Has anyone applied for a new Form 4 in cali?

Discussion in 'AR-15 Discussion' started by rampart18, Apr 11, 2013.

  1. rampart18

    rampart18 New Member

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    I wanted to build a SBR but I don't know, since I live in Commiefornia (California) if its even worth my time plus the 200 dollars doing so? Has anyone applied with good results?
     
  2. SSGN_Doc

    SSGN_Doc Well-Known Member

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    If you cant have guns with detachable mags and pistol grips, I don't know how a SBR would fit in in CA.

    My understanding is that if you do want to own an NFA type weapon it had to exist in the state prior to the ban, or you would need permision from the CA DOJ/ Attorney General before you would be able to go through the rest of the process with the ATF.

    Screw CA, and move somewhere else, and quit giving them your tax money. but if you move somewhere else don't vote to implement anything resembling CA policies and ruin another state.

    Saw folks moving south from NY, Mass, and other New England States, who must have gotten home sick and started voting for the same stupid social, tax, and anti-gun policies that they left behind. Don't want to see that trend continue. If folks like socialism, there are a few states that have a well established track record where the like minded can feel free to assemble. Just leave the other states alone to enjoy what liberty remains.
     

  3. SSGN_Doc

    SSGN_Doc Well-Known Member

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    California Penal code:

    12001.5. Except as expressly provided in Section 12020, and solely in accordance with Section 12020, no person may manufacture, import into this state, keep for sale, offer for sale, give, lend, or possess any short-barreled shotgun or short-barreled rifle, as defined in Section 12020, and nothing else in this chapter shall be construed as authorizing the manufacture, importation into this state, keeping for sale, offering for sale, or giving, lending, or possession of any short-barreled shotgun or short-barreled rifle, as defined in Section 12020.

    12020. (a) Any person in this state who does any of the following is punishable by imprisonment in a county jail not exceeding one year or in the state prison:
    (1) Manufactures or causes to be manufactured, imports into the state, keeps for sale, or offers or exposes for sale, or who gives, lends, or possesses ..... any cane gun or wallet gun, … any firearm which is not immediately recognizable as a firearm, any camouflaging firearm container,… any short-barreled shotgun, any short-barreled rifle ..... any unconventional pistol
    (b) Subdivision (a) does not apply to any of the following:
    (2) The manufacture, possession, transportation or sale of short-barreled shotguns or short-barreled rifles when authorized by the Department of Justice pursuant to Article 6 (commencing with Section 12095) of this chapter and not in violation of federal law.
    (7) Any firearm or ammunition that is a curio or relic as defined in Section 478.11 of Title 27 of the Code of Federal Regulations and which is in the possession of a person permitted to possess the items pursuant to Chapter 44 (commencing with Section 921) of Title 18 of the United States Code and the regulations issued pursuant thereto.
    (8) Any other weapon as defined in subsection (e) of Section 5845 of Title 26 of the United States Code and which is in the possession of a person permitted to possess the weapons pursuant to the federal Gun Control Act of 1968 (Public Law 90-618), as amended, and the regulations issued pursuant thereto. …. The exemption provided in this subdivision does not apply to pen guns.

    ARTICLE 6. PERMITS
    12095. (a) If it finds that it does not endanger the public safety, the Department of Justice may issue permits initially valid for a period of one year, and renewable annually thereafter, for the manufacture, possession, transportation, or sale of short-barreled shotguns or short-barreled rifles upon a showing that good cause exists for the issuance thereof to the applicant for the permit. No permit shall be issued to a person who is under 18 years of age.
    (b) Good cause, for the purposes of this section, shall be limited to only the following:
    (1) The permit is sought for the manufacture, possession, or use with blank cartridges, of a short-barreled rifle or short-barreled shotgun, solely as props for a motion picture, television, or video production or entertainment event. (2) The permit is sought for the manufacture of, exposing for sale, keeping for sale, sale of, importation or lending of short-barreled rifles or short-barreled shotguns to the entities listed in paragraph (1) of subdivision (b) of Section 12020 by persons who are licensed as dealers or manufacturers under the provisions of Chapter 53 (commencing with Section 5801) of Title 26 of the United States Code, as amended, and the regulations issued pursuant thereto.

