Hawk 12 ga. Pump defense shotgun

Discussion in 'General Shotgun Discussion' started by Leavingplatoscomphycave, Feb 22, 2010.

  1. is this knock of of a 870 even worth purchasing? i hear mixed reviews. is the price to good to be true? do ya get what ya pay for?

    HAWK 12 GA. PUMP DEFENSE SHOTGUN
     
  2. ghost ring?

    and they claim to come with ghost ring sights.... cant be tritium can it? i thought that costs as much as they are asking for the riot gun?
     

  3. robocop10mm

    robocop10mm Lifetime Supporting Member Lifetime Supporter

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    I could not see any details about where they are made. Norinco (China)?

    I do not know about parts interchangability with Remington.

    If they are from Norinco, they had some issues with gritty actions on the Win 97 copies a few years ago.

    The 870 is not my favorite platform. Give me a Winchester 1300 (FN)
     
  4. DarinCraft

    DarinCraft New Member

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    +1 on Robo's post. In addition, I would not trust a knock off. A lot of times they use inferior materials. Although, it might be identical to the 870 in platform, the quality is just not there. Take it from for what it is worth, but if you were willing to spend the money on a Saiga, then I would spend that on an American pump. The 1300, 870, 500 and 590 are all great choices and will not let you down.

    When you are talking 12 ga especially with defense loads the gun takes a lot of abuse. This is the what breaks the cheaper guns. There are some guns you can go a little cheaper on like the hi points, but when it comes to something like a shotty you need to remember this will probably be the most used gun in your collection. They are truly multipurpose. I know that if my 590 or 1100 breaks, I can call Brownells or Midway and get parts. Can you do that when the knockoff breaks?
     
  5. DarinCraft

    DarinCraft New Member

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    Ghost ring is a type of sight and tritium is an insert for all types of sight that make them visible at night. In answer, no ghost ring does not mean tritium.
     
  6. MAX100

    MAX100 New Member

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    The Hawk Ind 982 is a well made 870 style shotgun. It's better made than the budget 870 Express. The 982 has been in the US for over 10 years now and it has been proved to be a very durable and reliable defense shotgun. Do your research, there aren't any mix reviews, 98% are all good from the ones who "own" them. Many don't like them because they are made in China and the fact is they have never owned and know nothing about them. Remington NEF also sells there own version that's made by Hawk Ind, the NEF Pardner Pump. It's the same shotgun as the 982 with a different style receiver.

    Machined extractor & ejector like the 870P
    Thick very durable Rynite polymer stock not hollow, nice recoil pad that is held on by machine screws & brass inserts, not wood screws in plastic
    Parkerized finish
    Nice ghost ring sights
    "All" 870 parts will fit
    Thicker hardened steel receiver than the 870
    They aren't pretty, they have a utility tactical shotgun look to them that I like. They are a great beater shotgun that can take the punishment. The action is a little gritty but very easy to smooth out because it's an 870 action.

    It's the best deal in a defense shotgun out there.


    GC
     
    Last edited: Feb 23, 2010
  7. DarinCraft

    DarinCraft New Member

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    I firmly believe you can disagree without attacking the merit or experience of the person who disagrees with you. You can respectfully disagree, but the key word is respectfully. He asked our opinion and we gave it.

    I am glad you have experience with them and give a positive opinion. If you are telling the truth then he should purchase one and be as happy as you are. From what you wrote they sound like a very nice gun and hopefully will withstand the test of time.
     
    Last edited: Feb 23, 2010
  8. MAX100

    MAX100 New Member

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    How can make a statement like that with no experience to go on.

    They aren't new out. They have been in the US for about 11 years with thousands sold. To me that's withstanding the test time. Guns & Ammo magazine gave the Hawk 98, same shotgun, a very good review 10 years ago in their July 2000 issue.


    GC
     
    Last edited: Feb 23, 2010
  9. DarinCraft

    DarinCraft New Member

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    I see you completely missed the point of my statement, so answering your question would be moot. Have a nice day.
     
  10. noeandres25

    noeandres25 New Member

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    i wantto buy a pistol and forend grip frmy 982 shotgun . the remington 870 pistol and forend grip will ft it right?
     
  11. 995

    995 New Member

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    I like that Lever Action 12 gauge
     
  12. IGETEVEN

    IGETEVEN New Member

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    Me too! Brings back memories. :cool:
     

    Attached Files:

  13. MAX100

    MAX100 New Member

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    Correct. The metal forend tube on the 982 is a little larger in diameter than the 870 so it will be a very tight fit. You might have to tap it on with a rubber hammer. You can remove it with a socket the same size as the forend tube; just tap the forend tube out.

    GC
     
  14. UnderFire

    UnderFire New Member

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    11 yrs. isn't much of a span for examining "the test of time".
    Obviously they couldn't come up with their own design so they had to copy an American classic that has withstood the test of time.

