Firearms Security.

Discussion in 'Training & Safety' started by AR Hammer, Oct 7, 2008.

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  1. AR Hammer

    AR Hammer New Member

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    Most 'Gun Security' I see is a knob lock on the back door, which may, or may not, get used when someone leaves the house.

    I see firearms stacked in corners, hanging on walls open to the rooms, set in closet corners, but I still rarely see any trigger locks or extra/added security for firearms.
    .................................

    1. How far do you go to secure your firearms, both at home, and in your vehicles, when you are not in direct possession & control of them?

    2. Do you share in the blame/fault if a firearm is stolen in a common home burglary or carried off by someone that was invited to the home?

    3. Do you think gun owners should be REQUIRED to own gun safes for both long guns & hand guns?

    4. Do you think owning a gun safe is a 'Common Sense' purchase if you own firearms?

    Be constructive.
     
    Last edited: Oct 7, 2008
  2. hillbilly68

    hillbilly68 New Member

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    Last edited: Oct 7, 2008

  3. AR Hammer

    AR Hammer New Member

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    OK, I rephrased the second question.
    Do you think you share any of the blame if an unsecured firearm is stolen?
     
  4. ScottG

    ScottG New Member

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    Some are locked up, some are not. The ones I plan to use are in ready access places. I don't leave firearms unattended in vehicles. I don't CC so I'm usually without a gun in the car, or if I am, they remain on my person.

    Criminal activity is always the fault of the criminal, never the victim.

    Nope

    Yes, but sometimes you can't always afford one. Which do you choose: buy a gun safe, or fix your a/c system in August?

    I have no skills for constructing a gun safe.... :D
     
  5. fin24000

    fin24000 New Member

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    None of mine Are locked up right now...... ok well I only personally own 2 rifles and a striped lower but as my arsenal grows over the next few months I am looking at making a gun cage so they can all be in there cases while staying safe from them "walking off".... maybe someday I will care to get a safe but not right now....
     
  6. c3shooter

    c3shooter Administrator Staff Member

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    I have a "secure" room in my home- they don't make a gun safe large enough to hold all the crap I have been accumulating over the years.

    However, at the point of being blunt- to steal a firearm from my house, you are already several hundred meters INSIDE my property to get to the house. I did not leave a gun sitting on the roof of my parked car on a city street.

    Do I share blame if you come into my property and steal a gun? Let's change "gun" to anything else, and ask the question again. You forcibly entered my home, rummaged thru the medicine cabinet, found the bottle of percocet left over from my knee surgery, gulped all of them at once, and died from an OD. Am I to blame for your OD because I did not put my pills in a safe?:confused:

    And a note on safes- they are SOME protection- mainly against quick, quiet, causal theft- and the good ones are some protection against fire. HOWEVER- even the monster safes used by jewelers, that cost about $20,000 each, are only rated for protection against determined attack for a finite period of time. Ever see a portable cut-off saw?

    Sorry, bro- but don't make the victim of a crime out to be responsible for the crime. That's like saying "It's your own fault for parking a car like that in this neighborhood- you should have KNOWN that somebody would steal it."
     
  7. AR Hammer

    AR Hammer New Member

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    I have a 'Gun Room' also, and I went to some length to secure it since there are several Semi-autos and a few Class 3 guns in there.

    I feel that it's my responsibility to secure them in a manner that will deter all but the most determined and well equipped thieves.

    Agreed.
    Do you have any idea of how many firearms are stolen out of vehicles every year?
    At one gun show alone here thieves got over 300 firearms from vehicles in the parking lot!

    I see your point, but if we change that to 'Knife' or 'Ball Bat' or 'Bow & Arrow', exactly how many people do you think this guy can injure without being apprehended?

    With what most of the guys on this forum CLAIM they own, the police that responded would be hard pressed to match the firepower!

    It's not a question if the 'Burglar' or 'Robber' is committing a crime, because he/she certainly IS,

    It's a question of,
    "Do YOU think the right & privilege of owning firearms adds the extra responsibility of making them secure?"

    Did the person that broke into your house going to use those stolen 'Pills' to shoot up a school yard full of kids?

    There is no way to defeat a determined and well equipped professional thief. If there was, you wouldn't read about jewel exchanges, bank vaults and armored car company robberies.

    I'm talking about the punk neighbor kid that knows you have a house full of guns, and he has a wicked Meth habit,
    The idea is to make it as difficult as possible for him!

    I'm talking about the 'Friend of a Friend' that shows up to an open house party or cookout finding and pocketing a firearm...