    Looks like they do have a "Hollywood" clause to let the movie industry have full auto props. Nice to know that a very anti-gun segment gets a pass.
     
    Last edited: Apr 11, 2013
  4. AgentTikki

    AgentTikki New Member

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    YA sorry unless your a FFL, LEO or issued one in the military, NFA are kaput in Kommiefornia. T_T I share your pain.
     
  5. SSGN_Doc

    SSGN_Doc Well-Known Member

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    Here's more stuff that can trip folks up in California:

    1. Pistols And Revolvers That Chamber Shotgun Shells.
    California regards most modern handguns that chamber shotgun ammunition to be sawed off shotguns. The Thompson/Center single shot pistol with .45/.410 barrel and revolvers and single-shot or multi-barrel pistols with rifled barrels that chamber .410 cartridges are prohibited, even though there were no Federal objections to sale of these arms. Mere possession may be punished by up to three years in state prison.

    2. Disguised Firearms And Containers.
    California prohibits devices that are not easily recognizable as firearms, and also items intended to conceal a firearm, that allows the gun to be fired. Prohibited devices include pen guns, knife pistols, pager guns, cell phone guns, belt buckle guns, and wallet guns. Mere possession may be punished as a felony with up to three years in state prison and for some items, Federal felony penalties may also apply.

    3. Any Firearms Possessed If You Are A Prohibited Person.
    If ordered to surrender firearms acquired while you were barred from gun ownership or if you become prohibited from possessing firearms that you legally acquired, consult a firearms attorney immediately. You do not forfeit your economic interest in firearms legally acquired but you may not have access to the firearms. Community property interest in firearms is not extinguished if one spouse becomes prohibited from gun ownership. NOTE: possession of ammunition is also prohibited and California bars possession of ammunition feeding devices such as clips, magazines and speed loaders.

    4. Magazines Holding More Than Ten Cartridges.
    Since January 1, 2000, high capacity magazines may not be transferred within California, except to properly licensed firearms dealers. The dealer may sell these devices out of state or in state, for law enforcement use only. Importation or transfer of a high capacity magazine within California may be prosecuted as a felony.

    5. Assault Weapons Not Registered In California.
    A person who just simply possesses an unregistered Assault Weapon may be charged with either a misdemeanor or a felony and upon conviction, may be sentenced for up to three years imprisonment. Conviction for manufacturing, importing, selling or transporting unregistered Assault Weapons, may bring up to eight years in prison. The California Penal Code implies, and the California Department of Justice has taken the position that, arranged in advance, surrender of unregistered Assault Weapons to police or sheriffs results in immunity from prosecution.

    6. .50 Bmg Rifles Not Registered In California.
    Effective January 1, 2005, rifles chambered to fire the .50 BMG cartridge became subject to the California restrictions previously imposed on Assault Weapons and had to be registered on or before April 30, 2006. Failure to comply can result in the same criminal penalties imposed for Assault Weapon violations.

    7. Folding Or Pistol Grip Stocks For Semi-Automatic Rifles And Shotguns.
    Assembly of such a stock to a firearm may result in being charged with manufacture of an Assault Weapon, a California felony. Ownership of a folding stock or pistol grip stock and the semi-automatic firearm to which it applies, may also result in Assault Weapon prosecution.

    8. Machine Guns, Short Barreled Rifles, Short Barreled Shotguns Or Smooth Bore Pistols Under Federal Law.
    Manufacture, sale and possession of these "gangster weapons" is regulated and taxed under the National Firearms Act (NFA) of 1934. NFA registration is also required for unserviceable machine guns, cannons and some other war souvenirs. Mere possession of an unregistered NFA weapon may result in a prison sentence of up to ten years. No amnesty has been offered to permit voluntary registration of NFA weapons since 1968. Lawful dispositions of unregistered NFA weapons are abandonment or forfeiture to a government agency but immunity from prosecution is not guaranteed. NFA restrictions do not apply to shotguns with barrels 18" or longer and an overall length of 26" or more, nor do NFA rules apply to rifles with barrels 16" or longer and an overall length of 26" or more.

