I know you think that the UK in general, has screwed-up gun ownership issues, however.....

Discussion in 'Training & Safety' started by tac foley, Jul 27, 2020.

  1. tac foley

    tac foley Well-Known Member

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    THIS is what happens in the Republic of Ireland when you want to get a 'training certificate' whatever that might be.

    Everything in italics is from the original post...

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by *******[​IMG]
    Hello, I was wondering how I would get a firearms training certificate which would allow me to use a firearm under supervision.
    Could you guys help me?

    First thing you need is someone with a licensed firearm, that is over 18, that is willing to let you license the firearm and allow you to shoot with them.
    Once that hurdle is jumped you need to apply for the training license. There is a minimum age of 14 but no maximum age. You can get a training license at any age, but it is aimed at youngsters as anyone over 16 can get a full license so its generally uncommon for someone over 16 to apply for one.

    Anywho, get or download an FCA1 application form (from your local Garda Station or the Garda website, here).

    Here is a short guide on how to fill out the FCA1.

    For the following sections:

    • Section 1 - Tick "Training Firearm Certificate" and in the box below tick "I have not held a certificate for this firearm in the previous three years".
    • Section 2.1 - Fill in all the personal information stuff. Everything.
    • Section 2.2 - Give name, address and phone number for your GP, and any other doctor you might be visiting.
    • Section 2.3 - You need two people to vouch for you as referees. Supply their name, address and details in this section.
    • Section 2.4 - Tick the boxes as appropriate.
    • Section 2.5 - Ignore. (*** see additional information below ***)
    • Section 3.1 - Fill in the details of the gun you intend to "joint" license. All the info will be on the firearm certificate of whomever's gun you intend to license.
    • Section 3.2 - Tick "silencer" if its a rifle and the person has a suppressor. Ignore "sights" box, its only for NV stuff.
    • Section 3.3 - As this is a joint license you skip part A and fill in section B. You include the person's name, address, contact number, certificate number and for how you got the gun write "Joint license".
    • Section 3.4 - Ignore
    • Section 3.5 - Tick "YES", and then give the address of the current license holder.
    • Section 4.1 - Tick English, and below that write in the amount of rounds you want. I'd apply for the same as the current license holder. Then write in the current license holders certificate number.
    • Section 4.2 - Tick whichever applies. I don't know what the gun is or what you intend to use it for so only you can answer the questions in this section. Just know if you tick target shooting you will be required to show membership of a range and if hunting you will be required to produce membership to a club or private permissions on lands you have permission to hunt on.
    • Section 4.3 - Fill in any details of a range or club if you are a member of either.
    • Section 4.4 - Here is the important one. Fill in the current license holders certificate number. You need your parent or guardian to sign this part of the form. Then print their name, address, contact details, etc. and date it.
    • Section 5.1 - Tick yes (no need for licenses as your firearms license covers you for all non licenseable species. IOW rabbits, foxes, etc. just not Deer)
    • Section 5.2 - Ignore
    • Sign it, and date it.

    *** ADDITIONAL INFORMATION - This information is in regard to section 2.5, competence. When someone is applying for a firearm they must show competence the first time. This is usually done via one of four ways, however as you are applying for a training license which by its very definition is a means of starting off in shooting sports no certificate of competence is required. You might face a little resistance on this. By that i mean An Gardaí may still ask, even demand, a competence certificate but if you're under 16 and applying for a training license this negates the requirement for a competence certificate and there may even be legal issues with someone under 16 doing a competence course. ***

    Ask the person who's gun you are licensing to accompany you when submitting your paperwork.

    You need to provide more information for some sections on a separate piece of paper, labelled "Additional Information". See which sections apply to you, and fill in the following for those sections:

    1. Section 2.1 - Previous Address: If you have lived elsewhere provide those addresses.
    2. Section 2.5 - Outlined above.
    3. Section 4.1 - Amount of Ammo: I am requesting 250-500 (example) rounds of ammunition for the following reasons:
      • Empty (fired) casings are treated the same as live rounds as per the Firearms Act, 1925 where it states that "ammunition for a firearm is any ingredient or component part of any such ammunition", with component part being the bullet, the casing, the propellant or the primer. So my license must allow me to have a high enough limit to have both live and fired rounds in my possession.
      • I regularly take part in clay shoots and actively attend clay ranges for practice. As a result of this I can go through a large quantity of rounds in a short period of time. (ONLY IF IN A RANGE/CLUB)
      • Buying bulk rounds of ammunition to reduce trips to dealer and for cost implications.
      • Distance to dealer being excessive & inconvenient.
      • The person who holds the main license has "X" amount of ammunition and i must be licensed to carry the same amount if/when i'm out with this person.
    4. Section 4.2 - Reason for Gun:
      • Control of vermin on listed lands
      • To learn to safely handle a firearm
      • Clay pigeon shooting/target shooting (ONLY IF IN A RANGE/CLUB)
      • Hunting of game during the open seasons.
    For your first licenses you need to be as complete as possible, but for any additional licenses over the years you'll find some of the above does not need to be filled in. You'll also find when you decide to go for a license of your own on a gun of your own that this license will act as your proof of competence instead of a 30 minute course.

