Gun Control arguments are true...

Discussion in 'Legal and Activism' started by kdog, Aug 9, 2013.

  1. kdog

    kdog New Member

    448
    1
    0
    I know you guys don`t want to hear or read it, but taking some of the arguments...

    - If legal firearms are banned, nobody can be killed with legal firearms!
    - If legal firearms are banned, nobody can commit a school shooting with legal firearms!
    - etc., etc., etc

    It is kind of hard, coming out against these arguments, because they are true, hones to god they are.

    The only problem is, but the antis don`t care about that, is, that none of the above arguments will do anything agains gang murder, suicide, robbery or rape.
    The only thing these arguments will akomplish is, that all victems of murder, rape or robbery will be left without any device to defend themselves against the kriminals.
    But the antis don`t care about that, because nobody will ever be killed again with a legally owned firearm!
     
  2. JW357

    JW357 New Member

    6,716
    1
    0
    Absolutely. They don't wanna hear it.
     

  3. Scratchammo

    Scratchammo New Member

    1,490
    0
    0
    You just dropped a logic bomb.
     
  4. Sgt_Skrb_25

    Sgt_Skrb_25 New Member

    1,983
    0
    0
    I wish sometimes these Obama, Feinstein and Boxer types(antis) get in a situation where they are defenseless and understand the importance of our 2nd amendment that try have been wiping their asses with
     
  5. therewolf

    therewolf New Member

    8,409
    1
    0
    Are you seeing a pattern here? NOBODY's doing their job, as legislative

    leaders, that would be too much like WORK. NOBODY EVER wants to

    deal with crime, poverty,and antiquated educational systems.

    Just do something mindlessly popular, like a new gun control law,

    that will earn you the votes of the numbnutz PC crowd.
     
  6. robocop10mm

    robocop10mm Lifetime Supporting Member Lifetime Supporter

    11,380
    1
    0
    They do not care about these things because they do not give one rat's azz about school shootings, suicides, gang drivebys, etc. They care about one thing and one thing ONLY, TOTAL CONTROL!

    This cannot be accomplished when the populace has the means to fight back.
     
  7. davva360

    davva360 New Member

    562
    0
    0
    The simple answer that shuts down most anti gunners is to use self defense statistics. There is no way to be absolutely sure how many times a gun is used successfully in self defense because many incidents go unreported however a very conservative estimate is 250,000 times per year. In over 99% of cases no shot is actually fired.

    Compare that to about 12,000 deaths per year from firearms, some of those are suicides, some are justifiable homicide (self defense or police shootings). It also includes gang shootings.

    I would say 250,000 successful self defense cases with very few shots fired outweighs 12,000 regrettable deaths.
     
  8. Mouser

    Mouser Member

    725
    12
    18
    Most people I know that are anti-gun, have never been exposed to violence and/or were not exposed to the safe use of guns growing up.

    There are too many people I have met that have figured every thing out. They are the "don't bore with the facts" crowd. When you combine the two elements together and sprinkle in a bit of an activist's will to control others personality trait...you get the modern anti-gun zealot.

    There is one more worth noting...the modern day politician that will do whatever it takes to get reelected. Their morals are the "moral of the collective party line". Some of these people know guns...may even know violence...but no matter, they have tax payer funded armed security and benefits for life. The struggle between good and evil, light and darkness, morality and immorality is an eternal one and I always look for allies in morality and distance/disassociate with people of immorality...those that believe the end justifies the means....those willing to use offensive force and fraud to achieve their ambitions, and those who think it is moral and correct to force others to be free.

    I think it was either Thomas Paine or Thomas Jefferson who wrote something to the effect...if it neither breaks my leg nor pick my pocket, I have no care...there is more to it and he was speaking about religious freedom...but whatever freedom you are talking about, it is essentially the same concept.
     
  9. kdog

    kdog New Member

    448
    1
    0
    Unfortunately that will not happen, because they have armed body guards around them, that protect them.......

    I guess, if politicians around the world would switch on theire brain and to politics for the people, then they wouldn`t need armed body guards.
     
  10. Overkill0084

    Overkill0084 Active Member

    4,910
    2
    38
    It's not about guns, it's about control.
    You ever notice that the solution for the failure of gun control is, more gun control?
    Or more accurately: the solution for the failure of government is,...more government?
     
  11. JimRau

    JimRau Well-Known Member Supporter

    5,028
    72
    48
    See what I mean??? You used their narrative!:(
    It is NOT 'Gun Control' it is 'Anti-gun legislation'! Is this not why you refers to them as 'anti's'????;)
     
  12. John_Deer

    John_Deer New Member

    6,624
    1
    0
    In anti gun gun playbook it says don't use facts or statistics when making a case for new gun laws. The reason the author wrote that little nugget is anyone that has a clue would know they are just cherry picking statistics. If a pro gun person spoke after them they would use facts and figures to beat down every word the anti gun person spoke. They know that the only way they can win is get people in such an emotional uproar they take actions that are not in their best interest.
     
  13. nitestalker

    nitestalker New Member

    6,489
    0
    0
    It is about control of the population. The War on big tobacco rages on as the Liberals ignore illegal drug laws. Tobacco and Alcohol are the first choice of the working class. Soft drinks are a pleasure for the poor and working class.
    The Liberal Elite prefer street drugs fine wine and good cigars. They are relentlessly in controlling the working class whom they consider ignorant. They ban cigarettes and beer and now soda pop. What would happen if there was a move to ban champagne and and $40 dollar cigars?:eek:
     
  14. Warrior1256

    Warrior1256 New Member

    614
    0
    0
    Very good points and WE get it. But get this, the ANTIS GET IT TOO BUT THEY DON'T CARE!!!!! Their agenda is to ban civilian gun ownership, period, except for the elites of society (themselves) of course.
     
