Help ID pump action .22 pistol

Discussion in 'General Handgun Discussion' started by bargeahead, Nov 3, 2013.

  1. bargeahead

    bargeahead New Member

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    This is an unusual piece. Originally thought it was a modified rifle from a pic but after holding it, that isn't the case. No manufacturer stamped or indicated anywhere ( at least not visible )

    Has serial # 57**** ( six digit )
    B ( B centered under number )

    Anybody ???? THX
     

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  2. nitestalker

    nitestalker New Member

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    That is a Winchester Mdl. 62 pump action rifle. It has been modified to provide a Federal felony charge for the owner. If the serial numbers are missing it is most likely stolen. :rolleyes:
     

  3. bargeahead

    bargeahead New Member

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    Sorry but this is NOT a modified rifle. I thought so when last week I only saw a pic. I figured the receiver tangs had been bent down to accept a pistol grip. I handled it today and can assure this was manufactured as a handgun.

    The entire serial number is plain but I don't believe in posting complete numbers.

    This has two wood grips that are attached to a handgun frame just like a Smith or Colt.
     
  4. nitestalker

    nitestalker New Member

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    Last edited: Nov 3, 2013
  5. bargeahead

    bargeahead New Member

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    It's not mine and again, it is not a modified rifle.

    It is old, old. If it was originally blued the bluing has worn off.

    This is a rifle type receiver granted, but it was manufactured seamlessly with a revolver frame relative to the grip.

    If I knew how to post a vid of the action without going thru YouTube I would because it's...........unusual to me.
     
  6. SSGN_Doc

    SSGN_Doc Well-Known Member

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    It is possible that a skilled gunsmith did modify a old Winchester rifle into a pistol before the National Firearms Act in the 1930s. It may not have been a felony at the time of manufacture but ownership now may indeed require registration with the ATF. I'm not sure about any grandfather clauses or how a subsequent transfer would work out, or if it would be classified as a pistol if the conversion occurred prior to the NFA.

    Gunsmiths back then were really very capable of making a pretty seamless conversion.

    I also don't know of every gun it there so, there may have been legit pistols from that era as well, but Winchester gallery guns were very common pump .22s.
     
  7. bargeahead

    bargeahead New Member

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  8. mountainman13

    mountainman13 New Member

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    Everything from the grip forward definitely looks to be an old Winchester 22.
     
  9. bargeahead

    bargeahead New Member

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    This is getting interesting. Guys, I really appreciate the concern and was originally of the same opinion re modified rifle.

    The steel is close to but a bit better than that of a Civil War era Colt Navy.

    It is old enough that any finish has worn off and the expected pitting is evident and uniform. The construction is such that any seams no matter how well done could be seen. They just ain't there.

    Alternative: Someone with more money than needed commissioned a master gunsmith to use receiver parts, cast/forge a custom handgun frame to mate to the receiver, appropriate sized barrel, etc, etc, etc.

    Also; there is no feed slot in the tube mag. The spring loaded ram/insert must be totally removed to load the tube mag ( capacity unknown; don't know whether short, long, LR or all/any ).

    I have to go back with my camera rather than my phone to get a series of good pics.

    Also note the lack of a full trigger guard....????
     
    Last edited: Nov 3, 2013
  10. nitestalker

    nitestalker New Member

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    There were no guns "Grand Fathered". Back in the day the expensive fees altered owner ship of most listed guns. If you are apprehended transporting that gun or crossing state lines it will be damn serious.:(
     
  11. bargeahead

    bargeahead New Member

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    I truly appreciate the concern. This is not mine and I won't be transporting it anywhere.

    Antique it definitely is. Unique it definitely is.

    You guys have given me the idea of contacting Winchester and sending the better pics I gotta get and see if they have any records of such a gun.

    That 3/4 trigger guard has me ?????????????

    I may also send the pics to my ATF field agent to see if he/they have ever come across such a gun.

    Good discourse guys; THX.
     
  12. nitestalker

    nitestalker New Member

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    Be aware the BATFE will order the gun surrendered . You will have to identify the owner etc. If it is not yours allow the owner to contact the Feds. :)
     
  13. texaswoodworker

    texaswoodworker New Member

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    It definitely looks to be a severely modified Winchester Model 62. It's possible that someone about 80 years ago made this originally as a pistol, but unless you can find definitive proof, it would be in your best interest to avoid this gun like the plaque. If the feds ever find you with it, you'll be facing a LONG prison sentence, and you'll loose your right to have guns. It's not worth it. I'd advise your friend to get rid of it immediately.

    If it is in fact a legal pistol, c3shooter might know what it is. He's extremely knowledgeable when it comes to old guns like this. If he doesn't see this thread, I'd shoot him a PM.

    [​IMG]

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    [​IMG]
     
  14. bargeahead

    bargeahead New Member

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    I'm a FFL and have a good relationship with the regional BATFE and considering the age of the firearm it most likely will not come under the SBR regs. Even if so; with the new regs it will only need a fee for IL after application and the unique valuation will probably go up.
     
  15. hiwall

    hiwall Active Member

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    A Winchester model 1906 with that serial number would be made in 1919
    A Winchester model 1890 with that serial number would be made in 1916 or 1917
     
  16. bargeahead

    bargeahead New Member

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    Thank you !

    This reminds me of a Colt 22 ( that's the model, Colt 22 ) that we had thru the shop early this year. It was unique re the finish. It couldn't be found in any data base. Contact with Colt Custom Shop resulted in a response " Oh wow man, Colt did a bunch of things that didn't really ever get recorded but we sure might have done that on a special order ".
     
  17. 1911love

    1911love New Member

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    Why would it fall under NFA? It has no butt stock and no forward grip. Wouldn't it be treated like an AR pistol?
     
  18. robocop10mm

    robocop10mm Lifetime Supporting Member Lifetime Supporter

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    The presumption is it is a modified rifle. Despite claims to the contrary, that is the most likely scenario. Once a rifle, always a rifle. A rifle with a barrel less than 16" (regardless of the presence or absence of a butt stock) is the very definition of an SBR. AR pistols are pistols because they were made as pistols and not modified from existing rifles.
     
  19. texaswoodworker

    texaswoodworker New Member

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    IIRC, there is no legal way to turn a rifle into a pistol (except for a very few special exceptions). You can turn a rifle into a short barrel rifle, o you can turn a pistol into a rifle, but you cannot turn a rifle into a pistol.
     
  20. 1911love

    1911love New Member

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    Thanks for clearing that up guys.