Confusion, confusion...

Discussion in 'XD Forum' started by zhuk, Jul 13, 2010.

  1. zhuk

    zhuk New Member

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    I had a chance to go to one of the [very rare] indoor ranges today - only just found out about it's existence, out in the backblocks of some industrial area, as befitting such evilness. In fact I think there are only 2 in Sydney, total. They had an XD Tactical (well, HS) .357SIG & M&P9L and I wanted to compare, as well as 2 different calibres can anyway.


    Only at about 7m?? so you can see they are pretty bloody ordinary efforts lol

    Bearing in mind I haven't shot a pistol at all since early April (our pistol range has been closed due to spurious and fallacious "ricochet" charges made by another rifle club who have been trying to undermine us) and hence the groups were pretty bad all round. The recoil on the HS compared with a 9mm was pretty nasty heh, but overall even though both targets are remarkably (crappily) similar, it seems to me the main grouping on the HS was a little higher into the middle than the Smith, even if skewed right. Unfortunately they only had the large backstrap fitted and the mag release set up for right handers, but it was pretty comfortable; a bit more than the Croatian and seemed to fit my ridiculously small hand OK. Also regained the sight picture easier with the M&P (which could well be recoil-influenced, I'm not experienced enough to know).

    So, yeah. Having some second thoughts about the HS on order...the guy at the range said he doubted they would be in the country anytime soon, whereas there are quite a few M&Ps around. Would the 9mm have made a difference to the feel of the Tactical if they'd had one...What to do, what to do? damn lol


    [​IMG]
    HS .357SIG 5"

    [​IMG]
    M&P9L

    [​IMG]
    HS

    [​IMG]
    M&P

    Now in a bit of confusion - I know its difficult to compare since the recoil of the larger round was far greater. Wish I could have tried out a 9mm in both...


    Sorry if this is more of a rambling monologue; my natural tendency is to overthink sh*t a bit too much. I know you guys can't really give any advice much, its go with what's comfortable etc yeah I know. Trouble is, I really don't know now, heh.
     
    Last edited: Jul 13, 2010
  2. zhuk

    zhuk New Member

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    Just being a media whore, don't mind me :rolleyes:



    [​IMG]

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  3. AusLach

    AusLach New Member

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    Nice find! I'm really thinking about joining the pistol club up here, its right across the street and I'm keen to try it.
     
  4. zhuk

    zhuk New Member

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    Damn man, right across the street? :eek: GO for it!

    I love shooting rifle (just something about longarms hey :D) but pistol is just FUN...running & shooting etc just awesome. Ya can't do that with a rifle :p (well not legally lol)
     
  5. NGIB

    NGIB New Member

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    Considering you haven't shot a pistol much, these targets are certainly respectable. The .357 Sig (like it's cousin the .40 S&W) is a very snappy round with lots of muzzle rise. While I shoot a lot of pistols, the .40/.357 is my "weakest" due to the recoil impulse and you have to work to keep it on target. I find both the 9mm and .45 much easier to shoot - especially rapidly.

    As far as the M&P versus the XD, I've always preferred the XD myself. I find the trigger a tad better and it just feels better in my hand. I recently handled a buddies M&P that has had a professional trigger job and it's light years better than the stock trigger which I find a tad "vague".

    First time I ever saw a 1 lane pistol range though, what do they charge you to shoot there?
     
  6. zhuk

    zhuk New Member

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    Hey NGIB, many thanks for the encouragement - I really thought I did pretty rubbish today, but I shall defer to your experienced judgement :D I do think that I got more shots vaguely on target than I would have using the club's HK which is a goddam monster in my hand! So it just goes to show how important having something approaching a good hand-fit is :)

    We ought to get our range time back in a few weeks so hopefully back into regular shooting again; that is competiting, not practising. Today is the first time I've ever been able to simply stand in front of a target and just do that - practice - without the adrenalin-against-the-clock-craziness (which does tend to subvert your accuracy pretty efficiently lol)


    I know all the M&Ps I've handled in-shop have had triggers you felt you could almost grate cheese on :p but I'm told they even out well with use. Going to have to think long & hard about which really felt more comfortable; the HS seemed a heavier gun which might have helped accuracy-wise and if I can make maybe one more trip to try them again before my Permit to Acquire is issued that might help the decision making.


