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Federal court says "not so fast on that pistol brace ban"

228 Views 10 Replies 7 Participants Last post by  Southernguns
I am pleasantly surprised at this 11th hour enjoinment. I didn't expect to see anything happen with this until long after the ban went into effect.

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I am pleasantly surprised at this 11th hour enjoinment. I didn't expect to see anything happen with this until long after the ban went into effect.

I always thought it was amazing how those stabilizing braces jumped off a gun then killed people. Saves a lot of ammo I guess...... :rolleyes: Anything to hurt God given gun rights. Oh, we have a 2A as well.
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It only applies to the plaintiffs and FPC, however another filer stated they are having a conference with the court tomorrow morning, screen name of Nolocontendre on another firearms board. Given the number of lawsuits filed, I would have to bet it gets a nationwide stay very shortly. If it makes it to SCOTUS, there is no way the ban would survive...but I COULD see fed.gov reclassifying braces as a medical device, only sold as DME medical warehouses with a valid prescription.
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SCOTUS is being very picky with their 2A cases, and rightfully so. Even though it takes forever their rulings have been substantial. If only some of these states could follow through

I don't know if any big ones on the docket like "assault weapons" bans in states like my own. I think we are more likely to see a conservative majority for the executive and legislative branch before scotus judgment happens on that. Maybe by then we can get some of our rights back through congress at that point
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There use to be a stigma against crossbows (another one handed weapon).
Now it is being accepted as a valid hunting option in most states.
In fact, my state allows use during bow season regardless if a handicap exists or not.
US Crossbow Regulations
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Regardless of how the pistol brace goes in the courts, I have to wonder how they're going to "catch" anyone (milliions) violating the ban? People do what they want to do. Make something scarce and invariably, it goes underground and people get more of it. i.e.---alcohol probation, drugs, and felons with guns. When will they ever learn? They must be past kindergarten teachers.
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The ruling has some specifics.
Basically, one should not be able to use the stabilizing brace as a butt stock.
Factoring Criteria for Firearms with Attached “Stabilizing Braces” | Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives
The ruling has some specifics.
Basically, one should not be able to use the stabilizing brace as a butt stock.
Factoring Criteria for Firearms with Attached “Stabilizing Braces” | Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives
Hm. For nearly everyone, I'd think, a so-called "stabilizing brace" is the functional equivalent of a "stock." After all, a stock's primary purpose is to, um, stabilize the aim of the thing. Heck, on that basis, I'm surprised stocks and braces and whatever else is similar can't simply be deemed safety elements. Like the supposedly-dangerous "barrel shroud."

Of course, we know why no such thing'll ever happen, not so long as the RKBA is taking pot shots from such people. Takes a lawyer to make a mountain out of this mole hill.
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Ability to shoulder, it's a stock, it's not stock is actually irrelevant absolutely because the ATF shot themselves in the foot (pun intended) on the matter. They have changed their position concerning "shouldering" a pistol brace several times. At first it was illegal to do, then it wasn't, then it was, then it became not illegal, but vague (there's a common theme here) in that if shouldered "incidentally" to the operation of the weapon then it's ok...you just aren't supposed to shoulder it all of the time. That was their last official letter on the matter.

Concerning what they're going to do if people simply don't comply with the brace ban, we can get a potential glimpse if we observe what has/is happening around the FRT's (forced reset triggers). As some may recall, a man invented the FRT and marketed it under the business name of Rare Breed (there is also the Hellfire, another FRT). The ATF sent them a cease and desist early last year and he took it to court and lost when the ATF deemed FRT's as "machine guns."

Not long after, the ATF then sent letters to everyone who had purchased an FRT notifying them of the requirement to turn them in as they were now illegal. They went through the dealer books and went after every person that purchased one.

That is one way they could go after a lot of brace owners. A bit larger mountain of paperwork and purchase records to sift through, but never under estimate the government's tenacity in tedium if they're on a mission to trample your rights. If you ever purchased a pistol brace(s), it's possible you might receive a letter from the ATF, or possibly even an actual visit.

