Colt AR-15...Are the LE and MT of different quality?

Discussion in 'AR-15 Discussion' started by SEHunter, Jan 2, 2010.

  1. SEHunter

    SEHunter New Member

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    Hey guys, been browseing the forum for a while and decided to sign up. Im looking into my first AR-15 and have to say it seems like wanting an AR is an addiction so i cant wait to get one and start shooting. Im into varmit hunting mostly and occasional targeting for fun so i want to go with either a 20" or 24" barrel, as i will be set up waiting and the extra bulk and weight wont be an issue for me.

    I decided to go with Colt and my question is about Colt having two web sites with their AR-15s'. One seems to be geared towards military/law enforcement use (LE) which all have 16" or shorter barrels and their regular site has models geared towards competition/target rifles (MT) and these have longer barrels. Are these two different breeds? I know a little about the Mil Spec stuff and was curious if the models with the longer barrels are of the same quality control and internal parts. Thanks.
     
  2. SEHunter

    SEHunter New Member

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    School the new guy fellows.
     

  3. robocop10mm

    robocop10mm Lifetime Supporting Member Lifetime Supporter

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    QC? the same. The only difference between the LE and MT Colts are the front 1/3 of the barrel and sometimes the bore. The MT's will not have the flash hider or bayonet lug. Many of the MT's will not be chrome lined. Generally chrome lined barrels are a little less accurate than non chrome lined.
     
  4. canebrake

    canebrake New Member

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    You're going to love the Colt!

    [​IMG]
     
  5. SEHunter

    SEHunter New Member

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    Guys, thanks to both of you!

    It has been like pulling teeth on another forum i am a member of to find answers about s Colt without hearing "paying for the name" or "BCM and LMC is better quality for cheaper", Geesh. So the MT are MILSPEC too, huh?

    Anyway, thats good. I actually was prefering a non lined barrel because i predator hunt at long range and will not be shooting high volume. I am leaning to the MT line because of that and the longer barrels.

    Is there a significant difference between the barrels that have the compensator and ones with a crown? I noticed both versions with each gun except the 24" stainless which i like alot.
     
  6. SEHunter

    SEHunter New Member

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    I was back on Colt's LE web site and noticed the 24" ss accurized is on there as well as the commercial site. Does that mean the accurized rifle is considered as a LE model?
     
  7. billt

    billt New Member

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    [​IMG]

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    These are a couple of new Colts I picked up this past week. A 6920, and a 6940.
     
  8. canebrake

    canebrake New Member

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    It all depends on what you are going to do with the gun. The carbine is a CQB gun and it's a flash hider on the muzzle.

    In your case, i don't think the rock chuck will be looking for muzzle flash.
     
  9. robocop10mm

    robocop10mm Lifetime Supporting Member Lifetime Supporter

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    As far as I'm concerned the whole "Mil-spec" thing is over blown and misunderstood. It is not possible for a current manufacture AR-15 to be "Mil-spec" because it is semi-auto only. Part of the mil-spec is the selectfire capability. The firing pin is different. The bolt carrier is different. The lower is different. An AR is NOT milspec, period.
     
  10. billt

    billt New Member

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    +1 !

    I couldn't agree more! I get so sick and tired of these 20 something "mall ninjas" carrying on and on about how Colt is the only manufacturer of AR-15 rifles that are "Mil-Spec". Even if it were true it does not mean automatically it is of better quality.

    A retired friend of mine who worked for over 40 years at the Lockheed Skunkworks once told me a story of how one time when Lockheed was involved in the building of the SR-71 Blackbird, that a high ranking Air Force General demanded the American flag was to be painted on the tail fin. Kelly Johnson tried to explain to him the paint wouldn't hold up at the speeds and altitudes the SR-71 flies at. He said, "Find one that will!" Lockheed spent over one million dollars of the Air Force's money trying with several coatings manufacturers, to develop a paint that would work. They managed to do so at great cost to the American taxpayer. Would this paint last any longer if you painted your garage with it?

    Mil-Spec is designed for a certain purpose. It doesn't mean in itself that anything that is Mil-Spec, is necessarily "better". The mall ninjas need to understand this. They don't. Bill T.
     
  11. cpttango30

    cpttango30 New Member

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    Mil spec means that the part meet's the specs set forth by the military arms review board (Or what ever it is called).
     
  12. Warhawk

    Warhawk New Member

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    To Put to Rest the Colt Issue.