    And I think you should take responsibility for your actions.
    If you park your car along side of 6 stripped, burned out wrecks, then you should expect yours to be the 7th.

    We teach our women & children's self defense classes to be aware of their surroundings, and NOT to put themselves in harms...

    If you are a woman walking alone, then stay out of alleys, deserted parking garages, and when you feel the hair stand up on the back of your neck, LISTEN TO IT!

    Hard to Rape & Murder a woman in the middle of a well lit street with people still moving around in both directions!

    Hard to abduct kids when they stick together, don't get in the car with strangers, and don't stray too far from home!

    Same with firearms security.
    If you aren't in denial on how easily someone can steal your hardware, then you will do something about securing it.
    It's not like they are stealing a TV or Microwave... I can't remember the last time anyone shot 12 people with an I-Pod!
    ------------------------------

    Anyway, this thread was supposed to lead to a discussion about security, and how much is 'Enough'...

    Personally, my full autos and serious semi-autos are rendered inoperative when not in use.
    Easy to do when cleaning for storage.

    They are secured in locking cabinets, and then the room they are in is locked as well.

    Other firearms, including all but muzzle loading pistols, are locked in cabinets or safes.
    Most of the wall space is taken up by gun safes or metal cabinets, so I used 3/4" fiberglass reinforced plywood to back them up with and screwed that to the studs.

    That fiberglass reinforcement is remarkably effective at defeating saws & drills!
    I killed about a dozen carbide tipped saw blades trying to install it!
    Finally went to an abrasive blade made for cement and just let it 'burn' through the wood!

    Older single shots (Antiques) and muzzle loaders are hanging on the walls, but they are hanging in a locked room.

    I have a security door on the room. The flimsy interior door wasn't much in the way of 'Security' so I replace it with solid fill security door with a dead bolt lock.

    I have 'Bugler Bars' on the one window in the room.
    ----------------------------

    Anyway, if you have fewer firearms, then less security would be necessary.
    When I lived in an apartment, I installed one of those less expensive sheet metal gun safes in the closet...

    It fit in the end of the closet so it was REALLY hard to get a pry bar in there to get at it!

    Two security locks, and thick sheet metal was all it was, but it DID defeat one break in burglar!
    It looked like it went through WW III when he was done with it, but he made so much noise trying to open it, the neighbors came over to see what the racket was and he got noting!
    ------------------

    OR, how about this one...
    My friend comes home to find his 5 year old boy running around the house with a loaded 1911 chasing his 3 year old daughter playing 'Cowboys'.

    The boy found it stuck between the mattress and box springs of his bed and decided to 'Play' with it.
    If it were a double action, we are sure he could have fired at least one round, maybe more...

    His wife now allows NO firearms in the home. PERIOD.
    Not even locked up or stored in the garage under lock and key.
    Guns go or the wife/kids do... That's not much of a choice!
     
  8. WAREAGLE

    WAREAGLE New Member

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    .................................

    1. How far do you go to secure your firearms, both at home, and in your vehicles, when you are not in direct possession & control of them?

    I have a Fort Knox gun safe which I keep all my firearms in at home. My concealed carry has a lock I keep in the car when I have to leave it... well it used to until i moved to California and cant carry a weapon. Blast! Now its in the safe, too, unless Im at home. Then its hidden near the bed.

    2. Do you share in the blame/fault if a firearm is stolen in a common home burglary or carried off by someone that was invited to the home?

    No one will ever steal my weapons. I check the safe's lock constantly. OCD! Its my fault and mine alone if a firearm comes up missing. And if a burglar can carry the safe off and actually get into it.... holy heck hes motivated. and the payoff for him is going to be small.

    3. Do you think gun owners should be REQUIRED to own gun safes for both long guns & hand guns?

    No, but its a stupid idea not to own a permanent safe for a firearm in my opinion. First off, if you're weapons arent in your immediate grasp inside the home, an intruder has a chance of using them against you. Second, larger safes are typically fireproof. If your home catches on fire, your guns come out fine and none of the rounds have a chance of going off and causing addition damage. Small carry-able safes are ridiculous however, considering a thief could just walk off with it.

    4. Do you think owning a gun safe is a 'Common Sense' purchase if you own firearms?

    Yes. It protects your firearms, and we all know those dang things are expensive!
     
  9. dragunovsks

    dragunovsks New Member

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    None of my guns are locked up. However 2 are in a wooden gun cabinet with the door closed (glass door), 3 are hanging on the wall in a horizontal gun rack. I also have my .45 in my truck door pocket and a 12g pump behind the seat. The reason behind the unlocked guns, my wife and I both know how to use them and we have no kids. I like to be able to get to them when I need them.
     
