Global Economic Change?

Discussion in 'Survival & Sustenance Living Forum' started by TLuker, Oct 23, 2011.

  1. TLuker

    TLuker Active Member

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    I read a post in another thread by Jimmy and he expressed concern about Germany, Russia, China along with the problems in Greece. That got me to thinking about how events may play out in Europe. At the moment I think everyone (including us) is in bed with Asia in general just because there are so many potential customers, and I'm not too concerned about that. That's just business.

    I am wondering how any of you think that all might play out in Europe? I realize that anything could happen but is there anything that seems pretty obvious? For example I suspect WWII coming was pretty obvious? I also suspect that it would be tough for most of the European countries to do much damage militarily simply because they haven't invested much in their armies, with Russia being the exception. So what concerns do any of you have and how do you think it will affect us?
     
  2. CHLChris

    CHLChris New Member

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    In an economic collapse of the Euro, one thing that would occur is a huge run-up in the relative value of the US dollar. If the dollar goes up strongly, in theory that would make the price of gold go down. However, since the price of gold right now is strictly a psychological phenomenon, the price of gold would probably go way up, too.

    All of the ramifications are unknowable...except by God.
     

  3. Jimmy

    Jimmy New Member

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    The reason Russia and China plotting is to get rid of dollar as reserve currency. Those three I mentioned have VERY strong economies at this point. Dollar as reserve currency is only thing saving us now. If it drops our inflation could go uber. China getting shed of our bonds as fast as they can. Russia and China would take a shot at us that way in a heartbeat. Germany the stooge

    Jimmy
     
  4. bkt

    bkt New Member

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    Jimmy's right. Russia and China, along with India and Brazil are vying for an end of the dollar as the world's reserve currency. That would be bad for the U.S. in that the real cost of oil and other products would go up significantly.

    Europe has big problems. Greece, Portugal, Spain and Italy are in very bad shape. Germany and France are the two economic powerhouses of Europe (Germany being the more significant of the two) and cannot continue to bail out the rest of the Eurozone indefinitely before they suffer terribly. Germany has begin printing Deutschmarks again. That is an ominous sign.

    If the euro dies, the destabilization will have repercussions in the U.S. The dollar might look better than the euro for a short while, but that will only hurt our exports. The U.S. is suffering from the same problems countries in Europe are: overspending while the rate of productivity is very low or stagnant. Many believe it is a matter of time before the U.S. goes the way of Greece.

    Municipalities and even states are already deep into the red. Rhode Island is one example.

    The concern is less about global economic change as it is about global economic collapse.
     
  5. bkt

    bkt New Member

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    In regard to precious metals, the demand is higher than it has been in the past and that helps drive prices up. But commodity prices across the board have also been rising. It isn't that they are in higher demand or that they are more scarce than they have been in the past, but that the value of the dollar is falling: you need more bucks to buy X amount of some commodity. That is inflation and it is a hidden tax all Americans must pay.
     
  6. JonM

    JonM Moderator

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    Want to know the end result of all this?? its the same end result whenever socialism and liberalism get their way. Look at the wiemer republic of germany and what came to power there. Usually without a strong captilistic force like the usa there to guide the country suffering under the final death throes of liberalism you end upnwith a polpot or che gueverra type in charge dumping bodies in trenches...

    Make no mistake if we didnt have rule of law, what little is left, and the 2A obama and his goons woulda been long since filling trenches with bodies and lime
     
