First trip to the range with RRA LAR-8

Discussion in 'AR-15 Discussion' started by BB98338, Nov 26, 2011.

  1. BB98338

    BB98338 New Member

    141
    0
    0
    I got a new Rock River Arms LAR-8 .308 on Friday and took it to the range.
    I shot 20 rounds of Remmington 150 gr. .308 WIN and 20 rounds of Hornady Match .308 168 gr A-Max. Out of the 40 rounds I had 8 rounds that got cocked in the chamber during feeding. It looked like the tops of the rounds were hitting something as the nylon stips of the Hornady's were scraped off. I have enclosed a picture of the 8 rounds that jambed. Took it back to the store today where it was dissasembled and nothing looked amiss. The store said it may be a magazine issue. I will try it again in a couple of days and see if it gets any better. I also sent an email to Rock River Arms to see what they say. Will keep everyone posted on the issues.
     

    Attached Files:

  2. mjkeat

    mjkeat New Member

    4,026
    0
    0
    I have honestly never seen anything like that before. Do you have another magazine?
     

  3. FCross7

    FCross7 New Member

    1,015
    0
    0
    I've had that happen with Remington UMC. In my opinion, it is THE cheapest ammo around, and I refuse to shoot it in any of my guns. I've had bullets drop into the cases like you've got pictured, I've pulled cartridges out of the package that had the neck all twisted and torn up and I've had cartridges with no powder (had to get a gunsmith to remove the cartridge from the rifle).

    I don't see how they have so many rounds slip through QC that have issues. I don't know, maybe I'm just unlucky, but I've had multiple issues, 10+, with UMC, and never have I had any sort of issue with any other factory ammo, the Russian stuff included.

    I bet it's the ammo, and not the magazines or the rifle. It's normal for rounds to get a little scraped up as they leave the magazine and enter the chamber. I'd shoot a couple other brands of ammo and see what happens.

    -Fred
     
  4. BB98338

    BB98338 New Member

    141
    0
    0
    I shot 20 more rounds of the hornady today and only had two jambs. Some of the other people at the range who were familiar with ar's seemed to think it might be a magazine problem. Seems to be getting a little better with time.
     
  5. FCross7

    FCross7 New Member

    1,015
    0
    0
    What were the jams? Failture to extract, failure to feed or what? I had a DPMS LR-308, and it had a habit of having failures to extract somewhat often at first, but after the first 250 rounds or so, those subsided. So if it's a new gun, it could just be a break in thing.

    -Fred
     
  6. BB98338

    BB98338 New Member

    141
    0
    0
    This is what is happening when the rounds jamb. This is the second round trying to load after the first round extracts. In fact on examining the picture that little red thing in the chamber is the nylon tip from one of the hornady rounds.
     

    Attached Files:

    Last edited: Nov 28, 2011
  7. BB98338

    BB98338 New Member

    141
    0
    0
    I took the LAR 8 out to the range again today. I noticed there was a little slop in the magazine that would allow it to rock forwards and backwards a little bit. If I held tension on it pushing it forward while shooting it fed much better. It may be that I have a mag that is too loose. Perhaps when it rocks rearward it causes the tip of the rounds to hit the bottom lip of the feed ramp.
     
  8. Sniper03

    Sniper03 Supporting Member Supporter

    7,729
    218
    63
    BB,

    Looking at your picture the first thing I noticed is your rifle Bolt Carrier Group and the Rifle is entirely too dry. You need to put some good quality weapon lube on the Bolt Carrier. It should look wet! Both Bolt, Carrier and glide surfaces. A new gun needs lube more than one that has been in service for a while, and especialy when it is new and breaking in. Personally I think that is the problem. As the others have mentioned it could very well be an ammunition problem possibly the neck is not crimped properly or the loads are a little light for the break in. I agree use some other manufactured ammunition. But above all lube the rifle. I have a RRA LAR-8 and it is very dependable. I have never had a malfunction with it. Besides RRA is as good as Gold about taking care of any issues. Keep us informed. :) The magazine issue mentioned is not out of the picture either if the problem persists

    03
     
    Last edited: Dec 4, 2011
  9. BB98338

    BB98338 New Member

    141
    0
    0
    Hello Sniper03.
    I took your advice and lubed the bolt. I also did some measurements of the slop in the magazine. The bottom of the magazine moves fore and aft 2mm. I also took a shot of the entrance to the feed ramp. I can see some wear that looks like where the tips of the bullets are hitting.
     

    Attached Files:

    Last edited: Dec 4, 2011
  10. Wilder

    Wilder New Member

    65
    0
    0
    It does look like a magazine issue to me. Try some magpul .308 p-mags, they are inexpensive and work great. In the pic showing the jam you can see the tip of the round under the one being fed trying to follow it to the chamber. This causes the round being fed to point too high and smashes the bullet nose into the breach face above the chamber, forcing the bullet back into the case. Scraping marks on the case will happen in any semi auto, it is really only a problem if it is leaving shavings from the case in the action. If not cleaned out these shavings can prevent proper movements of the internal parts.
     
