Is there an Electrician in the house?

Discussion in 'The Club House' started by string1946, May 18, 2014.

  1. string1946

    string1946 New Member

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    I worked for the power company for a long time but I was an operator in a power plant and not an electrician. I'm going to run a circuit for a Lincoln AC 225 welder in my garage that will be about a 20' run. The welder says it needs a 220V 50A input. I doubt it will ever pull that much current and if it did it would only be for short periods. I'm leaning toward a 50 amp breaker and #8 wire. What do you think?
     
  2. dango

    dango Well-Known Member Lifetime Supporter

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    Most times , more is better . 8 gauge cable is fine and I would go with 50A for potential spikes in amperage draw . OMHO .....:)
     

  3. kytowboater

    kytowboater Active Member

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    Depends on the wire ran. THHN insulation (thinks it's the most common, think romex) #8 is good to 50 amps. I would run #6. Rated to 65 amps even in a continual draw. Plus it's less resistance keeping wire cooler and your energy costs down a little.

    Stick with the 50a beaker though.


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  4. kytowboater

    kytowboater Active Member

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    Just make sure whatever wire you run, you check the ampacity of the insulation.


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  5. readytogo

    readytogo New Member

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    A 50 amp circuit requires a #6 gauge wire if copper and #4 gauge wire is aluminum is used.
    Voltage drop: 0.79
    Voltage drop percentage: 0.36%
    Voltage at the end: 219.21volts,nohing to worry about.
     
  6. SSGN_Doc

    SSGN_Doc Well-Known Member

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    All I know about electricity is that it involves magic smoke. Every time I let the magic smoke out of the system, stuff stops working.:D

    Sounds like others are better equipped to give you the answers you need.
     
    Last edited: May 18, 2014
  7. kytowboater

    kytowboater Active Member

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    Can't be anymore clear than this.


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  8. kytowboater

    kytowboater Active Member

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    Stick with copper.


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  9. therewolf

    therewolf New Member

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    ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

    This. Copper is stronger, dissipates heat better,
    and is less prone to brittleness and carbon
    scoring.
     
  10. 25-5

    25-5 New Member

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    Just to be clear does it require a 50A circuit or is the F.L.A. (full load amperage) 50?
     
  11. string1946

    string1946 New Member

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    This about all the manual says.

    Using the following instructions, have a qualified electrician connect this receptacle (NEMA 6-50R Type) to the powerlines at the fuse box. Three #10 or larger copper wires are required if conduit is used. For long cable runs over100'(31m), #8 or larger wire in conduit will be needed to prevent excessive voltage drops. Fuse the two hot lines with 50 ampere super lag type fuses as shown in the following diagram. The center contact in the receptacle is for the ground-ing connection. A green wire in the input cable connects this contact to the frame of the welder. This insures proper grounding of the welder frame when the welder plug is inserted into the receptacle. If a separate disconnect switch is used, it should have two poles for the two hot lines and both should be fused for 50 amperes
     
  12. donthav1

    donthav1 Active Member

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    another +1 for using copper.

    actually in North Dakota it's illegal to use aluminum or copper-clad aluminum for branch circuit wiring.

    like mentioned before, run #6 copper & if it says use a 50A breaker, use a 50A breaker. too many times have me & the boss run across "Tim the toolman" who decided to keep the breaker from tripping so often, they put a 20 or 30 amp breaker on a 15 amp circuit. that will let ALOT of smoke out if things go wrong
     
  13. string1946

    string1946 New Member

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    Thats why I was asking. The manual doesn't mention breakers, only lag fuses and thats the online manual and not one that came with the welder when I got it 15 years ago. Up until now I just ran it off a generator but now I want to hook it up in the garage. I need to weld a crack in my 3 point hitch post hole auger frame.
     
  14. ctshooter

    ctshooter New Member

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    When I ran a circuit for my welder I stepped up the wiring to 4ga. When it comes to wire more isn't going to hurt, but smaller can burn it all down.

    I also put the plug near the door to the garage so I could plug my generator in that outlet
     
  15. TexasRog

    TexasRog New Member

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    If you run too light a wire, and your house catches on fire from an overload, your insurance company will tell you "you wired it illegally so it's your fault, and won't cover you. Go by the National Electrical Code. It tells you exactly what you need. There are books available at Home Depot, Menards, Lowes etc. Don't believe what someone you don't know tell you how to install it correctly. I have been an electrician most my adult life..I'm now 68, and I would not give advice for any electrical work. I refer them to the code book.
     
  16. TexasRog

    TexasRog New Member

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    You plug your gen set into that welding plug, the power supplier will sue you. It's a felony to do that..You can kill someone doing that. You need a transfer switch to do it legally. All current carrying conductors must be disconnected, Including neutral!! Read the National Electrical Code!!!
     
  17. Axxe55

    Axxe55 The Apocalypse Is Coming.....

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    that is true. without a transfer switch, it can backfeed into the power lines, and if they are working on downed lines and don't know they are energised, someone can get hurt or killed.
     
  18. 25-5

    25-5 New Member

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    TR is correct. Check the code and amperage tables. He also knows the 50A 2p protects #8 Cu just fine. #6 if your nervous and a #10 grnd. For 20' voltage drop is no issue
    The receptacle is your disconnect switch. If you want a disconnect above it for convenience, that's fine. If the panel is within sight you really don't need it.
     
    Last edited: May 18, 2014
  19. mrm14

    mrm14 Active Member

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    This is correct.
     
  20. Highpower

    Highpower New Member

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    Whether or not you use all 50 amps while welding isn't the real issue. The problem is that Lincoln welder houses a large transformer which draws a huge in-rush current (maybe 52 -53 amps or so) just from hitting the ON switch. If you try to go too low on the breaker amperage (like 40 amps) you'll never get to weld anything because the breaker is going to trip every time you turn the welder on. Breakers are designed to handle a very short (~ 1 second) overload of an amp or two without tripping instantly, but that's about it. That's why your manual suggests using "Super-Lag" fuses.

    And I agree with the others... using #6 copper for that 50 amp circuit should be thought of as CHEAP insurance considering the alternative IMHO.
     
    Last edited: May 18, 2014