    Last edited: Oct 24, 2011
  7. hoodweisen

    hoodweisen New Member

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    Heres something that makes me think. Where i live is the lead mining capital of the world we are exporting more lead to china than the US consumes,
    Now heres the interesting part somehow the demand (price of lead drops)decreases and they lay off a bunch of people then a year later it goes up and they bring everyone back.
    I dont see how we are exporting the majority of lead to a growing booming country that cant come out of the 19th century fast enough(china) and somehow their demand for lead is fluctating.
    I call Complete Bullshout on supply and demand. All precious metals produced or middlemened here in america is based off how American corporations are cooking their books. Which is exactly how our country is set up in the first place. CAPITALISM!!!
    Its how we rose to be the last standing SUPERPOWER in the world and i think that we wont fall and this is why.
    1 we have a standing army sitting on top of the most important commidity in the world OIL (also i believe that war stimulates our economy for 1 we didnt outsource weaponary 2 it puts alot of money in a few million consumers who would otherwise be low income)
    2 we have sold off all of our junk companies you know the ones i mean the junk thats not important and isnt worth anything if WE dont buy it because average americans have the expendable income that other people dont have If america collapses everyone one else collapses because we fooled them into making our crap for super cheap example: in india where the majority of our clothing is produced the people who make the clothing cant afford underarm deodrant seriously its a weeks pay and they are getting the underarm deodrant from a chinese company who doesnt pay their workers enough to buy the clothes the indians are producing BUT the only way any of them get paid is if we buy the stuff.
    3 The european union may collapse because they have inflated the euro to make up for the fact each country cant work as well as the US has individually so in their greed to inflate beyond us ( and this is because for centuries of the common man in those countries could not with his own wit and ingenuity make himself rich he had to be born into it) they will collapse but its not going to bother the US one bit in fact we will just loan them money(now you may say but hoodweisen you twap we had to be bailed out by the chinese but you sir must realize that the chinese yen is worthless without the american dollar feeding it and all the money we got from them went to bankers who are going to turn around and CAPITALIZE upon that borrowed money)

    end rant
     
  8. Jimmy

    Jimmy New Member

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    At this point, you are correct. (Other than the Yen is Japanese, not Chinese. The Chinese currency is the Yuan Renminbi.) Why do you think they have Russia, who is now their "boy" getting in bed with Germany....who do you think got Russia staggering inflation under control. Germany's D mark will be backed by Gold, which they are asking/telling Greece to put up for collateral, along with property. Greece has already sold some of their islands trying to raise cash. If China sells all of our bonds back to us, we are f****d. Period. A combo of D marks, Ruble and Yuan Renminbi will become the new reserve curreny. The middle East and South American oil cartels would love it. It will make a wheelbarrow full of cash the way to go buy a loaf of bread, a dozen eggs and a gallon of milk....

    As far as their cut back on buying, take a look here A lead poisoning too far: Shanghai Johnson and the crackdown on China

    Make no doubt, China may not be throwing their weight around militarily, yet, but financially, they have and will continue, largely at our expense.

    And I don't care for banks either, but they are whining as it is with the new credit dard regs; Federal banking agencies finalize new credit card regulations to take effect starting July 2010 and charging us for using our debit cards. Obama has put the new regs on them and now they'll be wanting a new bailout in a couple of years. So I don't see the bankers making money with the Chinese. In fact I look for the Chinese to start buying banks shortly, along with all kinds of our property.

    And China is now a larger or equal trading partner than the USA with Peru, Brazil, EU, Australia, Russia...amoung a few.

    Sir, China is out to shut us down. Everyone knows it and we will be going it alone before it's all said and done....

    We'll see.

    Jimmy
     
    Last edited: Oct 24, 2011
  9. partdeux

    partdeux Well-Known Member

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    Chris Martenson did a great write up... unfortunately you have to be a paid member to read pt II

     
  10. bkt

    bkt New Member

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    Chris Martenson is someone everyone should pay attention to. If you haven't yet gone through it, please check out his Crash Course. Very interesting and disturbing information....

    All central banks are very intertwined, so it won't come as a surprise if once the dominoes start falling rapidly that our own Federal Reserve/Treasury will be similarly screwed.
     
  11. TLuker

    TLuker Active Member

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    BKT, good observation about a strong dollar hurting our exports. At the moment I can't imagine the world change to any other reserve currency. At the end of day, I don't think anyone really trusts China or Russia (too totalitarian), and Germany will have its own problems if the Euro collapses.

    Global instability will hurt us because we need to be exporting more and that is not going to happen if the world's economy collapses. On the flip side, the price of everything would go down because the value of the dollar would rise simply because there really is no viable alternative?

    JonM - There were strong capitalistic governments in control of Germany after WWI, the allies. Germany didn't stand a chance after WWI because of the economic position we put them in following the war. That is in part why WWII was all but inevitable, and that is why the Marshal plan was enacted following WWII.