  15. kdog

    kdog New Member

    448
    1
    0


    Wenn, we had that her ein Germany already. It was called "East Germany", or "Kommunist Germany".....
     
  16. JeeperSC

    JeeperSC New Member

    120
    0
    0
    But if legal guns are banned, the good guys will have no way to defend themselves against bad guys with illegal guns. Or whatever other weapon the bad guy brings to the table.
    The route that the Obama Admin has been trying to take only punishes the Law Abiding responsible gun owners and makes them sitting ducks to the criminal element.
     
  17. kdog

    kdog New Member

    448
    1
    0
    It`s not only Obama.....it`s the british government, when they banned sort arms in 1996/1997, it`s in germany, where self defense is no liable reason to own firearms, unless you can proove, that you are an endangered person.
    Where nearly all tools, that one could use for self defense, like knives, battons, etc. are not allowed to be carried. Pepper spray can only be carried for self defense agains animals, not against humans.

    The goverments are in the opinion, that the police is enough to protect. But that just dosn`t work, because the police nearly never will be there, when an girl get`s raped, when a couple get`s robbed, etc.
    They will only be there, after the crime was comitted.

    But the governments don`t care about that at all.
     
  18. kbd512

    kbd512 Well-Known Member Lifetime Supporter

    2,721
    61
    48
    You mean if civilian ownership of firearms is banned a criminal can't take a police officer's firearm and kill people with it?

    Words on paper mean bean dip to criminals. Criminals kill people because they can, not because some inanimate object is or is not present when they commit their crimes.

    The mass murder only happens when you have a bunch of unarmed or ineffectively armed people grouped together. Psychotic people intent on hurting as many people as possible don't go to police stations to have firefights with the police. They might kill one or two officers, but after that they know they'll be killed. If you kill a bunch of defenseless people, you're famous. If you kill one or two police officers, nobody but the police care. Much of that is thanks to our amoral media, but that's what happens.

    State of being isn't equivalent to behavior or point in time vs action which occurs through time. A little logic would be necessary to understand that and you're not talking to logical people capable of concrete thought. Yes, Lucy, there are adults who are not capable of concrete thought.

    More people are beaten to death every year than killed with rifles or shotguns of any kind, but we're not holding hearings on how we can prevent people from making a fist or kicking someone. Again, logic, numbers, cause/effect... They're all pretty mysterious to stupid people.
     
  19. kdog

    kdog New Member

    448
    1
    0
    You know that, I know that and the gun grabbers know it aswell, but they don`t care.

    The argument is:
    Ban legal gun ownership, an nobody will be killed, specially no school shooting will be committed, with legal firearms.

    That is the argument, the gun grabbers use and it`s true.

    That gangmembers don`t care, or murderers, or rapists, etc.. is not the point they take or look after.
    And that is the major problem. The reason is, that they put the amounbt of illegal firearms into comparison with illegalfirearms. So reduce the amount of legal firearms and that will reduce the amount of illegal firearms.
    That is the way they think and get people behind them.

    That it`s a huge pile of sh_t, dosn`t interest them at all.

    They don`t care about how strict a gun law is, just as they don`t care about the thousands of deaths du to driving while intoxicated, speeding and driving under influence of drugs. They don`t accept that as a comparison, just like that idiot pierse morgan, that just dosn`t want to accept, that crime rates went sky high, after the short firearms had been banned in Britain. He just looks at the fairly low amount of homicides comitted with firearms in Britain. But stabbings, beatings, etc. are not of interest.
     
  20. Mouser

    Mouser Member

    725
    12
    18
    Intelligence is the ability to learn from your mistakes. Wisdom is the ability to learn from others mistakes. Stupidity sets in when learning stops...I don't care what your IQ test score is....failure to take in the inputs around you and alter your beliefs as a result of said inputs is stupidity incarnate.

    Having said all of that, I am constantly fascinated by people that I meet that are no longer receptive to new thoughts and ideas. I worked with one recently, and he actually stated that he thought he learned quickly. This as he spouted his liberal dogma, yet could not and would not reconcile who has the moral authority to seize one man's assets and give it to another. Humans have a most peculiar habit and ability to leave contradictions un-reconciled!

    Most people I know do learn even as they approach middle age. Most I know become a little more conservative as they get older as the rose colored glasses come off and the reality of life/living as well as our own mortality sets in. The anti-gun people are devoid of logic having accepted the mantra of the party line. Their mind is shut off to inputs that could/would potentially alter their perception. Such is man's mind...able to ignore reality, reason and truth. People do it all the time...mostly inadvertently but we all suffer to some degree from confirmation bias...that is subconsciously looking for evidence to support your already formed opinion of right and wrong. But if you know it, and are working hard to continue to learn then you will not likely fall victim to the great orators of our society.

    Obama is a snake-oil salesman. Anti gun leaders are salesmen. They are selling claims and promises that can not possibly come true and a national platform to debate logically does not exist. I see it on tv all the time where a guest just won't stay on topic and answer the darn question...always deflecting and even being untruthful.

    I think what conservatives and pro-gun people need to realize and be prepared for is the likelihood that an argument of logic will not prevail or not persuade the ignorant anti-gun people to change their minds. Only the people who are still open to learning can be reached. It is fairly easy to tell who is open to learning...just debate through questions and see who will engage in a conversation and who will spend their time talking and reinforcing their own point of view.
     
    Last edited: Aug 12, 2013