    The Hawk's MSRP being $229.95, I would go with a Mossberg instead.

    Winchester Defender series is always a cool choice...the fastest pump action of all of them. :cool:
     
  15. MAX100

    MAX100 New Member

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    Remington H&R NEF thinks so because they added the Hawk Ind made Pardner Pump to their line up about 5 years ago and back them with their excellent Warranty. They are big money makers because they have a very low return rate. They expanded the line in 2009.

    The 870 Express manufactured in the last 5 years or so has been having problems with shells sticking chamber. Do a Google search on 870: 870 jamming, 870 FTE, 870 shells sticking chamber...ect. Do the same for the Hawk 982 and see what you come up with on both searches.

    The 982 is an improve version of the 870 as a tactical defense shotgun.

    *Improved shell carrier/lifter , no need for a flexi-tab
    *Barrel ring located higher up which gives room to mount a flashlight rail mount in front of the forend. It holds 5+1 without a tube extension, 4+1 on the 870. With an added tube extension it's a stronger setup because the extension is shorter, 3.5". No need for a mag clamp.
    *Thicker steel receiver

    They are a heck of a deal.


    GC
     
  16. UnderFire

    UnderFire New Member

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    Dude you really need to compare apples to apples and oranges to oranges...
    We're talking defensive shotguns not econo hunting shotguns. :rolleyes:

    No need to do a google search, but you should before you post.
    I'm well aware of the QC issues the newer 870 Express have. The newer ones are not any kind of comparison to the older 870 Express.

    The Remington 870 made it's debute in 1950 (60 yrs. ago). For years now remington has offered variations of the 870 for law enforcement. The latest being the model 870P MAX. This particular model is intended for tactical use.
    Why don't you compare your Hawk 982 to that model (870P MAX) instead of to an econo 870 Express.
    The 870P has more durable parts as compared to the 870 Express, different extractors,ejectors,etc. The 870P wasn't modeled after the hawk...in reality it was the other way around. The Hawk 982 didn't help the 870 line with any improvements at all. The 870 Express is an econo shotgun therefore made with inexpensive parts.
    870's have been patrol/security shotguns since the late 60's, into the 70's and still used until this day. How many police departments use a Hawk 982?
    870's have seen military duty (1966) and is used by uniformed U.S. Secret Service.

    A test of time is one of the most important measures of the success or failure of any given product. 870's: continuous production since 1950, over 7 million sold. Safe to say it has withstood the test of time. Period. But not when a shotgun is 11yrs. old and only thousands sold. That's not even a drop in the bucket. :rolleyes:
    So in reality a Hawk 982 isn't any kind of a comparison to the 870 line. For it to be thought of as better is a very naive opinion. There's no comparison what-so-ever.

    Now I'll address this misinformation.
    As far as Remington adding H&R/NEF to their product line...actually it's a marketing support service. Where Remington will act per say like the Big Brother Co. and help out H&R/NEF with advertising, warranty and other issues. Remington offers this marketing support to help smaller mfg's to effectively promote their business/product(s). So sure, Remington believes in the H&R/NEF's product enough to give them support, but not enough to add them to Remington's product line. How you choose your wording (Remington H&R NEF) one would think it's a merger and it is Not. Remington is helping a sister company get successful. Other big/successful companys do the same thing in their related markets.

    To the OP-
    When Hawk 982 are compared to Mossberg's defense shotguns it isn't " a heck of a deal".
    For 30-40 bucks more you'll get a lot more with Mossberg. Like all hugely successful designs, it has been produced in many configurations and is in current use by the U.S. military, which is a sure sign that the thing is tough. ;) I wouldn't buy a copy I rather have the real McCoy.
     
  17. MAX100

    MAX100 New Member

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    The Hawk 982 is a much better deal and more durable than the Mossberg 500. The Hawk 982 is about $100 less.

    Hawk 982 has:

    *Steel receiver - better more durable than aluminum receiver on the 500. Steel cost more to machine
    *Nice set of ghost ring sights - GRS aren't cheap to purchase after market
    *982 has a open mag tube - On the Mossberg 500 you have to remove the mag tube to clean it out or to replace the spring and follower and the standard 500 can't accept a tube extension.
    *Machine aluminum trigger guard - plastic guard on the 500
    *The 870 design is easier to take down and clean

    Hawk 982 with ghost ring sights - $200. Rem 870P with GRS - $725

    The 870P is a more refined shotgun than the Hawk 982 but it cost over 3 times as much. It's not any more durable or reliable.

    982 has:

    *Thicker steel receiver
    *Better shell lifter/carrier design
    *Nicer more durable machine aluminum trigger guard, compressed aluminum guard on the 870P. The newer 870P shotguns have plastic guards.
    *Machine ejector & extractor like the 870P
    *The Ghost ring sights on the 982 are nicer and more durable than the Wilson/Trijicon exposed GRS on the 870P
    *The barrel ring is located higher up on the 982 which provides a place to put a mount for accessories (flashlight) It also allows for 5+1 rounds in the tube, 4+1 on the 870. It's better design for a tactical defense shotgun.

