I come home with my shoulder black n blue every time I take it out but I can't help myself. I giggle the whole time; it is just so much fun to shoot.
     
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