    As for prices - it was $65 for 50 rounds 9mm & 50 .357 + gun hire, not bad considering. It does look like only 1 lane, but there are 3 'booths' all up. Needless to say, no one else was there!

    Pistol shooters here are a miniscule minority: of the 5% of the total adult population who hold firearms licences, only 2% of that are pistol shooters.
     
  7. NGIB

    NGIB New Member

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    Actually, the $65 is much less than I expected. The same outing at my local range (using their ammo & gun) would cost $40-$45. Shooting their ammo is always costly even though my local hangout really sells for decent prices. As I bring all my own stuff, I just pay the lane fee with is $10 for the entire day. Here's a pic of me at a pin shoot at my range in Dec 08...
     

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  8. zhuk

    zhuk New Member

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    Nice photo, the falling pin is really effective. I also like the ceiling-holes :D


    Have an idea I got a discount on the gun hire, but I was suprised it wasn't more expensive too. Usually everything here is :rolleyes:
     
  9. CA357

    CA357 New Member Supporter

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    FWIW, I used to put my shots to the right as well. I had to work on my grip and my front sight alignment.
     
  10. orangello

    orangello New Member

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    Nice looking range there Z!
    I also like that front site on the HS.

    Those groups don't look so bad to me. It would be cool if you could side-by-side the two pistols in 9mm, but that sounds like a long shot.


    So, if you get the HS and don't LOVE it, can you sell it to another club member or back to the shop or what?
     
  11. Jo da Plumbr

    Jo da Plumbr New Member

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    Just for thought zhuk... the M&P comes with three sizes of palm swell for the grip. I have the small one on my 45 as I also have little mitts:D

    Makes handling a double stack easier.
     
  12. gorknoids

    gorknoids New Member

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    Clearly this isn't oranges/oranges, but the fix I found when shooting left-handed (My weak side) for that same problem was dialing in just a little more thumb. Even having played guitar for 35 years, I had a Hell of a time not "milking" the grip left-handed, but once I backed it up with my thumb it all came together.
     
  13. willfully armed

    willfully armed New Member

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    If you decide you like the M&P, and if its a possibility, order the M&P Pro. Much better trigger.
     
  14. zhuk

    zhuk New Member

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    Yeah, I knew my grip was pretty dodgy, CA. Apart from feeling rather rusty due to the length of time since I've shot a handgun, that enhanced recoil was kicking like a mule when you're only used to 9mm, heh.

    Know I need a lot more practice. And at least this can happen when I have my own firearm. Shooting once a week in competitions only you never really get to know what you're doing wrong - just that you suck, relatively lol




    Yes this is a good question! Don't really know re the shop policy...not being many pistol shooters in total I have no idea how easy they would be to shift; will have to ask. As for other members, its primarily a service rifle club (which also does pistol/shotgun/metallic silhouette .22 - the only one in Aust to have multi-disciplines) therefore not that many shoot handguns unlike a standalone Pistol club. Although as some people have mentioned that they were thinking about the HS in addition to guns they already have...so I might have that up my sleeve, orange. Thanks for the suggestion :)



    Yeah and mine are smaller than most - ridiculously small. That's something that I was thinking...the largest backstrap was the one fitted, and I'm wondering if my groups would have been closer to the HS with the smallest. I seemed to have to do some re-adjusting after each shot whereas it should be a solid hold continuously...could easily be sheer operator error though lol



    Can see what you mean by 'backing up with the thumb', gork. I guess that still applies to your strong side (am lefty if that wasn't clear); and I doubt I was having any kind of decent grip :rolleyes: Been too long away from it really....once we are back into competing and regain some familiarity, I'm going to go back to this range and re-evaluate, which might help get a better handle on the choices.

    One thing about waiting for on PTA, you do have time to figure out if what you want is really what you want. Well hopefully :D


    Appreciate the replies guys.