How I practice shooting. What do you think?

Discussion in 'Training & Safety' started by aliendroid, Sep 7, 2009.

  1. aliendroid

    aliendroid New Member

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    So I've owned a handgun for over 10 years but never really tried to learn to shoot well until one day at the firing range I noticed from about 7 yards that I was grouping them on the target but not on the x and I asked the guy at the counter what I was doing wrong. To cut the story short I paid for 2 hours of lessons. Now I can put every bullet in a 6 inch diameter group from 15 yards whereas before from that distance I couldn't even hit the target half the time and that was only 3 shooting sessions ago :eek: .

    My problem is that I brace and flench before for the recoil, so the way I've been working that out is with fake plastic bullets.

    I fill a mag with 3 real : 1 fake bullet at random and I try to shoot so that when I happen to come on a plastic bullet, my sights do not move away from the x after the trigger is pulled. Very hard to do.
    Next I fill a mag with 1 real bulet : 3 fake bullets at random and do the same thing. It is easier to do when the chance of the next bullet being fake is higher.
    Then I repeat over and over switching between the two above ratios.
    I find that my shooting gets better between the start and end of each shooting session. The last mag has only real bullets in it.

    Are there any other tips that people out there have to getting better?
     
  2. IGETEVEN

    IGETEVEN New Member

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    You already are doing a good firing practice exercise using the mix snap caps or plastic rounds and live rounds in your mags. Continue this with several mix and match mags loaded with the snap caps or plastic rounds and live rounds, not knowing when a dummy round will chamber. Doing this will get you proficient in controlling your sight picture and not dropping the front sight during your follow through trigger squeeze, no matter what round chambers. A Note about Pulling the Trigger. Your trigger pull should be a smoothly applied, constantly increasing force, like you are depressing a spring. Hell, you are depressing a spring. One of the mental games that helped me quite a bit is this:

    Pretend that the front sight is attached to the trigger. When pressure is applied to the trigger, the front sight moves rearward towards the rear sight. The goal of pulling the trigger is to pull the front sight post straight though the center of the rear sight notch. With enough practice, you will feel like you are steering the gun with the trigger, mainly because you are. Here is a very helpful chart that will give you an idea of what you may see if you are not following through correctly in your shot placement. It's a keeper. Practice, practice and more practice. :)

    Jack
     

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  3. ktmboyz

    ktmboyz New Member

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    Dummy rounds are also excellent for the practice of clearing misfires or malfunctions. Tap, rack and refire
     
  4. Rentacop

    Rentacop Well-Known Member

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  5. mr1911

    mr1911 New Member

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    I'm no bullseye specialist, but after years of self deffense practice I noticed trigger controll to be the greatest asset to accuracy, focus on your trigger, ignore re-coil as if it doesn't even exist, the more you shoot the less you'll even notice any recoil and all the flinching and jerking will go away.
     
  6. aliendroid

    aliendroid New Member

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    Thanks for the tips
     
  7. aliendroid

    aliendroid New Member

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    I'm going to the range today. I've been going about once per week.
     
  8. TelstaR

    TelstaR New Member

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    This is why I alway suggest that a person learn the basics with a 22 revolver. They dont get the bad habits and when they move up to higher cal they dont get the flinch.
     
  9. G21.45

    G21.45 New Member

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    :rolleyes: Oh, boy! I'm debating: Should I make you some of you guys smarter, or just remain quiet?

    I've been training people how to shoot for almost 25 years. I've seen it all; I've done it all, too. You do NOT, 'steer' a pistol with the trigger. If you have that impression it's only because you have a correct grip on the pistol's frame; and, that grip is leading you to believe that you're, 'steering' the front sight by some other means than a proper grasp.

    At 16 yards I can empty a magazine into a 4" circle as fast as the slide will cycle. (I'll post proof if anyone wants to see some of my targets.) Let me talk to you about that presumed, 'trigger flinch' you're working on: It's NOT really a flinch. It only looks that way to the, perhaps, cognizant but, otherwise, unwitting eye.