    9. Machine Guns, Short Barreled Rifles, Short Barreled Shotguns Or Smooth Bore Pistol Under California Law.
    Special permits may be obtained from the Department of Justice to possess machine guns and short-barreled rifles or shotguns, but permits are normally issued only for law enforcement or for motion picture or television production. Unlawful possession of a short-barreled rifle, shotgun, a smooth bore pistol or machine gun may be punished as a misdemeanor, or as a felony with a sentence of three years in state prison. A person convicted of misdemeanor machine gun possession may not own any firearm in California for ten years. California does not regulate possession of machine guns or cannons that are permanently unserviceable; however, there have been successful prosecutions for "constructive possession" where one person was alleged to have all the parts necessary to assemble a machine gun. California allows ownership of specific short-barreled rifles, short barreled shotguns and smoothbore pistols, which have been classified as Curios and Relics by the ATF and are owned in accord with Federal law.

    10. Firearms And Ammunition Over .50 Caliber.
    Except for shotguns and "elephant guns", most firearms with a bore diameter greater than .50" are Destructive Devices under Federal law, subject to the same NFA registration and transfer restrictions as machine guns. California law provides felony penalties for possession of firearms and ammunition greater than .60 caliber, except for shotguns and shotshells and a few big-bore sporting rifles and cartridges.

    11. Tracer, Incendiary And Exploding Ammunition.
    Cartridges with tracer, incendiary, or exploding projectiles are Destructive Devices in California. Felony penalties apply to simple possession. The prohibition does not apply to tracer shotgun shells.

    12. Handgun Ammunition Designed To Penetrate Metal Or Armor.
    Knowing possession may be prosecuted as a felony in California.

    13. Over 20 Pounds Of Smokeless Gunpowder Or More Than One Pound Of Black Powder.
    Even if intended for use in sporting firearms, California provides felony penalties for possessing more than the stated amounts of gunpowder without special permits.

    14. Grenade Or Rocket Launchers.
    Tube type grenade launchers that can fire antipersonnel cartridges, functioning rocket launchers and mortars are Destructive Devices under Federal law, subject to NFA restrictions and felony penalties. California provides felony penalties for possession of any rocket launcher or grenade launcher, whether tube type, cup type or spigot type. Flare launchers are generally exempted as pyrotechnic signaling devices, unless the owner also possesses anti-personnel ammunition that fits the device.

    15. Machine Gun Parts And Conversion Kits.
    Federal and state machine gun penalties apply to possession of sufficient parts to assemble a machine gun or to parts designed and intended to convert a semi-automatic firearm to fire more than one shot with a single pull of the trigger. You may be prosecuted for possession of conversion parts even if you do not own the firearm for which they were designed.

    16. Multiburst Trigger Activators.
    Devices that increase the rate of fire of semi-automatic firearms by mechanically manipulating the trigger are prohibited in California. Possession may be punished as a felony with up to three years imprisonment.

    17. Short Rifle Or Shotgun Barrels.
    Under Federal law, possession may result in felony prosecution if the person also possesses a firearm to which the barrel may be applied.
    Under California law, mere possession of a short rifle or shotgun barrel, including a Thompson/Center combination .45/.410 barrel, may result in a felony conviction with up to a three-year sentence.

    18. Shoulder Stocks For Handguns.
    Under Federal law Possession may result in felony prosecution if the person also has a firearm to which the stock may be applied.
    Under California law possession of only the shoulder stock may result in a felony sentence of up to three years. Certain stocked handguns and handgun stocks formally classified by the ATF as Curios and Relics are exempt.

    19. Firearm Silencers.
    Any device that measurably diminishes noise when a firearm is discharged may be considered a firearm silencer. Under Federal law, silencers and even a single silencer part are NFA weapons and felony penalties apply to unlicensed manufacture, transfer or possession. California allows manufacture, sale and possession of firearm silencers for law enforcement and military use only.

    20. Sniper Scopes.
    Possession of a night vision telescope adapted to a firearm that operates through projection of infrared light is a misdemeanor in California.

