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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I'm not naive to the causes nor what's going on, but the resulting shortages of seemingly everything, even small parts, is still hard to believe and a bit frustrating. I've predicted and prepared as best I can for this day, but still just shopping around for simple parts like springs, firing pins, etc. finds most places OUT OF STOCK of most inventory. About the only items one can reliably find are bolt action hunting rifles and optics, but ammo for those has soared as well. Remaining inventory is up by a factor of 2-5x what it was a year or so ago... America is "out of stock" of guns, ammo, parts - it's surreal.

I started owning guns in the 1990s under the AWB, and have been active in the gun ownership and use community for over 2 decades. I lived thru the AWB, the 2000 election, the Obama admin and many spikes and valleys then, and the run up scarcities of the 2016 election...

I remember the AWB, and it seems gun companies and owners were less informed and way behind the curve. Certain items like magazines were very hard to acquire. But on the plus side, the surplus market was a gold mine of guns, and ammunition was quite affordable. So it seems like the really weak spots were getting good 11+ round magazines, and certain guns were neutered or modified to comply with the law (removed barrel threads, no bayo lugs, fixed stocks, thumbhole stocks to eliminate pistol grips, etc. - see California for current examples of this nonsense still in existence). I bought my first AR during this period, a neutered Bushmaster with fixed stock, no correct muzzle flash hider, no bayo lug, and one 10 round magazine for $1000 (which is $1500 today). I also had a Beretta 92FS. All my mags were basically worn out junk or cheaply made and not particularly reliable. I was frustrated with lack of reliability with those guns, but in hindsight the culprit was poor magazines.

I remember vividly the Obama years, major swings in prices but mostly upward. Tactical guns soared in price by about 3x and they along with mags became scarce at times. It seems magazines in particular really leapt in price for awhile, and I recall some AR and AK style mags at $50-$100 for a period. This bled into the expected Hillary victory in 2016, and I recall bare shelves and higher prices for remaining inventory of tactical weapons and accessories... But I think gun owners went thru a fatigue of buying, and by 2016, folks had settled down a bit and the panic wasn't nearly that of today as people seemed to settle in for the coming gun control...

However, we elected President Trump and gun prices plummeted for everything except C&Rs and Com-block weapons (those continued to rise). Suddenly, formerly cheap SKS and WASR AKMs were more spendy than an entry AR15 which would be had for under $400, with $5 magazines! We had four boon years for most guns including modern and tactical guns, with soaring innovations as well. So if you had the chance and didn't get something, and didn't, I share your frustrations. I thought I was well situated but even find that my hobby has been curbed as I try to source odds and ends and hit roadblocks and dead ends.

This is a strange surreal period where gun shops are slammed busy and shelves are nearly picked bare of ammo and tactical items, even with enforced quantity limitations. Finding something available and reasonably priced now seems like a victory! Reports from friends echo my experiences - deliveries take weeks longer; email alerts around the internet often result in items put in stock are sold out faster than one can input credit card information; hours of hunting to find a particular item in stock results in disappointment more than victory...

Having said that, it's important as a community we provide encouragement and resources to others on the prowl for specific items. I have been forwarding links to friends and strangers who have said they are looking for certain items, and helped several friends source ammo or guns for good prices. Let's stick together on this and hopefully ride out this storm.
 

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You must be too young to remember the incompetent Carter years when people sat in line for simple gasoline. Dementia wasn't his excuse. Perhaps it was just plain stupidity. The only good thing I remember was buying CD's paying 21% as a young kid. That's right 21%, and yes, inflation was ridiculous. The more I think about it, yes, it was simple stupidity and add in heavy doses of ignorance. Yes, help one another with guns and parts.
 

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When the govt tried to take over gasoline distribution? I wasn't driving quite yet, but I remember my pop filling up on aviation gasoline in his truck at work, because it was there.
 

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When the govt tried to take over gasoline distribution? I wasn't driving quite yet, but I remember my pop filling up on aviation gasoline in his truck at work, because it was there.
No. It had nothing to do with gasoline distribution. It had everything with OPEC being a monopoly just like Boden is helping create right now with fracking bans (he doesn't even know what it is) and pipeline killing fountain pen signatures. Biden doesn't put gasoline in his car because he doesn't have one nor does he have the cognitive abilities to drive one. Carter had no gonads to stand up to OPEC. Better quit.
 

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Carter had better quit? Yes, the Peanut Farmer is still regarded as one of the worst presidents in history, and he should have quit. Like I said, I wasn't driving yet - started driving in 1984, Volvo 142S.
 

