Can I sell a custom built 10/22

Discussion in 'NFA/Class 3 & FFL Discussion' started by CUSTOM1022, Apr 4, 2013.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. CUSTOM1022

    CUSTOM1022 New Member

    1
    0
    0
    Im building a Ruger 10/22 magnum using a 80% receiver I ordered online (no serial #). I have a friend wanting me to build him one and i dont know if it is legal. How can i legally build and sale these guns. Any advise would be helpful.
     
  2. orangello

    orangello New Member

    19,156
    0
    0
    I thought you had to have a special license to manufacture firearms for sale to others, not 100%.

    edit* "not 100% sure about this" not "not 100% manufactured by you".
     
    Last edited: Apr 4, 2013

  3. purehavoc

    purehavoc New Member

    4,799
    2
    0
    No. if you bought a 80% receiver and built it , its yours until you have a FFL manufacturing license you cannot legally sell it . Even after that it will need engraved with your name , city and state
     
  4. c3shooter

    c3shooter Administrator Staff Member

    21,444
    552
    113
    As said, to build guns for sale, you need to be licensed as a type 7 FFL, and pay the Federal Excise tax on each gun you make. I would also strongly suggest that you check on zoning of your premises as a manufacturing business, that you incorporate, and get some product liability insurance.

    ps- don't think anyone but Ruger can call a gun a Ruger- and they got a bunch of lawyers to see that happens.
     
    Last edited: Apr 4, 2013
  5. orangello

    orangello New Member

    19,156
    0
    0
    It might be better all around if you simply advised your friend on where to order parts and how to assemble them.
     
  6. Josh1158

    Josh1158 New Member

    757
    0
    0
    How is this different then peacing together a ar then deciding you didnt like it and selling it to a friend ?
     
  7. orangello

    orangello New Member

    19,156
    0
    0
    I think that whole "no serial #" and "80% receiver" is the difference. In your sitch, the AR receiver would have a number already, as per some BS gun control law back in the 60's demands.
     
  8. c3shooter

    c3shooter Administrator Staff Member

    21,444
    552
    113
    It is no different- NEITHER is legal without a license. You can make a gun for your own use, or even to GIVE away. To make them for SALE is legally a different matter.
     
  9. Josh1158

    Josh1158 New Member

    757
    0
    0
    But if there gona sell a 80% reciever I would think they should assume its gona be completed at some point. Then you have the gun with no numbers. Is it wrong to decide to sell it a year or so down the road ?
     
  10. GrtWhytHype

    GrtWhytHype New Member

    213
    0
    0
    Its my understanding that guns are serialized as a function of commerce. If your gun is made by you and holds no serial number then it CANNOT be used in commerce. So SELLING it to your friend would be considered commerce AKA illegal unless you had the proper license.

    Now if your friend bought one and wanted to rent out your CNC or lathe I'm pretty sure that's a different story. Maybe a consulting or rental fee would be in order.

    Just my opinion. I'm not a lawyer.
     
  11. Sniper03

    Sniper03 Supporting Member Supporter

    7,713
    189
    63
    I am not a fan of these 80% deals becuase sooner or later someone is going to serve 10 years in Federal Prison and $20,000 Minimum Fine! Aint worth the chance for saving a couple of bucks or having a little fun building. Like it has been mentioned things that can get a good person tripped up. Are manufacturing a weapon without a Federal Manufacturers License, Federal Excise Tax violations, Manufacturers name on the Receiver, Complete Address, Serial Number, Illegal Transfer, FFL License and on and on! If your building them you best count on keeping them forever with out any of the previous mentioned items. And what happens after you are gone? Could it cause future problems for the family? No thanks on my part! Don't need any problems.

    03
     
  12. kfox75

    kfox75 Well-Known Member Supporter

    7,301
    247
    63
    I am in 100% agreement with '03 here. After the proper research is done those 80% "deals" are not deals at all. OP, it ain't worth you freedom. If you build it, you may wind up having to put in your will that the rifle is to be buried with you, or have a plan in place for it's destruction.
     
  13. danf_fl

    danf_fl Retired Supporter

    12,369
    57
    48
    With the 10-22 costing so little compared to other .22s, why not buy the original and avoid the hassle?
     
  14. JonM

    JonM Moderator

    20,110
    19
    38
    Its a 10-22 22 magnum not common. But volquartsen and a few others make legally transferable recievers.

    Still not legal for you to sell or give to anyone who you know cannot pass the requirements for a form 4417 or would be ineleigable to recieve a firearm.
     
  15. danf_fl

    danf_fl Retired Supporter

    12,369
    57
    48
    4417 or 4473?
     
  16. JonM

    JonM Moderator

    20,110
    19
    38
    4473. Typo on my part
     
  17. alcovyguns

    alcovyguns New Member

    8
    0
    0

    I have a type 7 license. I is not legal to sale, giveaway, or leave it to some in your will if you build it your self. To sell it it has to be manufactured by a licensed manufacture to be thansfurable to another party. If you build it on a 100% lower it might be ok but I would call the ATF first. They will give you a straight answer.
     
  18. firemonkey150

    firemonkey150 New Member

    37
    0
    0
    Am I missing something or could be simply get a serial number out on the receiver and register it? Or have his friend do the same before its assembled? Then it would essentially be the same as an AR build?
     
  19. danf_fl

    danf_fl Retired Supporter

    12,369
    57
    48
    Firemonkey150 - the key thing is that the OP is not licensed to manufacture. Completing the receiver is "manufacturing".

    To complete a firearm for yourself is okay, but to sell it is a no-no.

    The same with the AR. Completing the kit is "manufacturing". For yourself, again okay. To sell, no-no.
     
  20. c3shooter

    c3shooter Administrator Staff Member

    21,444
    552
    113
    Just to reinforce- and maybe clarify a bit for some new folks-

    The receiver legally IS the gun. In the case of an AR, the LOWER receiver. If you bought a finished receiver, added all the parts to make a working gun, you did not manufacture a firearm. Whoever completed the manufacture of the lower reciever was the manufacturer. If I buy one, it is treated the same as a firearm (you must be 21 to buy one, since it is not a rifle or shotgun yet- it is an "other")

    HOWEVER- a receiver that is 80% (or less) complete is NOT YET a firearm. It is a paper weight. Until it is milled, drilled, threaded, shaped, etc, it cannot be made to fire anything. I can buy one by mail, and it does not need to pass thru the hands of a FFL.

    Under current federal law, nothing prohibits you from making a gun for your own use. But if you buy an 80% receiver, complete it to 100%, you cannot put the gun into the stream of commerce (sell it) unless you had the aforementioned FFL as a Manufacturer of Firearms.

    If you live in a state that does not allow ownership of a given firearm, you cannot dodge that by building your own.

    DISCLAIMER- My FFL is NOT a Manufacurer's FFL. Anyone that IS a Manfacturer, please feel free to correct anything I said.
     
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.