    I guess my biggest concern is Russia. All it will take is someone in Russia getting ambitions of empire again and Europe would likely fall pretty quick (it will be called a foreclosure and Germany could help Russia pull that off). China pretty well controls Asia now. The US would become the dominate power in North and South America only. I can easily see the world being divided up in that manner?
     
  12. Johnny357

    Johnny357 New Member

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    We rose to be the last superpower in the world because after the ashes of WW2 settled we were the only country left with any modern manufacturing capability. It took Europe and Asia decades to rebuild industries, plus they lost a lot of labor in the military and civilian casualties. Meanwhile the U.S. had all these nice new chemical, tank, and plane factories that could switch from war material to supplying the goods that the rest of the world needed. Our mighty middle class arose from that post-war honeymoon when there was plenty of demand for everyone here to get fat off of. Now we are in the hangover decades when things are settling back to where nobody is buying what we are selling.
     
  13. Jimmy

    Jimmy New Member

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    Sorry folks. Not trying to start trouble. Just making points with the facts that are out there. IMF is who decides the World's Reserve Currency. They are not happy with the US and since our small downgrade and talk of another, they can take it from us without much notice.

    That is what I prep even harder for now. Wasn't trying to be polictical as much give my reasons for being ready to go to ground, if need be.

    I hope it never happens, but as one big banker has said, "The USA's finance is as safe as Peral Harbor was.....".

    There are forces out there that are not looking out for our best interest.

    I hope I'm wrong more than you think I am.....I'll be the first to be relieved.

    Jimmy
     
  14. mrm14

    mrm14 Active Member

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    I don't think that Germany will allow itself to go through what it did after WWI and before Hitler. That being said and the Deutch mark being reprinted is merely hedging it's bet. A Polish world history teacher of mine in 1972 and who fought the Germans in WWII did say that if ever west and east Berlin rejoined to watch out.

    China is on the verge of hyperinflation and Russia is still a total mess. However, China may be trying to become a super power as it needs resources like oil.

    Just my 2 cents worth.
     
  15. TLuker

    TLuker Active Member

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    Jimmy, I agree that a lot of folks aren't happy with our financial status but I just can't really see any real alternative to the dollar right now? But who knows?

    I really don't have a clue as to what is going to happen economically, but militarily my money is on Russia dominating Europe in the near future. I also have no idea how that will workout in regard to NATO and us, but NATO already seems to be failing apart? I can also see a lot of wealth fleeing from Europe ahead of the Russians and heading here, and every economy would be in trouble.
     
  16. Dennis845

    Dennis845 New Member

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    I must say, there's some smart people here that's aware of exactly what's happening and what may occur. The majority of Americans are oblivious to what's occurring and assume their lives will not change. Personally, based on history and the modern philosophy of the elite and liberals, I believe the world is ripe for a one world currency. When the house of faith based fiat cards finally crumbles, there will be no other fiat system acceptable. We have the United Nations, World Trade Organization, World Bank, etc. etc. Doesn't it make sense with these controls in place to next have a one world currency, then a world army for enforcement? The "enlightened" believe wars will be a thing of the past with a one world government. A one world currency would promote trade and ease payment barriers (think European Union).

    If you disagree with me, take it up with my chicken bones, Tara cards, and crystal ball, they told me :cool:
     
  17. partdeux

    partdeux Well-Known Member

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    How is that working in Europe right now? Expand it from the couple dozen countries to almost 200, not a chance in hell!
     
  18. partdeux

    partdeux Well-Known Member

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    USD is 2/3 of the global reserve currency. Euro is another 25%. Not only that, but the US banks, thanks to CDS and derivatives, are back stopping the Euro. That puts the USD directly or indirectly reserve currency for an extremely high percentage of the global money.

    Euro is in deep doodoo, China is overly dependent on trade with US, Japan has their own problems. US, in spite of all it's issues, is still the global reserve currency and will be for many more years.
     
  19. Jimmy

    Jimmy New Member

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    Not what I'm reading, but I really do hope your right.

    Jimmy
     
  20. Jimmy

    Jimmy New Member

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    Ok I believe you. :rolleyes:

    Jimmy