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American shooter's have dealt with the high's and low's of Politics vs 2nd Amendment for many decades. The Left hates that the citizen's have the Right to Bear Arm's. They want the citizen's to be totally controlled, and reliant on the Government. They have learned throughout history that unarmed citizen's can easily be controlled, and don't have much ability to stand against those that are in power.

For decades the Left has been taking control over many aspects of American's lives. Education, Healthcare, Big business, the Internet, etc.. They are like cancer, they start off as a small tumor and then spread to the rest of the body if they aren't dealt with and eliminated. They have gotten very good at getting control without much of a fight from the Right.

2020 was the perfect storm. An Election year with a Republican President that was really good at pissing his support's off with his daily BS tweet's, rants, and pissing off the House & Senate Republican's as well.
Next, Throw in Covid 19. For month's the entire country was shut down. Manufacturing was brought to a stand still with most every business being affected.
Then Remington and all the other companies under their umbrella went bankrupt, so there are many different models of firearms under several brands that cease to being produced anymore, along with ammo, primers, brass, and gun parts.

Now, throw in all the BLM & ANTIFA riots across the country, and American's start getting scared for their lives and safety.
People that generally wouldn't buy or own firearm's rushed to every store and online to buy anything that they could get their hands on. It didn't take long for the shelves to become bare. Once the panic started, then everyone went to the store's and bought anything they could. Some are hoarding, other's are re-selling for high profit's.

Producers of goods can't just ramp up production, they make X amount of product in 24 hours. They also have contracts with other businesses and the Government that require X amount of items produced to go to those contracts.
Consumer supply is usually near the bottom of the list when it comes to production.

Most long time shooter's have been through situation's like this before, so we learned long ago to stock up when stuff was plentiful at regular or sale prices.
Those that didn't heed the warnings, or those that are new to Shooting sport's are just SOL, and waited too long to buy stuff when it was available.

Given the current situation, I don't see an end to it for several years. Glad I've been stocked up on everything for years.
 

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YUP. "We Want Something Done But Not To Us !" is what I'm hearing more and more.
People are scared and disgusted. Money runs the government these days and politicians care less about the people than lining their own pockets (and their childrens; as well). Neither party represents me right now on the national level.

When there ain't a box of .22's to be had on a retail store's shelves anywhere in my town, we are in deep manure.

I don't want anyone hurt. However, I can think of some I wish to be stuck in traffic with a case of explosive diareah and unstoppable sneezing.
 

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You don't remember anything like this? Two words, Sandy Hook. Everything dried up in the years following. Entry level AR's selling for $1000+, (I know. I sold a Bushmaster Carbon 15 for $1200), if you could find one. Pretty much any caliber ammo, 22lr in particular, gone. It took many years, but things eventually returned to normal. Will there be a recovery this time? I wonder.
 

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The current situation is caused by panic buying brought on by the spectre of a liberal president taking their guns, the unrest caused by Antifa and BLM earlier this year and the pandemic.

There will be some cheap firearms and ammo whenever the panic ends.
 

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There will be some cheap firearms and ammo whenever the panic ends.
Hope you're right. In the past I would've agreed. These days, in the current climate, I'm not so sure.
 

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Panic and profiteering by those who cleaned out the gun shops of primers and sell them online. $100 for a box of 1000 is rediculous
 

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Panic and profiteering by those who cleaned out the gun shops of primers and sell them online. $100 for a box of 1000 is rediculous
This is a good article from Outdoor Life:

"This isn’t fiction, it’s been happening for months across the country. In fact, it has gotten so bad that some of these scalpers have gone so far as to obtain delivery schedules from employees at large stores like Walmart. They arrive at the store at a specific time to get the choice pickings. I spoke to two sporting-goods employees at my local Walmart who freely informed me that ammunition usually arrives on Tuesdays and is typically restocked at 10 a.m. each week.

I also spoke with a scalper, who wished to remain unnamed, who told me that he had made approximately $30,000 dollars in profit last fall by buying ammunition cheap and selling it locally, or on GunBroker.com, at heavily inflated prices. He said people are terrified of the future and are willing to pay almost any price today, for fear it will be even more expensive tomorrow—if it’s even available at all. While there’s no way to quantify how much ammo is being scalped, experts in the industry say that it’s happening often enough to impact the market at large."



Scalpers Are Driving Up Ammunition Costs and Contributing to the Ammo Shortage | Outdoor Life
 

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To me panic buying is like a disease . 9 months ago some people thought they were never going to make toilet paper again and now it’s bullets and reloading supplies. What’s next?
 

