Does Upstate New York have the answer to breaking free of Gun Control?

Discussion in 'New York Gun Forum' started by Vincine, Mar 4, 2014.

  1. TekGreg

    TekGreg Lifetime Supporting Member Lifetime Supporter

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    So how does the state pass laws? Do they pass a state law and then say this is only recognized (or enforced) in New Amsterdam? And what if a city in New Amsterdam wishes to accept or enforce the law? They are in the State and therefore could adopt and enforce it against the separation agreement. I think this would turn into a hotbed of factiousness from which a state may never recover.
     

  2. Vincine

    Vincine New Member

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    I'm guessing there'd be two 'capitals', one for each region.
     
  3. Yunus

    Yunus New Member

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    I think there would have to be 3, 1 for New York, 1 for New Amsterdam and 1 for the official state capital which would still need to exist to keep the other 2 in some form of alignment.
     
  4. TekGreg

    TekGreg Lifetime Supporting Member Lifetime Supporter

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    As I read the article, it sounded like everything as a state stays the same, the legislature just sets an imaginary line that separates the state ideologically and economically. State taxes still go to Albany, which also gets into contention over where money is earned and spent.

    Understand, I'm going by the article only, but as I was raised in the Communist State of Kalifornia, and lived in four different areas of it, I can see L.A. And San Francisco saying they deserve the bulk of the taxes because they have a huge infrastructure, Sacramento (the Capitol) saying they need to control it for the whole state, and the Central Valley (Bakersfield to Lodi) claiming that they need a large share, as they generate 70% of the agricultural goods exported. The mountain counties have always hated the liberalism of the "flat landers" and would be in the fight as well. New York is only talking about TWO zones of separation. SIX zones in Kalifornia would cause chaos from what I have witnessed. Sacramento would pass state laws that would only apply in certain zones, but factions in other zones would try to adopt them, stating that it was a state law, which would be true.

    The only way I can see this working is that there is a new line of demarcation, such as city and county, that would create a new level of organization, with its own legislature. However, this would still not circumvent the fact that State Law covers the entire State, even if certain zones choose not to enforce or recognize it.

    Something I once read said, "A law is only valid where enforced." In Kalifornia, police and Highway patrol were not enforcing a law that said you had to secure an animal riding in the back of a pickup with a leash or strap. The ASPCA followed LEO's with a camera who were following pickups with unsecured animals and recorded hundreds of incidences of enforced violations. A judge fined the departments and for years you couldn't back out of your driveway with your Beagle in the pickup bed unsecured without an LEO lighting you up! Just because it is unenforced doesn't mean it's not a law, and enforcement can start any time a political body wishes it.

    As long as their is one state legislature and they have power over the state, the entire state, I can't see that further separation would work. I would LOVE to have a workable solution, but I hope that someone else can see something I have not.
     
  5. WebleyFosbery38

    WebleyFosbery38 New Member

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    The Idea is interesting but your not gonna get Socialists downstate to give up a single ounce of control over all of the state. They would have to pay the real price for the things we provide them then like water, Electricity and food and they wouldnt feel safe in their weekend getaway homes upstate if they couldnt disarm us.
     
  6. Vincine

    Vincine New Member

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    There wouldn't be a NYS, except for national matters.

    "Instead of officially splitting into two states, New York would split into 2 autonomous regions, New York consisting of NYC and surrounding areas including long Island and upstate which would be renamed New Amsterdam, it’s original name.

    The state would remain, in a sense funded by the 3 percent sales tax, and would remain united for federal purposes such as the Electoral College and congressional seats. But the power on all state matters would be transferred to the regions. In this way an Act of Congress is unnecessary. While downstate pushes for their high taxes, gun control and general nanny state nonsense; Upstate is free to embrace guns, hydraulic fracture for oil and gas and basically enjoy the all around liberty and freedom that the downstaters seem to despise so much."


    I wouldn't think this likely, but it would sure beat a 'civil' war.
     
    Last edited: Mar 4, 2014
  7. wittmeba

    wittmeba New Member

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    Control and Taxes. Those will be the major battles. I don't know but there would certainly be a great deal of involvement by the feds - like it or not.

    We would have to change "Old Glory" too :)
     
  8. TekGreg

    TekGreg Lifetime Supporting Member Lifetime Supporter

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    "But the power on all state matters would be transferred to the regions. In this way an Act of Congress is unnecessary."


    This is where the vagueness bothers me. The fed only recognizes New York as one state, only has Senators and Congressmen from New York, yet the State sees itself as two regions, wholly separate? The details would determine if it was workable.
     
  9. c3shooter

    c3shooter Administrator Staff Member

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    Gee- why would you want to let the Constitution get in the way of splitting one state into two?

    By the way- all of you folks in "West" Virginia- your taxes are overdue- by 150 years.

    Love and kisses- the folks at the Capitol in VIRGINIA. :D



    (And for those that slept thru History class- the Western Counties of Virginia met in convention and decided to break away in 1863. Contrary to all established law- but we still love you as neighbors)
     
  10. wittmeba

    wittmeba New Member

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    California has been talking about splitting for about 40 years that I know of. I doubt either Ca or NY will split in my lifetime...but I am 65 too.