    Think that covers most/all of it. Anything else, just ask.
     
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  2. ellis36

    ellis36 Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Very enlightening, tac!

    ellis
     

  3. armoredman

    armoredman Well-Known Member

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    I am SO glad I live in Arizona...
     
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  4. tac foley

    tac foley Well-Known Member

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    And I'm so glad I don't live in the Republic of Ireland.
     
  5. Mercator

    Mercator Well-Known Member

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    Ireland has been the home base of a major terrorist organization. Disarming it is not necessarily bad unless you’re Sinn Fein.
     
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  6. tac foley

    tac foley Well-Known Member

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    Actually North AND South have played homes to more than a few major terrorist organisations. The 'protestant' side of the conflict was equally evil.
     
  7. Sniper03

    Sniper03 Supporting Member Supporter

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    TAC

    Simply Holy Cr*p!:eek:
    Thank God I live in Tennessee and in the part of the USA that is still left!!;)
    03
     
    Last edited: Jul 30, 2020
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  8. sheriffjohn

    sheriffjohn Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Tac Foley, the only similar thing we have in Missouri is hunter education which is still taught in some schools. Even that has been eroded over time. Thanks for the information, sir.
     
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  9. Mercator

    Mercator Well-Known Member

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    Which one systematically ambushed and killed members of the British military , exploded bombs in England and Belfast and murdered scores of random victims but also a legendary member of your royal family?
     
    Last edited: Jul 30, 2020
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  10. manta

    manta Well-Known Member Supporter

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    From memory they took the handguns of people in the ROI using concerns they would fall into IRA hands as a excuse.

    Quote. The ban on handguns was introduced in the early 1970s, with the spread of terrorist violence, and the Government held an amnesty to allow people who had old handguns in their possession to hand them into the Garda.

    At the time, the main concern was to prevent terrorist organisations from stealing legally held guns for use against the State. Since then, however, senior gardai have remarked on how the introduction of the ban has served Irish society well and prevented death and injury.
     
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  11. Ghost1958

    Ghost1958 Well-Known Member

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    When gov acks as described in this thread as in we need to take your rights to protect you is about time to throw off that tyrannical gov.
     
  12. tac foley

    tac foley Well-Known Member

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    Ah, that'll be the PIRA, using many weapons sent to them by their friends and supporters in the NE part of the USA. The last soldier to be murdered by the so-called Armagh sniper was Lance Bombardier Stephen Restorick, 23, who had been manning a vehicle checkpoint in Bessbrook, Co Armagh, when an IRA sniper struck in February 1997. He was smiling at a local Catholic woman as he handed back her driving licence when he was shot through the back with a high-velocity rifle.

    Lorraine McElroy, who was returning home from buying ice-cream for her two children, narrowly escaped with her life when bone fragments from L/Bdr Restorick's vertebrae hit her in the face, narrowly missing her eyes. He lived about twenty minutes up the road from me.

    The so-called sniper didn't have a long or happy life after his release by Tony B Liar under the terms of the good Friday Agreement...

    Read -

    The sniper who killed the last British Army victim of the Troubles shot by the IRA has died at his home, reportedly of natural causes.

    Bernard McGinn was the infamous IRA sniper who shot Lance Bombardier Stephen Restorick dead in Bessbrook in February 1997.

    The South armagh sniper was one of the most feared figures of The Troubles, shooting down soldiers from as far away as half a mile. He became a folk hero in Republican circles while derided by others.

    McGinn was 56 when he was found dead at his home in Monaghan town on Saturday.

    Police say it is thought he died of natural causes with a post mortem due to be held on Monday.

    An IRA volunteer at the age of 15, McGinn was the son of a local Sinn Fein councillor and the brother-in-law of current Sinn Fein deputy and Health spokesman Caoimhghín Ó Caoláin.

    The Irish Independent reports that McGinn was a member of one of two IRA sniper teams which used the deadly Barrett 50 M90 calibre sniper rifle.

    The rifle was used to kill a total of nine members of the British Army including Restorick who was gunned down as he chatted to a Catholic woman in Bessbrook in 1997.

    McGinn was apprehended by British Army SAS operatives at a farm near Crossmaglen on 10 April 1997.

    He confessed to his role in the IRA bombing campaign involving attacks in Northern Ireland and England.

    He implicated more than twenty members of the IRA’s South Armagh Brigade in his evidence and was sentenced to a total of 490 years in 1999 for 34 separate offences.

    They included his involvement in the 1992 bombing of the Baltic Exchange and the 1996 South Quay bombing, and the bombing of Hammersmith Bridge later the same year.

    McGinn was released in 2000 under the Good Friday Agreement.

    I hope that Tony B Liar catches a hefty does of the almighty sh*Ts, accompanied with uncontrollable sneezing, that last for the rest of his worthless life.
     