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This panic has spread to things muzzleloader too. Many muzzleloader folks are unable to find caps and propellant, especially black powder. Luckily, i found a supply of #11 percussion caps during the last panic and stocked up well at @ $2.99 per hundred.
 

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Son works for a reloading company. They're 4 months behind in filling orders, predicts the present shortage to run for up to two years. All events (Shot Show and overseas Germany, South Africa, etc.) where they usually set up are cancelled. Travel restrictions ebb and flow, so conducting normal business isn't happening. Shortages in one area (lead for example) ripple across the industry. One thing's obvious - it's not competition shooters causing shortages - for there are darn few competitive events happening although I've seen some "tentative" dates for next summer.

Tannerite disappeared here over the last month. Curious to me.
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
You don't remember anything like this? Two words, Sandy Hook. Everything dried up in the years following. Entry level AR's selling for $1000+, (I know. I sold a Bushmaster Carbon 15 for $1200), if you could find one. Pretty much any caliber ammo, 22lr in particular, gone. It took many years, but things eventually returned to normal. Will there be a recovery this time? I wonder.
Yes, and as I've stated in the original post, I believe this is worse than the Sandy Hook fallout as it pertains to spikes in guns, ammo, and accessories. That was quite bad, however our current situation has been going on and getting worse for about 11 months now. The local Cabellas and gun shops are essentially OUT OF STOCK on anything tactical or defense related. Across the internet, every vendor has pages of OOS. The barely remaining inventory is marked up significantly and limits on quantities apply. You cannot even find ARs or AKs in stock, they sell immediately north of $1000 when they do go in stock. Used ones are scarce and similar situation. Formerly $400 Anderson and PSA builds are a grand.

If there is any upside, people have had 16+ years since the expiration of the 2004 AWB to stock up. Back when Obama won a surprise election in 2008, the first real big spike, people were caught with their pants down unprepared just 4 years after the AWB expired.

So a big difference now, is that long-term gun owners are or should be pretty well set to ride this out, even long term. If nothing else, we had at least 3 good years from 2017, 2018, 2019 to stock up on cheap good quality items. Back in 2004-2008, the AWB expired but there was a 2 front war, causing some shortages. There was no Magpul. The current industries and innovations did not exist or were in their infancy. Then Obama's 8 years of multiple spikes, then the 2016 primaries, it was a near never ending shortage with brief periods of good times to get items.

To me panic buying is like a disease . 9 months ago some people thought they were never going to make toilet paper again and now it’s bullets and reloading supplies. What’s next?
Nobody is submitting bills to ban toilet paper. Nobody ran on the idea of banning toilet paper. Nobody promised to ban toilet paper. Any thinking person would have had 6 months on hand since it's so cheap and useful and stores indefinitely. And any thinking person knew that supply would catch demand. You will be able to buy more TP in the future.

As for the spikes in guns, ammo, and accessories - it is quite rational. The admin can do a lot of long term damage to the industry with various EOs and a leftist CON-gress. I'm not going to offer ideas here but it can cripple the industry overnight. And it has promised to do just that. The next item you buy might be the last...
 

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I don’t know about that, with the current administration toilet paper being made from trees might also be in danger of targeted legislation.:oops:
 

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One thing that doesn't cost less for ammo makers are their fixed costs. Add to that their supplies and raw materials have increased for the same reasons everyone else's has. Their factories have to practice distancing, their capacity is therefore reduced and they still have to run profitably or not at all. There is a lot of simple accounting involved. The Federal, Speer, CCI CEO got slammed for telling the truth. Not many people would want to be in his place. Add to that hoarding and here we are. It isn't hard to understand for anyone that took basic accounting.
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
One thing that doesn't cost less for ammo makers are their fixed costs. Add to that their supplies and raw materials have increased for the same reasons everyone else's has. Their factories have to practice distancing, their capacity is therefore reduced and they still have to run profitably or not at all. There is a lot of simple accounting involved. The Federal, Speer, CCI CEO got slammed for telling the truth. Not many people would want to be in his place. Add to that hoarding and here we are. It isn't hard to understand for anyone that took basic accounting.
These are good points. Every step in the supply chain is impacted by Covid issues, higher fuel prices (up 20% in my area since the election), long-term scarcity beginning 11 months ago, other industries suffering from Covid and shipping interruptions, and so forth.

This is a perfect storm of supply chain problems and worries about future legislation, and yet another example of how people MUST be prepared for this stuff...
 
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