Long range set up for beginner

Discussion in 'General Rifle Discussion' started by Longrange, Jan 9, 2011.

  1. Longrange

    Longrange New Member

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    Wondering if anyone with long range shooting experience, 600-1000 yards will be able to answer a few questions for me. I am interested in buying a rifle, specifically for the bench that will reach out accurately to 600-1000 yards. I am looking first at what caliber should I be looking at? .223, .243, .308 will all of these be suitable or is 1 preferred over another?

    Next I am looking at barrel legnth, should I stick with a 26" bull or will a 24" bull work as well?

    I will preface this by stating that I have no bench experience for this type of shooting, so my theory is start at 100 yards and become proficient in that range, then move to 200 and so on.

    What I am hoping to do is purchase a nice rifle from the start that I can grow into without having to spend big money at a smith to tweak my purchase. I have set my budget roughly in the $1500 range but will extend it to 2k if need be.

    Thanks for your time
     
  2. DarinCraft

    DarinCraft New Member

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    I have ZERO experience with LR shooting but I have interest in it and have asked some questions about this before. My best advice to you is to read the opinions posted here before.

    You will find that most people here advise a .308 with custom loads, a custom rifle based on one of the big three recievers (Remmy, Howa or Savage you will never get a straight answer because it is so dependent on preference.) and a scope that will definitely set you back at least $1000.

    Now if you were to change your range to around 600 meters or less, then the advice changes to something a little more reasonably priced, like an out of the box Savage 12 series, a Remmy 700 or a Howa 1500 with a moderately priced scope.

    This is what I have read here and by no means is advice by me. Below is the thread I posted last year. Dillinger, Tango, Cane and many others posted links and a lot of great info there.

    http://www.firearmstalk.com/forums/f18/help-me-daydream-about-my-next-project-23060/
     
    Last edited: Jan 9, 2011

  3. AKFISHGUIDE

    AKFISHGUIDE New Member

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    Long range set up

    I to am trying to come up with a long range package. I have decided on the 270 WSM due to it's incredible long range ballistics. So far I have narrowed my choice of rifles to a Winchester Model 70 Coyote light (a medium wieght varminter that is gauranteed to shoot sub MOA) or the Browning A-Bolt model 100 Eclipse, another Varmint based rifle chambered in the 270 WSM. I also considered the Savage model 12 VSS but it is no longer chambered in my preferred caliber and I can not currently locate an older one. For a scope, I have decided on the Nikon 4x16x42 Monarch with the BDC reticle and the side adjustable objective. A great scope for the money with an amazing eye relief of 3.7 to 4 inches
     
    Last edited: Jan 10, 2011
  4. cpttango30

    cpttango30 New Member

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    What is your background?

    How long have you been shooting?

    What ranges and what firearms types are you familiar with?

    One can spend all the money they want on a set up but if you don't have the skill set to read the wind dope the wind use marriage to see wind direction and speed all your going to be doing is reinforcing bad habits and wasting ammo.

    Your best bet for a beginner long range rig is going to be to forget about the Browning, Winchester is good but Savage has a purpose built long range gun the F-class and the F-T/R. Savage Arms Firearms > All Firearms List

    You can get them in 223, 308, and 6.5x284.

    As for the scope I would think about going with at least a 6-24x40mm if not a 8-32x40mm check Nikon the monarch 6-24x50mm is a great scope and Bushnell makes an elite 4200 8-32x40mm
     
  5. Switchbarrel

    Switchbarrel New Member

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    Lr br

    Enjoy
    -Rick
     
  6. powg

    powg New Member

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    off the beaten path...

    im gonna think out of the box .....again ...sorry guys its genetic.why not go with something non traditional ,ready to go out of the box ,with inexpensive ammo..... that has a proven record ,and as a plus looks mean as hell.. get you a soviet dragunof /tiger sniper rifle have fun ... gain knowledge ....and save money up for precision long range rifle ,optics ,wind meter ,spotting scope ,reloader of your dreams ...just my 2 cents powg pissed off white guy
     
    Last edited: Jan 14, 2011
  7. jpattersonnh

    jpattersonnh Active Member

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    So what did you go and have to do that for?? Great idea. He could also look for an M41b Swede sniper, those run under $2000.00 w/ great optics. Sure it is a 4x Ajack scope, but seriously, I would not want to be within 800 yards of it.
    Even a PSL w/ a 4x PSO scope is a dandy 600 yard rig. Under $1000.00 w/ optics. The optics can be ungraded to a 6x or 8x or even a variable scope pretty cheap.
     
  8. powg

    powg New Member

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    soviet tiger

    imo the dragunof's only drawback was its scope /mounts ....(for bench purposes.)...... but for its designated purpose of sniper duty ,in the most inhospitable conditions known to man mountains,desert,ice,tundra,tropical ,urban battlefields.....the scope/mounts and the rifle itself ....for pure ruggedness cant be beat .
     
  9. Squirrel_Slayer

    Squirrel_Slayer New Member

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    While I agree the Dragunov is a great rifle for what it is intended, and a killer looking rifle to boot, it sounds to me like the OP is looking for more of a bench rest rifle. Plus it appears he is looking for something with a bull barrel. I would recomend one of the rifle from Savage.
     
  10. IXLR8

    IXLR8 New Member

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    a Dragunov? Seriously?

    If you can find a real one, it would cost way more than you want to spend, and the knockoffs will only shoot 2 to 3 MOA. You would be better off with 700, or another precision sporting rifle.

    When you can hit the target at 300 yards, I will be impressed. If you can hit paper at 500 yards, you will have surpassed everyone but dedicated snipers, and long range competitors. There is huge difference between a rifle being able to shoot 500 yards, and someone actually being able to hit anything.