    What you are actually dealing with is an, 'OUT-OF-SEQUENCE' reflex action. When you learn how to fire a pistol very quickly AND very accurately you will discover that you actually need to, 'flinch' in order to manage the front sight and hit the target well.

    'Flinch' at the wrong time in the same manner that most people do when firing at a slower rate and what you'll see (among other things) is the muzzle taking a nose dive. 'Reflex' at the right time and what you'll see is the front sight pull back down and, nest approximately 2/3rd's of its height into the rear sight notch. (One of the secrets of shooting very quickly is to always hold slightly low on the target; that way you don't have to wait on the front sight to fully nest.)

    'Ball & dummy' drills are a good way for any semiskilled pistol shooter to learn how to hit the target. The problem is that the best combat pistol shooters, all, have to move on past this stage of personal performance. Over the years I have developed a specific training regimen for learning how to do this while expending the fewest possible number of rounds.

    I'll be honest with you: I don't need the glory and don't feel like posting any of the particulars over the internet. If you want to get into this further with me, send a PM. I don't mind taking up this subject with you in personal correspondence.

    For now what you're doing is fine. However, what you don't want to do is to remain on the present, 'learning plateau' forever. You do NOT control the muzzle with the trigger. Furthermore, when you get really good at this, inside 12 yards you really don't need the front sight. You can hit the target, strictly, off the back of the slide. ;)
     
  10. IGETEVEN

    IGETEVEN New Member

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    1). With all due respect, and barely sir, you should of taken your own advice and remained quiet.

    2). I don't know where you have been for almost a year, and out of nowhere, you show up and you are the authority and final word on firearms training and shooting technics. Where are your manors, patience and courtesy that one would expect from a well seasoned instructor like yourself. You show up here and proceed to tell everyone that their way of shooting and training is all wrong and yours is the only right way. You would think in 25 years, especially for someone who has "seen it all and has done it all too" as you claim, one would be familiar with several different training and shooting exercises and know that everyone instructs and learns differently. And as long as poor training technics are not used and poor shooting habits result from the instructions, the end results will be proper firearm handling and learned shooting habits.

    I did not have the privilege of learning my shooting and firearms instructions through an "NRA Instructor" all my real training and experience came from military instructors, with years of real shooting and training experience. Daily and continuously hands on practicing and shooting with close team members. Exposure, training and proficient use of various handguns, rifles and ordinances. Real combat experience and various firearms and training schools (sniper). Real world shooting at various targets that get close, move, shoot back, and bleed for just as long or longer than you claim. I still train and shoot with civilian, military, police and SWAT qualified instructors with the same years of training, skills and experience that you have stated and I still continue to learn. ;)

    3). If you were honest and you did not feel you did not need the glory as you stated, to post over the internet, you sure seem to be tooting your own horn awfully loud. :rolleyes:

    4). "When you get really good at this, inside 12 yards you really don't need the front sight. You can hit the target, strictly, off the back of the slide."

    This is the only shooting advice that you stated, that IMHO, was the only true final product from real shooting experience worth listening to for any beginners or advanced shooters.

    Thank you for enlightening this forum with your superior knowledge and obvious skills and your many years of firearms instruction. I hope your advice will not be confused for arrogance and ego by the other forum members. It is always nice to hear advice, comments, and beneficial shooting instructions and opinions from qualified instructors like yourself and other experienced forum members. I myself, have in all of this, learned something new sir, from even you. :)

    Jack
     
    Last edited: Sep 13, 2009
  11. G21.45

    G21.45 New Member

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    :eek: Oh, my goodness! That was an interesting little internet tiff. Jack, are you aware that your reply reads like you're the, 'king of this forum' or something! (And all because I called you out on a silly mistake.) Well, I know better than to be drawn into an internet argument with someone like you; so, all I'm going to say is, yes, you are wrong; and your ego is about 10 sizes too large for your hat size.

    You're right about one of the observations you've made above: I was talking specifically to you; but, that's because, in the little time I've gotten to know you, you are unquestionably someone with a desperate need to (Ready?) 'get even'.