    21. Imitation Or Replica Firearms.
    Transactions in realistic replicas of modern firearms in California may be subject to a fine of up to $10,000. Exceptions are provided for theatrical, educational, military and certain other uses.
     
  6. AgentTikki

    AgentTikki New Member

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    WoW I didn't know night vision scopes were illegal in Kali. @#$%@#$%$%!~@#R$Y$%&$%#$%YQ$TAQ@#%Q@#! :mad:
     
  7. SSGN_Doc

    SSGN_Doc Well-Known Member

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    Yeah it's the crap that you don't know that will bite you in the butt.

    It looks like you could have a passive NV scope just nothing with active IR projection to help add some visibility.

    If I found a good deal on actual black powder I'd buy more than a pound, just to have it on hand for my muzzleloader. But In California I could go to jail for having a Costco mentality for something to fuel a "primative weapon".
     
  8. AgentTikki

    AgentTikki New Member

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    guess I'm just gonna have to get thermal......damn, what's the lotto at right now? :rolleyes:
     
  9. Jake86

    Jake86 New Member

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    That sucks... I know in MI we cannot legally have SBR's...
     
  10. rampart18

    rampart18 New Member

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    Me and my wife made a ten year plan to save up and buy a house in Texas or another free state! I can't Stand it here! We are be ran by a bunch of morons and have even bigger morons that vote them into office! Everybody is rude and in a rush. We have to be constantly baby sat, like we are to stupid and irresponsible to make any decisions for ourself!
     
  11. Quentin

    Quentin New Member

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    I couldn't agree more. Here in Idaho we see Californians pouring in and way too many want to turn us into exactly what they fled from. Makes no sense but as they say, liberalism is a mental disorder. You can't make sense of it.

    I know many of you are stuck in insane states and you're exactly the ones we want to move here to free states, just leave the libs behind!
     
  12. SSGN_Doc

    SSGN_Doc Well-Known Member

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    I'm stationed in Washington State now. So I see the same thing here. Lots of conservative folks out in the state, but lots of people leave California and start (should have said continue) voting like Californians. Seattle, and Olympia tend to set the policy, much like LA and SanFran seem to be the population centers that screwed up California.
     
  13. Quentin

    Quentin New Member

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    Yeah, eastern Washington and eastern Oregon are much like Idaho, except they're ruled by socialists in the metro areas to the west. Guess the same can be said for CA.
     
  14. northtx

    northtx New Member

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    I'm glad we left kalifornia last year and ended up outside of Dallas. I bought an FNH FNX45 Tactical (the one with a threaded barrel) with no waiting period. Just needed my TX DL and completed a form 4473. I plan on acquiring a suppressor later this year. Next year I'm going to add an SBR. And I should have my Texas CHL license in about 45 days. Texas is awesome. Wish you lots of luck sticking out in Kali. But as soon as you can, get the heck outta there.
     
  15. nicklarimore

    nicklarimore New Member

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    I have a question for those that may be more knowledgeable in law...since all these things are against California law how can you be charged with a felony? Doesn't felony=broken federal law?:confused:
     
  16. SSGN_Doc

    SSGN_Doc Well-Known Member

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    No there are state level felonies as well.
     
  17. pawjr74

    pawjr74 New Member

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    Me too. I grew up in San Diego and we used to drive 30 minutes east into Ramona or up into the mountains and go shooting. Those days are long gone. We never had to worry about what type of gun we had or how to legally transport them. I've been in Arizona for 12 years now and while there are many reasons why I'd love to go back to California the cons outweigh the pros.
     
  18. rampart18

    rampart18 New Member

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    Yes I would like to know this too! This is completely obvious that they are picking things apart! Pretty much watering everything down more and more till it no longer exists! All these damn liberal actors and people need to be extradited out of the United States! Maybe somewhere like Iraq so they can appreciate the rights we have to protect ourselves! They think that our government will never do anything to us! When you look all over the world oppressions is happening as we speak! We are no different from any other country besides one thing! Our constitution that has the 2nd amendment to insure all of our freedom and our pursuit of happiness!!!!