To further muddy the already opaque waters, one of the options concerning the braces was to remove AND RENDER UNUSABLE the brace. The ATF, after yet another swirl of mud, removed that verbiage, but then once again added it. Additionally, the ATF stated that possession of a functional brace and a pistol would constitute "constructive possession."...and all of this right as Dettelbach testified under oath in Congress that all one has to do is remove the brace from the pistol and all is legal. He was even asked spoecifically if it had to be destryed, he said no. He was asked if they would prosecute anyone for constructive possession and he said no, the parts just had to be separated ...in complete conflict with what the ATF had just released. So, right now, no one knows what the heck the ATF intends (but we can certainly guess). I can see a "I misspoke" coming down the path from their own director.

From the ATF's website as of this posting (Factoring Criteria for Firearms with Attached “Stabilizing Braces” | Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives)

"Other compliance options provided under the final rule are the following:
  • Remove the short barrel and attach a 16-inch or longer rifled barrel to the firearm,
  • Permanently remove and dispose of, or alter, the “stabilizing brace” such that it cannot be
  • reattached,
  • Turn the firearm into your local ATF office,
  • Destroy the firearm

Yet, the director of the ATF said this 2 weeks ago:

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Ability to shoulder, it's a stock, it's not stock is actually irrelevant absolutely because the ATF shot themselves in the foot (pun intended) on the matter. They have changed their position concerning "shouldering" a pistol brace several times. At first it was illegal to do, then it wasn't, then it was, then it became not illegal, but vague (there's a common theme here) in that if shouldered "incidentally" to the operation of the weapon then it's ok...you just aren't supposed to shoulder it all of the time. That was their last official letter on the matter.

Concerning what they're going to do if people simply don't comply with the brace ban, we can get a potential glimpse if we observe what has/is happening around the FRT's (forced reset triggers). As some may recall, a man invented the FRT and marketed it under the business name of Rare Breed (there is also the Hellfire, another FRT). The ATF sent them a cease and desist early last year and he took it to court and lost when the ATF deemed FRT's as "machine guns."

Not long after, the ATF then sent letters to everyone who had purchased an FRT notifying them of the requirement to turn them in as they were now illegal. They went through the dealer books and went after every person that purchased one.

That is one way they could go after a lot of brace owners. A bit larger mountain of paperwork and purchase records to sift through, but never under estimate the government's tenacity in tedium if they're on a mission to trample your rights. If you ever purchased a pistol brace(s), it's possible you might receive a letter from the ATF, or possibly even an actual visit.

To further muddy the already opaque waters, one of the options concerning the braces was to remove AND RENDER UNUSABLE the brace. The ATF, after yet another swirl of mud, removed that verbiage, but then once again added it. Additionally, the ATF stated that possession of a functional brace and a pistol would constitute "constructive possession."...and all of this right as Dettelbach testified under oath in Congress that all one has to do is remove the brace from the pistol and all is legal. He was even asked spoecifically if it had to be destryed, he said no. He was asked if they would prosecute anyone for constructive possession and he said no, the parts just had to be separated ...in complete conflict with what the ATF had just released. So, right now, no one knows what the heck the ATF intends (but we can certainly guess). I can see a "I misspoke" coming down the path from their own director.

From the ATF's website as of this posting (Factoring Criteria for Firearms with Attached “Stabilizing Braces” | Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives)

"Other compliance options provided under the final rule are the following:
  • Remove the short barrel and attach a 16-inch or longer rifled barrel to the firearm,
  • Permanently remove and dispose of, or alter, the “stabilizing brace” such that it cannot be
  • reattached,
  • Turn the firearm into your local ATF office,
  • Destroy the firearm

Yet, the director of the ATF said this 2 weeks ago:

This dude if really creepy. Wonder what's wrong with him.
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