    Here is what you Need to know.
    The Colt Ar-15 is prized most because they were the first to and the most expensive. Yes other manufactures have taken the Colt torch and made the AR-15 availible to civilians.
    The AR-15 can be made into any weapon you want. The lower reciever you can buy anywhere and and the uppers as well. If you want an A3 model mil-spec then you can simply buy the lower reciever and the A3 Upper reciever. If you bought a A2 and want an A3 simply remove the barrel and and change out the upper reciever and forward barrel gaurd and site. If you want a CAR-15 (or other wise known as M-4) simply remove the butt and forward assemple (barrel, and forward guard).
    You will need special tools to remove the barrel and pin punches to remove foward site.
    In any case what ever type of Colt you want you can own legally. The barrel length is the only thing you have to make sure is long enough not to land you in jail. Check your local laws for legal length. The heavy barrel on the H-bar Colt is a match barrel with tighter twist on the riflings and has a slight reduction in the barrel for higher vilocity. I would recomend that barrel or Colt for your first if you are still looking. Best Colt (AR-15 A2 H-BAR, Match Rifle)

    I am a gunsmith with many years working on AR's


    PS Yes the M-16 lower reciever is designed to hold the M-16 Selector switch and Hammer. the upper reciever is the same as the Colt AR-15 but the Bolt carrier is heavier and designed to handle full auto any atempt to change An AR-15 to A M-16 will end up in time exploiding on you. if anyone reading this has done that allready then you are takeing your life in your own hands and your freedom if you dont have full auto liciense
     
    Last edited: Jan 8, 2010
  13. hillmillenia

    hillmillenia New Member

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    I'm shocked! I've been ripped off!...so can we call it "Civilian Spec?":p
     
  14. robocop10mm

    robocop10mm Lifetime Supporting Member Lifetime Supporter

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    "Mil Spec" is the dimensional, tolerance, finish, heat treatment and testing specifications for the rifle.
    The dimensions and tolerances are specified to give parts interchageability needed so drop in replacements are easily handled at Company or Garrison levels.
    Finish is to insure corrosion resistance.
    Heat treatment is to insure strength.
    Testing is to make sure it is accurate enough and the heat treatment was done properly.

    WTS, the main issue is the bolt. Colt and FN are the only two makers that consistantly test the bolt to "Mil Spec". The testing involves placing the heat treated bolt in a test fixture, firing a "Proof Load" and then magnetic particle testing the bolt for stress cracks. The bolt is then marked "MP" meaning it has been magnetic particle (magnaflux) tested. All Colt bolts are magnetic particle tested. For a short time they deleted the "MP" marking on the bolts going into the civilian guns. They did so to save a few pennies (engraving MP on the already heat treated bolt was difficult and time consuming). They abandoned the cost saving measure when the customers complained the bolts were no longer magnetic particle tested. They were still properly tested, they were just not marked. Any bolt marked with a "C" for Colt IS magnetic particle tested.

    None of the other makers test the bolts in this manner. This certainly does not mean the bolts are cracked and prone to failure. I have never seen a failed bolt, ever.

    As far as the "Match" part of the Colt Match Target rifles. A friend has a Colt MT that will not shoot any better than 3" at 100 yards. He sent it back to Colt, they test fired it and said 3" is perfectly w/in their specs for a MT rifle. If they think 3" is "Match" I am disappointed.
     
  15. hillmillenia

    hillmillenia New Member

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    OK, OK I'll get serious for a moment but don't expect me to act this way very much...Mil-Spec is literally "Military Specification" or a book of specs or tolerances, finishes and on and on as required by the US Military. Some commercial stuff is possibly better and some not quite. Think of it as nominal acceptablity. Ok now I'm going back in my room...good night!:rolleyes:
     
  16. Glasshartt

    Glasshartt New Member

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    We are getting 10 LE6920's at work.
     
  17. JonM

    JonM Moderator

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    if your speaking military stuff mil-spec means it is made to given dimensions and finishes as stated above but by the lowest bidder. in civilian terms it means a part or collection of parts meets the military dimensions, finish on the parts in the civilian world may or may not meet the standard and quality of the part is purely left to the buyer to determine.

    when i look for parts for certain pieces of military collectable arms i have i look for milspec parts so i know they will fit the weapon with little to no mods on my part. milspec is a way for the military to be reasonably certain most parts will fit into most weapons for easy field repair.
     
  18. Warhawk

    Warhawk New Member

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    in reply to the mil-spec debate.

    Ok here is the skinny to Mil-spec. The US Military Has specifice criteria for how Weapons it wants for its personel. For Example: the 5.56 1/7 barrel is designed for nato and civilan amo. It is heavier and has more durability in combat. That is why you will only see them on the Pre-ban and Gov. only models. You as a civilian can buy theys barrels if you want. They are available to the public. But there is a growing demand for the few Military chomoly Barrels because they Hold up even better. These barrels were given to a few commands for testing and had good results. Now back to the civian barrel. other manufactures of the ar barrel do not make the nato barrel i mentioned above. these barrels will only shoot the .223 round only and not the nato 5.56. Now I know some of you are saying wait a minute the 5.56 and .223 are the same round. Believe it or not, they are not. You can not fire the 5.56 Nato round in a civilian .223 barrel Safely or in some case at all. The casing on the Nato round is heavier and will not fit in the breach. So you See when I say the Mil-spec Is really what you want in an AR that is what you really want. but for the extras, Like floating rails and adjustable stocks, after market is indead better than military spec. Larue Makes the best Floating Picatiny Rail system with its anit torque clip. expensive but worth it have them on my own AR's

    any more questions