Gun Building Legality

Discussion in 'NFA/Class 3 & FFL Discussion' started by notdku, Jan 1, 2008.

  1. notdku

    notdku Administrator Staff Member

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    Anyone done any research on legality of building firearms from scratch?

    Milling your own receiver and such.

    Do you have to have a license to sell it after you have built it. What about building automatic weapons from scratch. Do you have to obtain licenses first. I thought I recall you can only build automatics to sell to the US military.
     
  2. Subgun Ordnance

    Subgun Ordnance New Member

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    You an only build FA guns if you are a 07 FFL/02 SOT They are called post sample guns sold to Gov LE or other SOT dealers. Any donor gun has to be destroyed if you cant sell it to one of the above and if you give up your license. You can build your own semi without an FFL.

    Later Joe
     

  3. gnoll

    gnoll New Member

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    so your telling me I can build a gun and not get in trouble?
     
  4. Subgun Ordnance

    Subgun Ordnance New Member

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    Semi auto. You can make your own suppressor also plus $200 tax stamp

    Later Joe
     
  5. Dgunsmith

    Dgunsmith New Member

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    ATF Form-1 to manufacture

    IF you live in a State where it is legal to own a supressor, you may file a form-1 and pay $ 200 tax for permission to manufacture a supressor for yourself.

    There is NO forgiveness, you MUST have permission and approval to individual manufacture of a supressor BEFORE doing ANYTHING toward its manufacture................or BATF WILL lock your silly hips up.

    A semi or bolt gun for your personal use, you may manufacture...more than a single unit, must have your name on it as manufacturer AND a unique serial number.

    NOT woth the risk to violate the law....BATF&E dont play well.:cool:
     
  6. LEO

    LEO New Member

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    You can build your own gun and it does not even need a SN on it.

    http://www.atf.gov/firearms/building_a_firearm.pdf



    You have to submit an application to build a FA gun and unless you are a dealer that is going to sell to law enforcement or military.. it will be denied!!!
     
  7. bkt

    bkt New Member

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    How does that work with regard to handguns?
     
  8. LEO

    LEO New Member

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    It makes no diffference. As long as the handgun is not a FA gun.. you can make it and no SN required.
     
  9. deadin

    deadin New Member

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    It's my understanding that if you build one from scratch, it's strictly for you, you can't transfer it to anyone else unless you have a manufacturers license.
     
  10. BBet

    BBet New Member

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    Posted by deadin:
    As an individual you can build a legal gun (i.e. not FA, 922 compliant etc) and sell it at a later date to a third party. Below is an extract from a BATF&E letter on the subject. * http://forums.impactguns.com/archive/index.php/t-335.html * This is dated 2004 but you will find that here are many such posts giving the same information.

    -------------- Extract from BATF&E letter ----------

    Also, for your information, a nonlicensee may manufacture a semiautomatic rifle for his or her own personal use. As long as the firearm remains in the custody of the person who manufactured it, the firearm need not be marked with a serial number or name and location of the manufacturer. However, if the firearm is transferred to another party at some point in the future, the firearm must be marked in accordance with the provisions set forth in 27 CFR § 478.92 (formerly 178.92).

    ------------- End of ectract -----------------------

    You may (will) run into problems if you were to build an unreasonable number of such guns in any given year and subsequently sell them : a hobbyist cannot make "a full-time income" from selling guns be they home made or commercial. Even if (as a hobbyist / gun enthusiast) you were to "buy / trade and sell" commercially made guns and then sell a few of your items at gun shows you must not make sufficient income for it to be classified as being a full-time income: this is the province of the FFL who is expected to make such an income. The ATF will ask to see records of ALL transactions you have made to establish what income you have earned.

    A PROVISO:

    Like every BATF&E "regulation / rule / pray list / daily re-write list" this area is open to the particular ATF rep's mood and inclination at any given time ... but what else is new :) The bottom line is yes you can make a gun and sell it - just don't make more money in a year than an out of work rabid squirrel hunter. And keep a written record of everything bought (inc. compliance parts and so on) and sold together with all costs incurred by yourself - preferably witnessed by the Pope or someone else of unimpeachable standing !!

    Hope this info (it was also confirmed before posting by my FFL who works closely with the ATF and knows his onions) is of some value.

    Best to all, and keep on fighting for our freedoms, Bbet.
     
  11. cattivo

    cattivo New Member

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    ????????????

    so does any one have the info on how to build an ar15 or what parts are required and were they come from ordering ..ie
     
  12. FROGMAN

    FROGMAN New Member

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    Sarco has parts kits for 399 Its all there except the striped lower. AR 15,com will show you whats you need to do.
     
  13. gnoll

    gnoll New Member

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    wow google
    im sorry but thats it along with shot gun news
     
    Last edited: Apr 2, 2008
  14. fsted2a

    fsted2a Active Member

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    First you have to get a serialed lower reciever. Suggest you get a major name brand. I know all AR's are suppose to be the same, but they are not. Some have a mag well that is too tight and the magazine will not go in smoothly without being forced in. I suggest you get a video on the assembly of the AR, and watch it a few times before proceeding with assembly. You will have some specialty tools to buy, such as a barrel nut wrench and barrel vice jaws, so start getting them together. Bushmaster has a decent video, but the guy slobbers a lot when talking. Hint: nothing on the rifle needs to be torqued more than 30 pounds, period!
     
  15. smaj100

    smaj100 New Member

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    Making a Firearm

    Can someone correct me if I am wrong. Doing a little more research before I started machining my own m4 lower. I found this on the ATF website.

    While the ATF & GCA(Gun control Act) don't require a non-licensed person to do anything to make a firearm. The NFA (National Firearms Act) does require any person, licensed or non to register, pay and receive approval prior to any firearm being created. I'll include a PDF of ch6 that I downloaded from the website. It clearly defines, what is a firearm and further explains who and how one can be made. Even sets forth guidelines for someone who does not posses the skills, tools, or equipment to make their own can have one made by someone else without involving that person for registration purposes.

    Anyone with additional information please advise. Just trying to make sure folks and myself stay legal. I don't want to do prison time for something stupid.

    http://www.atf.gov/publications/download/p/atf-p-5320-8/atf-p-5320-8-chapter-6.pdf
     
  16. c3shooter

    c3shooter Administrator Staff Member

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    Smaj- the NFA was the law from the 1930s that required the payment of a transfer tax on machine guns (referred to here as FA for full auto) short barreled shotguns, suppressors, etc etc. Your PDF addresses making NFA firearms. Those are NOT ordinary rifles, handguns, and shotguns.

    If you want to take a 20 lb chunk of steel and a pocket knife, and whittle yerself a .45 caliber pistol, it is legal to do that. It cannot be a full auto, and if you wanted to make a snubby shotgun, snubby rifle, a disguised firearm (cane gun, perhaps), a 40mm cannon or a suppressor, you will need to do the NFA paperwork and pay fees for those up front, THEN build.

    If you are "engaged in the business" of making guns for sale, THEN you need a license as a manufacturer. Want to make the ultimate accurate .22 target rifle? Have at it.
     
    Last edited: May 24, 2011