    Last edited: Jul 30, 2020
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  13. locutus

    locutus Well-Known Member Supporter

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    That sounds as bad as Kalifornia.
     
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  14. manta

    manta Well-Known Member Supporter

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    I have no doubt only for the peace talks at the time, he would not have being captured alive. He would have had a well deserved similar fate as his mates did at Loughgall.
     
    Last edited: Jul 30, 2020
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  15. Rifling82

    Rifling82 Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Holy Sh**:eek:...... God Bless merica!
     
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  16. Wambli

    Wambli Well-Known Member

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    Now why would anyone call this dirtbag a sniper?!?!? A sniper is an honorable profession that requires hugely specialized training and an amazing amount of natural skills and talent. This was some militia dirt bag with a scoped rifle.
     
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  17. tac foley

    tac foley Well-Known Member

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    Blame the UK press, and the PIRA weekly magazine - 'An Phoblacht' - for publicising his 'exploits'.
     
  18. tac foley

    tac foley Well-Known Member

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    And while we are at it - the 'don't like the look of that' syndrome pervades firearms licensing in the Republic of Ireland. As does the proclivity of officials to change their minds, based entirely on ignorance.

    Read about the problems had by a serving police officer - 'Garda' in Irish - committee member of two gun clubs, and his attempts to get a replacement stock. The main problem here, folks, is that the Irish Firearms Act makes EVERY component of a firearm into a firearm - all by itself.

    Garda challenges refusal to allow him import firearms accessory
    [​IMG]
    A Garda who is also a member of two gun clubs has brought a High Court challenge against the Revenue Commissioners' refusal to allow him import what he claims is a firearms accessory into the State.

    TUESDAY, JULY 28, 2020 - 19:25 PM
    ANN O’LOUGHLIN

    A Garda who is also a member of two gun clubs has brought a High Court challenge against the Revenue Commissioners' refusal to allow him import what he claims is a firearms accessory into the State [Edit - that what they call the Republic of Ireland].

    The challenge has been brought by Garda Michael Rochford, stationed in the Dundalk District, who has been involved in field sports for many years, and a committee member of two gun clubs.

    He is the lawful holder of several firearms, including .243 calibre Savage Axis II rifle. He claims the rifle comes with a stock that is prone to damage and scrapes due to it being made from a poor quality material.

    Last March he ordered a new stock for the gun online from an overseas manufacturer, which he said would enhanced the consistency, safety and reliability of his single bolt action rifle.

    In addition he also ordered a 'Buttpad spacer kit' which allows the stock to be adjusted to fit the owners [sic] dimensions, and two polymer magazines.

    He claims he does not require a special licence to import the items, and claims that the decision is unreasonable and unsustainable.

    In early April he was notified that the items had been seized by customs as the items were categorised under the 1925 Firearms Act as firearms.

    At all times he believed he did not need a licence to import the items, as they are not components in connection with the working of a gun, and do not alter the the function of a firearm.

    He also claims that when seizing the items Revenue failed to apply the correct statutory provision and has acted outside of its powers, and is now concerned that the items may be destroyed.

    He claims he sought clarification from the Department of Justice Firearms Section, which informed him the items in question can be imported without a licence.

    However in a subsequent conversation with an official with Revenue about the items he was informed that the official in the Department had since changed his view on the matter.

    In his action against the Office of the Revenue Commissioners Mr Rochford seeks various orders including ones quashing the notices of seizure sent to him in relation to the goods.

    He also seeks various declarations including that the defendant has erred in law by concluding that the items were liable to be forfeited on the basis of an erroneous interpretation of the 1925 Firearms Act.

    He further seeks a declaration the said items do not constitute a component part of a gun as set out in the 1925 Act and the 2017 EU Directive on the acquisition and possession of weapons. [Editor's note here, folks, note that all of a sudden we are talking about 'weapons' and NOT just firearms']

    The matter came before Mr Justice Charles Meenan, who on an ex-parte basis, granted the applicant permission to bring his judicial review challenge against Revenue.

    The matter was adjourned to a date in October.


    We'll have to wait a while and see what happens.

    So next time you feel like changing your rifle stock for an other one, and you just walk into your LGS, pay your money, and walk out again with it tucked under your arm, please remember poor Garda Michael Rochford and his almost-certainly insurmountable legal problem.
     
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  19. ellis36

    ellis36 Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Thanks for posting that, tac!

    A graphic description of how, once the nose of the camel gets under the tent-flap of "gun Control," the restrictions will continue to be added until, like tac says here...every component of a firearm is considered "a firearm." Every component of a round of ammunition is considered a "round of ammunition."

    Does anyone think this isn't exactly what would eventually happen in America under a Democrat administration? It would be their dream! With the laws written and enforced by
    dunderheads totally ignorant of anything except their own little version of power over the people. Witness the mayors, governors and various underlings in Democrat states and cities today and their emotional rules and regulations regarding the virus.

    Imagine giving them the power to write Gun Control policy?

    ellis
     
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  20. manta

    manta Well-Known Member Supporter

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    That would not be a issue in the UK, but it seems in the ROI things are stricter.