  11. NativH

    NativH New Member

    215
    0
    0
    I've never seen a feeding problem in my Armalite AR-10. And certainly never anything like that but they use specific mags. One thing, once you iron the bugs out with your RR (I love their rifles BTW), try some Hornady 110gr TAP rounds. My AR-10 loves those lightweight little suckers and shoots easily MOA with a red dot. Crazy accurate is not an understatement for those rounds for some reason. A 308 AR is just right.
     
  12. BB98338

    BB98338 New Member

    141
    0
    0
    I sent an email to Rock River Arms and got a reply today. A tech looked at the last picture and told me that the wear marks are from the magazine and not the bullets. At any rate they wanted me to send it in to them and issued a RMA # and a ups call tag for tomorrow. Thanks for the input Wilder, I will try the magpul mags when I get the weapon back.
     
  13. Sniper03

    Sniper03 Supporting Member Supporter

    7,729
    218
    63
    BB,

    Definitely having contact in the Mag area. They will definitely take care of it for you as I stated since they have great customer service. They will also re-test fire it on the range before they send it back to you. But as I said, when you get her back do not forget to keep her lubed well. You will enjoy that rifle. Mine is a 1 MOA Rifle at 100 yards even with the 16" barrel. Also with them taking Inch or Metric FN FAL and LAR Mags if you find some good new mags at a gun show try to by the Inch over the Metric if possible. And if you buy any Metric Mags for it be sure they are Mil-Spec. You can tell by the designation on the wrapper. The magazines are not expensive. That is why RRA used that platform so that the magazines were not proprietary and could purchased from other sources rather than just them.
    Let us know how she does when you get it back!

    03
     
  14. Wilder

    Wilder New Member

    65
    0
    0
    Hope they work out your issues, rock river makes great guns. They are really good on customer service and generally do what they can to make sure their customers are happy. Let us know how it turns out.
     
  15. BB98338

    BB98338 New Member

    141
    0
    0
    I sent an email to RRA and they responded. I talked with a tech about the picture of the feed ramp. He says that is not from bullets but from where the magazine contacts the chamber. At any rate they said they wanted to take a look at it. Gave me an RA# and issued a call tag. UPS picked it up today and it is on the way back to them. Will post the results when I hear from them. Their service seems very good so far.
     
  16. BB98338

    BB98338 New Member

    141
    0
    0
    I just got an email from Rock River Arms that my LAR 8 is on it's way back to me. I hope they have some documentation on what they did. As soon as I get it back I will take it back to the range and report. Pretty fast turnaround considering the holidays.
     
  17. BB98338

    BB98338 New Member

    141
    0
    0
    I got my Lar8 back on Friday and managed to get it out to the range yesterday. Sadly I am still experiencing jams. Rock River tech sent me an email that they polished the feed ramp and reamed the chamber. Following is the range report:
    American Eagle 308 winchester 150 grain full metal jacket.
    1st mag 8 shots 1 fail to feed jam.
    2nd mag 8 shots 2 fail to feed jam.
    3rd mag 4 shots 1 fail to feed jam.
    4th mag 8 shots 3 fail to feed jam.
    5th mag 7 shots 1 fail to feed jam.
    6th mag 5 shots 1 fail to feed jam.

    Remington Core Lokt 308 150 grain PSP
    1st mag 8 shots no jams.
    2nd mag 8 shots 2 fail to feed jam.
    3rd mag 20 shots no jams.

    Hornady 308 winchester 165 grain SST
    1st mag 20 shots 2 double feeds.

    I have ordered a polymer mag from Rock River. I got an email from Rock River this morning and they said they are sending me a polymer mag as well. I am quite disappointed so far but Rock River seems to be trying to take care of the problem. I hope the new mag solves the issue. The Core Lokt seems to be working better than the rest.
     
  18. Quentin

    Quentin New Member

    7,551
    1
    0
    BB, I hope RRA is able to solve this problem, it's a shame to have this much trouble. Fingers crossed that the new mags correct this.

    I wonder how far RRA will go to fix this. It seems they should test it out with with different uppers and lowers on their end, and get it to run 100 rounds trouble free before returning it.

    Thank you for keeping us updated and let's hope you have good news with the new mags!
     
  19. Sniper03

    Sniper03 Supporting Member Supporter

    7,729
    218
    63
    BB

    First question did they have you send the magazine you had back to the Armory with the rifle. Also how many magazines do you have. Hopefully the new one will solve the problem. I am sure they test fired it before they returned it since they do range test all new rifles before they go out to the dealers as well as any that happen to come back in for service. But when you get it back if you are still having problems PM me and I will get it taken care of. The president and vice-president of the company are good friends of mine.They do have great customer service and warranty and very seldom have problems with their rifles due to the live fire testing.

    03
     
  20. BB98338

    BB98338 New Member

    141
    0
    0
    I got some new magazines from Rock River Arms, one of them was free. I took it to the range and fired it up. There were no more jambs so the magazines worked great. I had another issue come up however. Two or three shots and and then a click. Extracted the round and the primer had a tiny dent in it. This happened about every third or fourth shot. A couple of range guys were there and they completely stripped the weapon. It was noticed that there was a burr on the firing pin. I took it to the store where I bought it and they stripped it again. Enclosed is a pic of the firing pin with the burr partially filed off. We finished filing it and I will test the weapon again this weekend.
     

    Attached Files: