Cops and Tazers

Discussion in 'Other Weapons' started by TruthsRazors, Mar 16, 2009.

  1. TruthsRazors

    TruthsRazors New Member

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    Whats everyones take on cops being given tazers? It seems like since they are told these are relatively safe the chance of them being implemented unnecessarily shoots up. It seems like every week there is another story of an abuse of this tool. I think way to many people are getting injured by these unnecessarily.
     
  2. cpttango30

    cpttango30 New Member

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    I would rather get injured by a tazer rather than injured by a 9mm. Take your pick. I think it is ust the media trying to report the news that it wants.

    If one person a week is getting injured by a tazer think about how many peoples lives it has saved in the process. Many tazings would have been shooting 15 years or so ago.

    If you don't want to be tazed then do what your told. If you think it was not right then complain about it after.
     

  3. Yunus

    Yunus New Member

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    Or you do what your told and your pinned on the ground and a BART cop means to grab his Tazer but grabs his gun and shoots you in the back instead. Your dead because the cop had a Tazer. Remove the Tazer from his belt and he would have never mistook his firearm for a Tazer.

    I agree with TruthsRazors that Tazers are more dangerous because people are told how safe they are. Anyone reasonable person who carries a gun knows that if they pull that trigger they may take a life. Many people don't realize Tazers can kill too, both Cops and civilians.
     
  4. orangello

    orangello New Member

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    Since the "don't taze me bro" incident, i've been noticing regular stories about taser use situations that appear to be misuse or abuse. As always, the media doesn't seem to provide the whole story on these incidents. It is my belief that they are being overused when simple physical manipulation of the suspect would get the job done more safely. I do realize that physical contact increases risk of injury to the officer; i believe that is part of the job these officers have accepted. If there is an unarmed "suspect" (maybe just some idiot arguing about signing a ticket in Utah :rolleyes:) who is being uncooperative, the police response should not involve a device that is potentially lethal.

    I think the ticket incident in Utah ended up costing the state about $60,000 to settle & no telling how much in PR costs & legal consultation fees. I'd prefer my tax dollars be put to better use.

    On the other end of the spectrum, i worry that the extra decision of taser vs. pistol might slow down an officer's response & get them shot (yet again tax dollars wasted and life lost).
     
  5. Dillinger

    Dillinger New Member

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    Source??

    I have a friend that recently went through the Academy for King County Sheriff. They were shot with both the pepper spray and the tazer. He has said over and over again that he would rather pull the tazer than pull the pepper spray because he felt it hurt like hell when it happened, but he recovered far faster.

    Until you walk a mile in their shoes, knowing that any traffic stop could lead to more excitement then most of experience all year, I am going to side with the boys in blue and their use of the tazer once in awhile.

    Especially when the "person of interest" is over 100 to 150 pounds heavier than the officer in question.

    Robo ( who happens to be a very large police officer if you don't know ) - What are your thoughts on the issue??

    JD
     
  6. Yunus

    Yunus New Member

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  7. Dillinger

    Dillinger New Member

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    Wow! I had not heard that up in this neck of the woods. Initial is this...

    We have the M-18 Tazer that my woman used to carry before she was trained in the use of a handgun for self defense situations.

    1) The tazer is question feels nothing like the pistol he was most probably carrying, so there was a training issue. It has a huge bulky handle and the safety is slide mounted, so he would have had to snap that off to use it. Oakland cops, when I was there in 2002 and again in 2005, all carry Glocks. There is no slide mounted safety.

    2) The tazer in question WEIGHS nothing like the pistol he was most probably carrying, so there wa a training issue.

    3) If the guy was face down, and the officer felt he still had to pull his "tazer" there was a problem that is not being reported yet...

    It would be interesting to see the whole story come out, but no doubt about it, that dumbass needs to be brought up on charges. Stupidty ( the form of being unfamiliar with your own weapons ) in a job like BART cop, or regular patrolman, should not be a pre-requisite of the job....

    JD
     
  8. dnthmn2004

    dnthmn2004 New Member

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    I'm in favor for police use of Tasers. The Taser is great because temporarily disables anyone, no matter how many drugs they are hyped up on.

    Unfortunately, the media gives its use a bad rep. They say its terrible that someone died from being shot with a Taser. Well, at least the officers were trying to use less lethal means instead of going straight to their guns.
     
  9. TruthsRazors

    TruthsRazors New Member

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    The issue is that peper spray does not cause permanent damage. Tazers on the other hand can cause neurological disorders as well as death and it is happening quite often. They implement these tools and provide unnecessary harm to subjects when other means could get the job accomplished.
     
  10. cpttango30

    cpttango30 New Member

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    If your not being a jack azz and or resisting there would be no reason for you to be on the ground correct? I have had my share of run in's with the law (I am a speeder) I have been removed from my car I have been surronded by 6 police officers beause my rifle was in my gun rack. Not once did I resiest and guess what they did what they needed to do and all was good. Did I get man handeled a little on the gun stop yah but oh well. If you don't want to deal with this keep your nose clean and follow the law.

    Your lucky I am not a cop you give me lip I am going to taze you right there and then. I don't play and I don't take crap.

    Just like the "Don't taze me Bro" video if the kid would have clamed down stopped resiesting and just go out of the buildging he would not have gotten tazed. He was resisting arrest for no good reason.

    Sorry unless people start bursting in to flames or start turning into brain eating zombies because they are gettign tazed I say let them have them.

    I think that the tazer belt should be used in court as well for all violent criminals.
     
  11. TruthsRazors

    TruthsRazors New Member

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    It is a valuable tool in that sense but to often it is not being used as such. The abuse of tazers is to common it seems. Instead of being used as a device to stop someone hyped up on drugs that is attempting to hurt someone, for instance, it is being used on someone who is merely angry or argumentative and not someone posing immediate danger. To use something that is potentially lethal on someone not posing immediate danger is ludicrous in my opinion. Someone can lose a father, mother, brother etc for nothing more than having a little to much attitude. If a cop can't keep his composure and tell when someone is a danger he or she should no longer be one.

    I'm glad to see so many opinions on this topic though. The pshycology of it all is very interesting.
     
  12. cpttango30

    cpttango30 New Member

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    You have never been sprayed have you. What if you are allergic to the capasim in the pepper spray? What if a person as moderate to seaver asthama getting sprayed with it could kill them. So we better do away with that. What about blinded people runing into traffic if used on a busy street? What the perp is on a bridge and gets sprayed then before the police and get to him falls over the edge of the bridge.

    These devices are not NON-leathel they are LESS THAN LEATHEL. That means that in some freek way you may die but we are trying to kill your azz because paying a shrink afterwards cuts into the bottom line.
     
  13. 1861

    1861 New Member

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    Just before I retired from the force in1998 we were starting to get them . My partner died next to me from being hit with taser for qualification . Autopsy showed he had an unknown to him heart condition and the taser through him into arithnma ( spelling) anyway I am against them . I worked the streets 29 years without using one and never shot anyone that a taser would have prevented . I see them used as a compliance tool and sometimes a punishment tool way too often.
     
  14. TruthsRazors

    TruthsRazors New Member

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    Not true at all. The death examples you just gave are not a direct result of the substance themselves but rather reactions of the person in certain situations. When a cop uses pepper spray they are right next to that person and often have them in their grip. The chances of him running anywhere are slim. If the person did run out and die in traffic that is not the cops fault as he did not use unnecessary force. As far as asthma, i have it and the effects of asthma after you are sprayed can be treated with medication. You cannot treat the neurological symptoms or death that a tazer can cause.

    And if the guy falls off of a bridge he was either the fastest man in the galaxy for getting away that fast when blinded and in pain or the cop didnt ty to grab him because thats how close the proximity would be. Plus, when you get hurt do you take off at a dead sprint? Lol that idea is hilarious. If you are hurt you are usually stunned, not taking off at a dead sprint.
     
  15. Dillinger

    Dillinger New Member

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    You assume that when you are hurt you are in a position where you want to be.

    Tango has a point in the fact that someone being tazed, or pepper sprayed, doesn't want to be in custody in the first place.

    1) Fact - The person who is under suspicion or something - and if they are innocent, they comply and there is no "issue".

    2) Fact - If you are resisting, you can catch a beat down, you can get tazed or you can get pepper sprayed.

    3) Fact - People are getting larger, and from personal experience I can tell you that especially in Oakland, there are some VERY big boys out there that have the Eff the Police Mentality.

    4) Fact - I just watched a video the other night with a guy in a holding cell, in police custody, who was defiant and didn't want to be finger printed, nor did he want to calm down. Two cops were in the cell with him and on camera he lashed out at both. The first cop got a double handed throat push ala Steven Seagal and the next guy got thrown aside in a Judo move WHILE he was bashing the guy across the thigh with a collapsible baton. Two more cops enter the fray.

    There are now four guys, one of whom pepper sprays the perp full in the face and the cop, who was easily 50 pounds larger than the bad guy, at the same time. The guy still manages to break free and gets out of the holding room door before he is wrestled to the ground in the hallway.

    Now, it was either the pepper spray, the Tazer, or a .45 in the chest, followed by one to three MORE rounds.

    Not every cop out there is as big as Robocop. Not every cop out there has a blackbelt in 4 martial arts.