    Not going to go there with you, Jack - Nope, wouldn't be prudent. ;) So, try to live with being criticized. In time you'll get over it; and, if worse should come to worse, remember: IT'S ONLY THE INTERNET! Life goes on, Jack; and, with your ego, if you continue to throw little tiffs like this then you're going to be nothing but sad and angry all of the time.

    That's it, Jack. The field is yours; I'm out of the thread. Try to have a nice day for yourself - OK. (Gee, I can't get over the feeling that I just spoke with royalty, or something!) :p





    PS: My eye just caught it; you write better than average, Jack; but, the word is, 'techniques'. Thank you for paying me the compliment of, 'learning from me' as you say.

    (I was, kind 'a, hoping that you wouldn't; and, yet, apparently you have! Know what? I'm genuinely impressed.)
     
    Last edited: Sep 13, 2009
  12. RL357Mag

    RL357Mag New Member

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    Last edited: Sep 13, 2009
  13. cpttango30

    cpttango30 New Member

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    G21 you roll in here stating that you have. "Done it all and seen it all". But, you will not post targets or video's of your exploits to show any proof.

    I can kill people at 3000 yards. But I don't need your approval so I will not post any. That is a big statement

    Jack on the other hand doesn't make statements like that on this board. He is a valued and respected member that doesn't give bad advice (Unlike yourself). He treats posters with respect (Again unlike yourself). IIRC your post a year ago were not that good either.

    I suggest that if you want a fight you will find a rather large HORD of Supporting Members standing side by side in a formation known as a phalanx. I would choose wisely for the truth will set you free and the lies will get you hit with the Rabid Ban Hamster.
     
  14. Gojubrian

    Gojubrian New Member

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    I'm on Jack's side, just for the record. :D My first thought after reading your initial post was, "oh well! please excuse us little peons!!"

    That said, I'm not overly impressive with shooting a pistol. :p
     
  15. IGETEVEN

    IGETEVEN New Member

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    You are correct about that Sir, but in my defense, I like Colt 1911's and S&W's and I am only protecting and marking my territory...........:D

    Jack
     

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  16. Gojubrian

    Gojubrian New Member

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    HOLY CRAP!!! ROFL!!!! That's just wrong. :D
     
  17. IGETEVEN

    IGETEVEN New Member

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    I would like to share this "true to life" training video and feel that all "NRA Instructors" or any instructors, no matter who they are or how long they have instructed firearms training should watch. One should become familiar with many different forms and styles of firearms training techniques for well rounded experience and learning and to pass that knowledge on to your students.

    The ETADIK form of firearms instruction and training is a proven, applied, verified and certified form with proven results and training for military, and one of many forms of training and instruction, that I personally attended. Also, feel free to view the other fine training/shooting videos contained on that same page, if one looks, you may see someone familiar in one. :cool:

    [ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N4HIrdMMhpM]YouTube - ETADIK[/ame]

    Jack
     
  18. SGT-MILLER

    SGT-MILLER New Member

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    G21.45, I'm calling you out.

    Your post is wrong, and you are uninformed. You are teaching bad habits to your students, and I believe you may get someone killed.

    Don't puff up your chest and act like the big dog around here without having the guts to back it up.

    I gather you are an NRA Certified Instructor. What level of firearms handling to you teach, and what is your real world experience to cause you to have such an ego?

    Tell me yours, and I'll tell you mine.........
     
  19. tiberius10721

    tiberius10721 New Member

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    You know some one would have to be a real loser to come on the internet and pump up their chest the way G 21 did. Im 37 years old and have been shooting since I was 9 and while I may know a tiny bit more than the average joe about fire arms and shooting I dont come online and pretend to know it all. Thank god my golf instructor doesnt have that kinda of attitude. people can brag about their shooting skills all day long but the reality is that most shootouts happen at close range like within 7 yards and whoever keeps their cool will probabley win the gun battle. Oh and my favorite trick for good trigger pull while zeroing a rifle is putting a dime on the end of a cleaning rod and see if you can pull the trigger without the dime falling off. I learned that in the army before going to the range to qualify with my M-16 a2 and I still practice that way today
     
    Last edited: Sep 14, 2009