    Remington could have dropped the Hawk Ind made Pardner Pump 870 style shotgun line when they purchased H&R NEF. They chose to keep it for a reason. They are big money makers because they have very low return %. The Pardner Pump & 982 are competition for the 870 Express and Remington knows that. Why try to beat the competition when you can own piece of it.

    This is really a one sided discussion because I believe you have no experience with the Hawk 982.


    GC
     
  18. UnderFire

    UnderFire New Member

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    WOW!! 2 days before you responed. You've must of been googling/researching a lot. :eek:
    Where do I mention the 500?
    Is that the only low dough defense shotgun Mossberg makes?
    Mossberg makes more tactical shotguns than you & H&R/NEF can shake a stick at. There's a reason for that!!
    ok, so the Mossberg doesn't have an easy break-down, but it's not difficult either. What you can't handle it? Well, I'm sure the OP can.

    The Chinese don't have the natural resources that we do in the USA. So where they have to make things out of "thicker steel" U.S. companies can machine parts from an aluminum forging and by using heat treatment to increase integrity making the parts lighter and rugged enough to get the job done. Don't even want to get started on what companies are doing with plastics nowadays. It will boggle your mind.

    Hmmm, Aftermarket sights are better than Wilson Combat and Trijicon. This statement/thought is so pathetic that I won't waste my time explaining the facts.
    The 870P MAX is the newest, higher end of the 870 line. So of course it won't compare in price, you missed my point. Dude, I don't know where you get prices at, but you need to shop around. A standard 870P w/ synthetic stock sells for less than 400 bucks. I've seen them as low as $299. How's that 3 times more? When you buy a product like Winchester, Remington you're buying the name, like Corvette & Harley Davidson. But of course you wouldn't know that because H&R/NEF never made a name for themselves even with Remington's help.
    What's your point about mounted accessories?
    Accessories can be mounted on 870P's & Mossberg's and not only flashlights. Some Mossberg's Special Purpose shotguns come with a 9 shot capacity before adding the extension. There's aftermarket shot extensions for the 870 allowing up to a 9 shot capacity. If you're defending yourself against an army it's inevitable you will have to reload at some certain point. You can ask any LEO or soldier and they will support my point.
    Dude? competition? Really!! Come on lets get real. :rolleyes:
    You need to understand Import/Export/Tarriffs, world trade & exchange, foreign markets, etc.
    H&R/NEF went on the auctioning block so it was only wise that Remington buy All of H&R/NEF because of the past investments made through Remington. It comes down to cut the losses or buy the struggling company and give total help. Remington owns H&R/NEF fully not just a piece.
    Oblviously more than you can comprehend.
    Again, your lack of knowledge is clearly on display.
    MAX100, you're very annoying. This isn't the only time I've had to correct your misinformation. The last time was this --->http://www.firearmstalk.com/forums/f26/few-shotgun-questions-22663/index2.html
    You need to start posting true facts instead of posting your opinions as facts. Keep doing google searches maybe if you read/comprehend enough you may gain some knowledge. Don't let ignorance prevail.
     
  19. DarinCraft

    DarinCraft New Member

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    Where is your experience with the 870? The Mossberg?

    Enough is enough. All you are doing is repeating advertising points. You chastise earlier me to which you had no idea what you were talking about (so instead of arguing I just laughed and walked off) and now you are telling Underfire he does not know what he is talking about. You are reiterating the same point over and over again. You have mentioned the relationship between NEF, Remington and this other company very clearly many times. However, you have yet to address the statement about the quality of materials that Chinese companies use. China uses whatever materials they can get their hands on. If it happens to be good or bad, they don't care and this is probably the reason for their thicker receiver so they can get the same strength with cheaper materials. Steel is not Steel, there are so many different grades it's not funny.

    Do we all need to actually own something to have experience with manufacturing downfalls of a particular country? What if it was made in Pakistan, Taiwan or India? Do we still need to own one? Do I need to go out an buy a Yugo to know it is a POS?

    This has turned into someone arguing a point and you trying to justify your purchase of one. You've made your point, you like the gun thats great and I am glad it is a good gun-for you. Needless to say, if I bought a gun and it had a gritty action I sure as the hell wouldn't be praising it. But to say that it is better than the other no one can say for sure. It is clear you only own the hawk and we don't. We own 870's or 500's or 590's. The point is moot, the horse is dead. The OP isn't even responding anymore, hell he's probably not even reading it.
     
    Last edited: Feb 27, 2010
  20. UnderFire

    UnderFire New Member

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    Good Point-
    I mean after all the Chinese can't even make safe dog food for dogs to eat.
    Their drywall is dangerous. Their shotguns are known to have problems.
    I'm just saying...