  10. SGT-MILLER

    SGT-MILLER New Member

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    My current firearm (I only have 1 pistol right now......restarting my firearms collection) is secured in such a way that it is safe from my children, but I can still access it within a reasonable amount of time.

    I do think that it is good common sense to secure your weapons when you can. Better to be safe and secure, then having the horrible knowledge that a stranger has taken your firearms, and may be planning a killing spree with them.

    Everyone has their own right to store their firearms as they see fit, but there are possible consequences to all actions.
     
  11. gorknoids

    gorknoids New Member

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    How much does the average gun safe weigh? I'm only asking because I found the safe from a gas station in the woods a couple of years ago, and tend to think of gun safes as pre-packaged loot.
    Yeah, I only own 3 guns, so have at me! :D
     
  12. SGT-MILLER

    SGT-MILLER New Member

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    I wish I had three guns...lol.

    The only one I own right now is a Hi-Point C9 (go ahead..make jokes because I don't care.....lol).

    Soon though, I'll increase the number to at least 4 guns total (I hope).
     
  13. WAREAGLE

    WAREAGLE New Member

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    depends. my fort knox is pretty hefty... maybe 500-600lbs? Ive never had to move it but once and it took a big heavy dolly truck and 5 guys. ive heard of safes such as the Safari 30 gun safe weighing in at 1100 lbs!
     
  14. Mark F

    Mark F New Member Supporter

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    Well.... in revolvers I have 11. Auto-loaders including my newest P345 purchase brings it to 9, and 3 long-guns. That's 23 guns in 7 calibers.

    Yep that's what I counted. I have a 17 cubic foot gun safe (about the size of a refridgerator) but it mostly has important papers in it as well as my "hunting" guns. The others are scattered throughout my home & vehicles in strategic locations not visible to the casual looker. I have a gun shop in the house where I re-load and store all my ordenance, which is approximately 14,000 rounds total. I re-load 4 of seven calibers.

    I keep one auto-loader in my pocket since I have my CHL (Concealed Handgun License), One in each vehicle w/2 backup mags. and 5 well placed revolvers in the house. My wife keeps one auto-loader in her purse.

    JUST SO YOU WILL KNOW, the "national Average" of guns is 6.7 guns PER every man,woman, and child in the USA.

    Y'all need to get with the program! And get some more guns...
     
    Last edited: Oct 10, 2008
  15. spittinfire

    spittinfire New Member Supporter

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    I grew up knowing where all the guns were but I knew not to mess with them and none of them were locked up. I currently don't have kids but my wife knows where they all are and she knows their condition. All of mine are tucked away but not locked up. I do want to get a gun safe but right now it's just not in the cards. When we can afford it I'll get one. My wife supports the idea and likes the fire protection it offers for other items as well.
     
  16. dragunovsks

    dragunovsks New Member

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    A small gun safe is useless if you don't bolt it down, I plan on getting one when I can afford it and bolting it to the wall as well as the floor in at least 6 places. I can't afford anything that's so big it can't be carried out, my boss has one that had to be installed (bolted to concrete slab) before the house could be built around it. It was a Fort Knox brand and weighed over 3000 lbs empty. I plan on getting one that is about a 24 gun.
     
  17. Rentacop

    Rentacop Well-Known Member

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    Gentlemen :
    It is doubtful that a mass killer will stopped if he's unable to steal your gun . Gun control doesn't work .
    That said, guns are rarely covered by insurance and handuns are routinely stolen any time a burglar finds one .
    If you can't afford a safe, such as a Fort Knox from the A.G. English company, you can lock your handguns inside a file cabinet with a padlock and bar added . Thieves will not waste time cracking it because they won't know what is inside. Weigh it down with lots of ammo and reloading supplies or some bricks . Mechanic's tool cabinets work just as well . Long guns can be placed in a junked freezer or refrigerator, but drill ventilation holes and put a chain around it with a padlock . You can use a pair of eye bolts an a padlock on the door to your storage room too. That is "security in depth" or " Layered Security " or " The Onion System ", if you prefer .
    Massad Ayoob stores his handguns in a safe deposit box at a bank .
    You can run a cable through all of your long gun trigger guards and lock them together if they are out in plain sight .
    Look into a good deadbolt lock for your bedroom door and exterior doors . An alarm system is costly but effective too .
    If you buy a safe, you can set it in a closet or storage room so no one knows you have it . Used safes can be cheap as people hate to have to move them when they relocate . Change the combiation after you buy one .
     
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