    I don't mean to sound harsh, but unreal expectations will lead to frustration and wasted time and money. Find a ballistic table and see what the bullet drop is at 500 yards for any of the rounds you previously mentioned. I think you will be shocked.

    Remingtons ballistic calculator

    Remingtons best .308 round has about 50 inches of drop at 500 yards.
     
  11. Squirrel_Slayer

    Squirrel_Slayer New Member

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    I have seen real Dragunovs at the range, and spoke with the guys shooting them, and they admitted they only shoot 2 MOA at 100 yards, at best. I shoot steel plates at 600 meters with my .223 AR, and that's just about as far out as I want to get really. At least for right now. It's a moon shot no doubt. And I wwon't eeven go out to that range when it's windy. There are so many variables at that range, it takes years of experience to master.

    Start off with a .223 at 100 yards and hone your skills there for a while. Then work your way out to the longer distances.
     
  12. redmist

    redmist New Member

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    Rem 700 .308 VSF 26'' 168gr. Hornady A-Max 800 yards. Rem. mil-spec. .308 24'' 1000 yards . Fed Gold Medal Match GM308M2 175 gr....Hornady.308 Superformance 178 gr. Hits 10 inch's higher or more, not done testing ??
     
    Last edited: Jan 14, 2011
  13. redmist

    redmist New Member

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    I find it EZ Shooting 600 yards.. A 178gr. Projectile going 2775 MV. is on target in like .4 sec......At 100 yards a 10 mph wind (full value) moves projectile .7 inch
     
  14. redmist

    redmist New Member

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    My boy (13) shoots 600 yards. Take your time you can do it !! Go remington 700 In .308
     
  15. jpattersonnh

    jpattersonnh Active Member

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    I use a ballistics calculator. Tell you what, you can shoot your Remichester and I'll shoot my M41b or PU 91/30 w/ a 4x scope at 100 to 600 yards with 5 shots at each distance at a 14" plate, and 10 seconds between transition of yardage. Bet I spank you really good!! I'll even use surplus ammo and 100++ year old technology!

    Redmist, you had better check Your data. A 178gr for a .308 going 2775fps???? Never heard of a 178gr.

    Quote"I find it EZ Shooting 600 yards.. A 178gr. Projectile going 2775 MV. is on target in like .4 sec......At 100 yards a 10 mph wind (full value) moves projectile .7 inch" This is "LIKE" wrong.

    Quote"Rem 700 .308 VSF 26'' 168gr. Hornady A-Max 800 yards. Rem. mil-spec. .308 24'' 1000 yards . Fed Gold Medal Match GM308M2 175 gr....Hornady.308 Superformance 178 gr. Hits 10 inch's higher or more, not done testing ??"
    What is this jibberish???
     
    Last edited: Jan 14, 2011
  16. redmist

    redmist New Member

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    OK, Hornady 308 178gr. BTHP MATCH SUPERFORMANCE.. Order # 8077 LOT# 3100508 100 yds +1.8 200 yds 0.0 300 yds -7.7 400 yds -22.0 500 yds -44.1...........look it up thank's
     
  17. jpattersonnh

    jpattersonnh Active Member

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    I stand corrected. They are using Hodgdons new powders. But, Do you think all rifles will shoot them well?? I'd rather hand load a 165gr at 2700 fps and hit my target at 400 yards to put meat on the table then pay $1.50 to $2.00 a round for target ammo. I use Prvi Partisan 165gr SP to target shoot. Targets and real world shooting have nothing in common. You can bolt your rifle to a table, I'll continue shooting off hand. There is a thread about "Equipment or Shooter".

    A great read!!
    http://www.firearmstalk.com/forums/f18/shooting-ability-equipment-36028/
     
  18. Sniper03

    Sniper03 Supporting Member Supporter

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    Longrange,

    The 6.5X284 has been looking fairly good recently in several of the 1000 yard matches. I have a 6.5 Grendel Light Weight Competition Varmint Model from Sabre Defence that I like real well for long range prairie dog hunting in Texas. And I have been told by some competition shooters it is a good 1000 yard round? I do know at 600 it is a beast! I have shot my share of 7.62 (308) from the 40X Sniper Rifle at 1000. But you really must know your rifle well when shooting the 308. It is not that flat of trajectory at that distance. Of course the wind and mirage is always the biggest factor at that range. Anyway I had some thoughts when reading your post. And getting the bug to maybe looking into building a 7mm Rem Mag Long Range Rifle for curiosity. As far as benching it? If you are going to do any official competition you may want to check out the Class Rules before you make a final decision on Barrel Length since it also effects the weight for a class. I would go no less than a 26" Barrel in a Bolt Gun. Only an opinion. Good Luck!

    03
     
  19. redmist

    redmist New Member

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    Thank you sir. I hand load too. Finally got a good load for my .264-LBC-AR .....123gr. Lapua Scenar... AA2520.... Lapua brass.... GMM Primers...... Clocked at 2650 MV 1/2 inch at 100 yds.
     
  20. jpattersonnh

    jpattersonnh Active Member

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    OK, I ran your Super ammo through the ballistics calculator. It has the 178gr listed. I even added 2ft per second. Here it is at 600 yards.
    -86.4" elevation, w/ a 10mph wind(90degree), 26.7". Time to target.... .8 seconds.

    Here is a 165gr Prvi sp at 2700fps:

    Elevation- 99", windage 34.1" Time to target: .86

    Here is a 6.5x55 140gr Nosler at 2700fps..
    Elevation: -92" windage: 33". Time to target: .82

    I'll still take the 100++ year old technology.