Can any lower be a 'pistol'?

Discussion in 'AR-15 Discussion' started by sputnik1988, Jul 9, 2013.

  1. sputnik1988

    sputnik1988 Active Member

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    If I were to put an A2 receiver extension on a lower with an 11.5" upper and no stock, could it be considered a pistol?

    I'm just shopping around and was curious.
     
    Last edited: Jul 9, 2013
  2. DrumJunkie

    DrumJunkie New Member

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    If memory serves the lower has to have been registered as a pistol otherwise you enter into the SBR zone.
     

  3. sputnik1988

    sputnik1988 Active Member

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    That's what I was wondering, thanks.

    I would like to do an SBR eventually but have little interest in a dedicated pistol lower.

    I read somewhere that it's ok if you start with a stripped lower it would be legal, just wanted to verify.
     
    Last edited: Jul 9, 2013
  4. sputnik1988

    sputnik1988 Active Member

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    Ok, I read that stripped lowers are registered as 'other' on the 4473, so as long as its never had a stock, it is considered other than a rifle.
     
  5. Sgt_Skrb_25

    Sgt_Skrb_25 New Member

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    The best way to build a pistol is out f a 80% lower. It doesn't have to be serialized , stamped or registered. The Rifle Act of 1968 covers you there. You can manufacture 49 firearms a year, 3 of which can be pistols. They are not for re-sale, just or personal use. It takes 5 years to serialized before it is recognized and eligible for resale by ATF, DOJ ect...ect... I think if you have a standard lower it has to be stamped as a pistol. I have built a pistol out f an 80% and its legal. It's the best way to go.
     

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  6. sweeper22

    sweeper22 New Member

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    This is the case as I understand it.

    A rifle cannot be converted into a pistol.
    A pistol can be converted into a rifle (but not back again).
    Most places a stripped lower can be built however you like it, so long as it's semiauto and doesn't have both a 16" barrel and stock.

    If it has (or ever did have) a stock, additional paperwork is required for a sub 16" barrel/muzzle break combination. As always, differing local laws may apply.
     
  7. JonM

    JonM Moderator

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    Attaching an a2 buffer tube or carbine tube means its a rifle. There are special pistol buffer tubes for pistols using the ar15 lower. Those must be used. If you use a a2 or carbine tube even if you never buy a stock its still a rifle and a sbr.
     
  8. gunnut07

    gunnut07 New Member

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    If it starts out as a pistol and is marked as such you can make it a pistol or a rifle. It doesn't matter if you go back and forth.
     
  9. AgentTikki

    AgentTikki New Member

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    I agree with this in the state of Kommiefornia. Be careful of any advice garnered from the interwebs. Every state has different laws so check and double check the laws in your state.

    PS asking a cop about the laws isn't always the greatest idea. Either find the law that applies or seek legal council.
     
  10. JonM

    JonM Moderator

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    Batfe is quit clear on that if it starts as a pistol it can go to a rifle but can never be a pistol again without going through the sbr procedure. A rifle can never ever never become a pistol without that sbr stamp
     
  11. MisterMcCool

    MisterMcCool Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Here is an excerpt from BATFE's decision and a link to the website.

    "Therefore, so long as a parts kit or collection of parts is not used to make a firearm regulated under the NFA (e.g., a short-barreled rifle or "any other weapon" as defined by 26 U.S.C. 5845(e)), no NFA firearm is made when the same parts are assembled or re- assembled in a configuration not regulated under the NFA (e.g., a pistol, or a rifle with a barrel of 16 inches or more in length). Merely assembling and disassembling such a rifle does not result in the making of a new weapon; rather, it is the same rifle in a knockdown condition (i.e., complete as to all component parts). Likewise, because it is the same weapon when reconfigured as a pistol, no "weapon made from a rifle" subject to the NFA has been made.
    Nonetheless, if a handgun or other weapon with an overall length of less than 26 inches, or a barrel or barrels of less than 16 inches in length is assembled or otherwise produced from a weapon originally assembled or produced only as a rifle, such a weapon is a "weapon made from a rifle" as defined by 26 U.S.C. 5845(a)(4). Such a weapon would not be a "pistol" because the weapon was not originally designed, made, and intended to fire a projectile by one hand."

    http://www.atf.gov/files/regulations-rulings/rulings/atf-rulings/atf-ruling-2011-4.pdf
     
    Last edited: Jul 10, 2013
  12. clr8ter

    clr8ter New Member

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    I was under the impression that an 80% lower you finished yourself could NEVER be transferred, given, sold to ANYONE. Period.
     
  13. MisterMcCool

    MisterMcCool Well-Known Member Supporter

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    I thought that too.
     
  14. Sgt_Skrb_25

    Sgt_Skrb_25 New Member

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    If you voluntarily serialized your weapon and file the appropriate paperwork with the appropriate agencies, the serial number will be recognized and will be eligible for resale down the road providing that weapon is locally and federally compliant. I will see if I can find it in paper somewhere. I've been trying to research this 80% legal craze to protect my self because I have a few. From what I've read and speaking to 80% manufacturers,distributors, and LGS that sell them, that's what has came up multiple times. Unfortunately the DOJ and ATF loves to put out fragmented and vague literature, and it's up to us to read between the lines.
     
  15. clr8ter

    clr8ter New Member

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    Everything I have read says NO transfer at all. What would be the point in saying no transfer ever on a home made gun..... well unless you put a serial # on it? In that case, you could put a number on it 10 years after you built it, and then sell it. The point is to keep people from manufacturing with out a license....