More "tiresome" questions

Discussion in 'Ammunition & Reloading' started by fmj, Oct 14, 2011.

  1. fmj

    fmj New Member

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    1) whats the difference between plated and jacketed? if any.

    2) how big a difference will .1 or .2 gr. of powder really make when talking accuracy. Keep in mind i'm not loading anywhere near max. loads.

    3) I am under the assumption that with repeated reloading a case will "stretch" is this a correct assumption?
     
  2. c3shooter

    c3shooter Administrator Staff Member

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    1. The thickness of the coating material. Plated is much thinner.
    2. Yes, you DO need to pay attention to 0.1 differences in powder charges. More powder equals faster bullet equals increase in recoil, flatter shooting bullet. How MUCH difference? Depends on which powder, which bullet, which caliber. Some of my .38 Special wadcutter loads only HAVE 2.5 grains of powder, so, yeah, 0.1 gr IS a big deal.
    3. SOME brass cases FLOW under high pressures, and get longer, need trimming. Straight walled pistols cases rarely do this to a significant extent. Bottle necked high pressure rifle loads- yes- some more than others.

    Do not claim to be the guru of reloading, so any others with other thoughts are welcome, and not gonna hurt my feelings.
     

  3. fmj

    fmj New Member

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    Thanks, this answers my questions....save, plating being much thinner, how will this affect accuracy say from a load using jacketed, going to plated?

    Whats the pros/cons of each?

    I figured as much about the powder weights, tis why i weigh every charge. I just figured i would ask and see others thoughts on the matter.

    The stretch i asked as i have shot some .357 cases numerous times and some .44 mag. cases 3 or more times and have yet to notice any stretching. I will be sure to keep it in mind when i start throwing .35 and 06.
     
  4. Axxe55

    Axxe55 The Apocalypse Is Coming.....

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    fmj, i for one try to make my powder weight consistant in a given group that i'm loading. like 03 said, lot of it depends on the make and type of powder used and the smaller the charges, the bigger the difference.

    from what i have read and observed, the bottleneck cases need to be watched more closely than straightwalled cases. a lot of the stretching or flowing amount depends of the load used, hotter and faster powders tend to move the case faster.

    on the plated vs. jacketed bullets, not for sure, maybe the accuracy may be more dependent upon bullet profile than the outer material. because some fully lead bullets can be very accurate with the right load behind them.
     
  5. DrumJunkie

    DrumJunkie New Member

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    Plated rounds will act more like a straight leas round many times due to the really thin coating. I usually when reloading with them tend to stay around loads meant for a lead bullet.

    As for cases..I use them until I see them looking pretty funky. As stated a straight wall case doesn't "flow" like a necked down one will can. It's a pretty good idea to mic cases just so you know they are not getting too funky. But if you are not doing really hot loads and the chamber the round is in is nice and tight I've not seen them get bad after several uses. I've got some 9mm and 40 cases that have been used pretty often. My 44 cases I tend to replace sooner just because. But I've been known to load those a little hot. My Super Redhawk seems ot like them better that way.;)
     
  6. willfully armed

    willfully armed New Member

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    I've loaded Ranier and Berry's plated in 9mm,10mm and 45 acp.

    I've always used load data for jacketed, even to Max. Never experienced a problem.
    They've always said to follow lead data due to the occurrence of the plating material shearing in the barrel. Again, I've never experienced this.
     
  7. jpattersonnh

    jpattersonnh Active Member

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    I have never used plated bullets. I do load cast for pistol and rifle. For cast pistol I use cast load data. If you look at the data, a sub sonic round will likely be the same for cast or jacketed w/ an equal weight bullet. When you hit super sonic jacketed that is where it changes drasticly. 1100fps is the tresh hold for me. When it comes to rifles, I use gas check cast lead. I can drive them a bit faster. In 9.3x57 I use 285gr GC cast and 286gr partitions, both w/ the same data to 2250fps. 2300fps is the max for any GC lead.
    Powder plays a big part also. For most lead pistol cartridges I use W231. For .44-40 I use Unique. The difference the platform. My .44-40 is a 1892 lever w/ a 24" barrel, and is able to handle the higher pressure the powder, bullet combination create, it works. In auto's including 10mm I use W231 for cast lead. Unique or 296 for jacketed. You really need to experiment w/ published data and see what works for you.
     
  8. JonM

    JonM Moderator

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    the other two were answered prety well but i want to give my two primers worth on number 2.

    most sraightwall pistols use very fast burning powders. the amount of pressure will increase or decrease by .1 or .2 weight by a fair bit. this will make the round impact higher or lower.

    that being said we are talking small fractions of an inch that will only be noticed when firing from a machine rest.

    my margin for pistol ammo is +- .2 grains. most of my shots shoot ragged one hole groups with such powder charges.

    so, does it matter?? technically yes. practically no. there may be a total of 5 people on the planet that can tell the difference in their impact points when the varience is 1 grain much less anyone else being able to see a .2 difference
     
  9. fmj

    fmj New Member

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    Thanks guys...i AM learning here!! or trying to at any rate aint never been accused of being the sharpest tool in the shed...but i'm still in the shed;)

    On the subject of plated/jacketed...

    i am looking at .44 mag bullets for use in the Ruger carbine. I use 18.5 gr 2400 under a 240 gr. JHP...the gun really seems to like to eat those best. MidwayUSA has a good price on 240 gr. plated HPs. This is why i bring up the question/topic.
     
  10. jpattersonnh

    jpattersonnh Active Member

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    That is a pretty light load for .44mag., I would not worry.
     
  11. fmj

    fmj New Member

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    I've pushed 'em with 20 or 20.5 gr 2400 before...the patterns REALLY open up...with 18.5 gr. the wife can do 5 in 1" (better than me) so i figure feed it what it wants eat.

    I really dont see a need for 300 gr bullets or anything like that. the 240 HPs will dump a deer or pretty much anything in this neck of the woods, for that matter, pretty handily.
     
  12. JonM

    JonM Moderator

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    check with the manufactuer of the plated bullets. they have operating ranges that if you go over the recomended fps can cause severe copper fouling.
     
  13. therewolf

    therewolf New Member

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    Powder charge uniformity matters, IMO, more than increase or

    decrease of .1 grain overall. The more uniform you can make the

    charge, the more uniform your bullets are going to shoot.

    Cases just eventually wear out. Scrap 'em. the yard is paying what?

    @ $1.60/lb for yellow brass right now?
     
  14. robocop10mm

    robocop10mm Lifetime Supporting Member Lifetime Supporter

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    The straight walled cases can actually shrink with age. The sizing is effected on the up stroke of the press, while the case is going IN to the die. Friction can displace the brass down. With a bottleneck case there is also an expander button that goes into the case prior to sizing. That button gets pulled through the mouth when the case is removed from the die. This friction can and will stretch the mouth of the case. The main body does not stretch, the mouth does.

    I have never had to trim straight walled cases. Bottleneck case (except .357Sig) get checked every time and trimmed when they get close to max.