    Try explaining to these guys families that using basic combat tactics taught at the academy is what they should have been doing and NOT pulling their weapon. I don't know about you, but if these are any indication of my options, your ass is getting drilled, you aren't getting the tazer or the pepper spray...

    Google Image Result for http://www.dlsports.com/knife_danger/knife_danger_3_small.jpg
     

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  16. notdku

    notdku Administrator Staff Member

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    Would much rather be hit with a taser than hit with a club.

    But honestly I'll put the odds at about a billion to one that I ever get either, knock on wood. I comply with LEO.
     
  17. dnthmn2004

    dnthmn2004 New Member

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    +1. Well said.

    The Taser gives police officers one more tool to use instead of their sidearm. The only way police officers are supposed to use their Tasers, are if the person is assaultive with intent to cause bodily harm. The other options in that level of threat perception is a baton, kicking techniques, etc. That kind of situation can get to the next level of 'use of force' in a hurry. If a Taser can make an assaultive person comply with a police officer so it doesn't escalade into deadly force, issue them to every single officer. If your all for taking away another tool to keep police officers safe and one more step before they have to use their sidearm, your IGNORANT! (are you the "don't tase me bro" guy?)

    Your argument seems to be misdirected. Your complaining about HOW a handful of idiot police officers use their Tasers, not that Tasers are bad themselves. Like cpttango said, it is a LESS THAN LETHAL tool. Yes, its not less than lethal to every single human in the world. Neither is OC spray or a baton. But anything that lets a police officer go home at the end of his or her shift is priceless.

    You need to understand that police officers have a very dangerous job and deal with some real nut jobs and morons in the field and not everyone can be treated like your grandmother. Such as the "dont tase me bro" dude. I laughed at that whole video, I really did. He could have walked out of there, but he doesn't know the meaning of the word comply.

    BTW, this is not the best site to argue about something like this. I'm sure there are several websites that you can pick fights. But this website is mainly for technical information and making friends.

    This is the coolest less than lethal weapon I have ever seen. [ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=44KVZLxm8a0]YouTube - Futureweapons - Taser Intl XREP[/ame]
     
  18. TruthsRazors

    TruthsRazors New Member

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    Really sorry to hear about your loss man.
     
  19. cpttango30

    cpttango30 New Member

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    If officers are using them in an incorrect manner then by all means remove the officers from the force.

    Your argument is the same the gun grabers use on us. You are blaming the tool and not the true problem at heart. The problem is not the traffic stop the problem is that cop used the tazer in the wrong way killing a person. When that happens the police officer needs to be brought up on nothing less than manslaughter charges and have his badge removed. You will not remove the problem by removing the tool. Look at Rodney King dude got one hell of a beat down with batons no tazers involved IIRC. Guess what those same officers would have used the tazer had they had them. Did he deserve to get that beat down I don't know because I was not there. The dude was speeding going 100+mph in a 25mph zone.

    1861 Sorry to hear about your partner. But, that was not the fault of the tazer it was really no ones fault because he had an undiagnosed heart condition. How can you blame the tazer for that happening. If you are wanting to point fingers then the OIC of that training session would be to blame in my book as he did not have all the officers get a medical eval before performing the training. You can point fingers all you want. Still doesn't mean the tazer was a fault. It did not force the man to die did it?
     
  20. robocop10mm

    robocop10mm Lifetime Supporting Member Lifetime Supporter

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    As an instructor in Firearms, Tasers, Batons, Pepper spray and a variety of physical restraint techniques, I have been tased (4X), Pepper sprayed dozens of times, whacked, beaten and choked out. The TASER is safe and effective. It has never been proven that a TASER killed anyone, EVER!

    To understand why there is so much bad press about the TASER, follow the money. The ACLU makes millions each year through lawsuits against cities and counties for "wrongful dealth" lawsuits across the USA. When we are given a non-lethal option, fewer deaths occur. Fewer deaths mean less money for the American Criminal Liberties Union.

    Law Enforcement has "force" in its core. It is not Law Enrequestment, Law Enpleasement or Law Enhold-your-handment. Force is a very real part of the job. Using effective force with out a TASER means beating the holy $hit out of a few people. Physical resistance yields physical force. Physical force leaves marks and breaks bones. TASER is an excellent tool. It can be misused but so can EVERY OTHER force tool.

    Until you have taken a "ride" on the TASER, you have no room to talk so STFU. Until you have fought for your life on a dark desolate back road with your backup 20 minutes away, STFU! The TASER is a perfectly appropriate tool. If it gets misused or abused, it is a matter for the local authorities. STOP BLAMING THE TOOL for the abuses of a few people.