Bowling For Columbine

Discussion in 'Legal and Activism' started by TheSadPanda, Feb 17, 2011.

  1. TheSadPanda

    TheSadPanda New Member

    1,508
    0
    0
    I had searched to see if this movie had been discussed on here before, but I couldn't find anything on it. Also, I wasn't sure what topic to put it under, so I decided this was the best place. I'm sorry if I messed up on either one of those.

    Basically here's what I wanted to discuss: What are your opinions on the documentary "Bowling For Columbine" (2002). Plain and simple. Your likes, your dislikes, your comments, or anything else pertaining to the movie. Michael Moore is fair game, BUT keep the comments of him and opinions of him based on the movie, please! I understand that many of you strongly dislike him (as an understatement), but I would really like to have an actual discussion instead of it being a verbal beating. And the last thing I want is for this to turn into a pi$$ing contest. So I BEG you: help keep this as an actual discussion :)

    I'll start off:
    I think overall the documentary is a really great film. I feel like it really made you think about not only your views, but the views of people around you. It also made me want to learn way more than what the documentary offered. I read up on the actual columbine incident, I learned more about influences that people learn from, and I learned to really question somebody before you believe everything they say. I did not like how Moore showed up at Heston's house and basically accused him supporting murder. I felt that was incredibly wrong on not only a professional level, but very much so on a moral level. I'll gladly go more in depth with parts of the film (comments permitting)
     
  2. M14sRock

    M14sRock New Member

    5,549
    0
    0
    Propaganda, pure and simple. He edited the footage of the speeches, tricked and ambushed Charlton Heston (one of the most honorable men who ever lived), and lied about everything else.
     

  3. Sniper03

    Sniper03 Supporting Member Supporter

    7,666
    62
    48
    First of all in my opinion Michael More is a piece of S___! And as about as detrimental to the true American Society as they come!
    Columbine was a very unfortunate incident. We learned a lot from it at one He-- of an expense. As a 16+ year SWAT Officer retired. It is amazing how the warning signs for these incidents shine like a silver dollar. But in my opinion because of our liberal civil rights attorneys in our society. Our school officials pretty much have their hands tied. Lest they violate little Johny and his family's rights. God forbid! In my opinion people like the ACLU may be a benefit in very limited cases however are for the biggest part contributing to the ruination of our country. And we say little Johny's family had no clue in like the Columbine incident? I think not! Lets refer to it as a lack of responsibility on the parents part. Even some of these families lock their doors to the bedroom at night for fear of little Johny. No one can not convince me that they never saw any warning signs. We need to get America back to the what it was intended and get the attorneys out of running America. I am not saying all attorneys are bad at all since I have three in my family. But lets look at who is in the administration of our country at present.

    03
     
  4. TheSadPanda

    TheSadPanda New Member

    1,508
    0
    0
    M14sRock- Can you please provide some of the examples you're talking about? (I'm not saying you're wrong or right, but there was no evidence from the movie to support the claims). And I 100% agree with you on the Charleton Heston part. That was just uncalled for and wrong.

    Sniper03- I agree that there were definite warning signs to that tragedy and many others that have happened in our schools and such. I have to be honest, I'm not sure where the attorneys come into this all that much though :?
     
  5. c3shooter

    c3shooter Administrator Staff Member

    21,332
    184
    63
    Herr Goebels would have been proud of it as a bit of propaganda. The movie is a mass distortion of facts- selective editing, sentence fragments taken out of context.

    The two perps had brought along an improvised explosive device, made of a propane tank, which, thank God, failed to function. Their intent was to create a BLEVE- which would have destroyed a fair portion of the building. I do not see Moore confronting the local propane dealer as a mass murderer.

    It is not possible for me to separate the movie from my opinion of Moore- it is his handicraft, and represents his world view.
     
  6. M14sRock

    M14sRock New Member

    5,549
    0
    0
    Look at the speech (I forget now who it was) and watch the necktie. It changes during the speech. That is because it was edited.

    The whole film is dishonest propaganda, done by a scumbag who will stoop to any level to further his agenda.
     
  7. TheSadPanda

    TheSadPanda New Member

    1,508
    0
    0
    c3- I have to admit I havn't seen the entire footage of any of the speeches that were showed in the film, but can you give some examples of how things were taken out of context? Also, Yes it most certainly does represent his own world view, but he does certainly go far enough to say that it is the person behind the gun, and not just the the gun itself that makes it a deadly weapon. I had a nice laugh about the propane part :) I had never thought of that, and now that you have me thinking about it, I'm a little surprised he didn't. Good call. I also keep picturing Hank Hill and Michael Moore having a conversation. Now that'd be HILARIOUS!
     
  8. TheSadPanda

    TheSadPanda New Member

    1,508
    0
    0
    Do you know which speech? I never noticed that. If I don't know which speech, I don't know exactly what we're talking about.

    As a side note to everybody, I'm not trying to act like a know it all about the movie, Michael Moore, and certainly not about guns. I'm trying to get more than just my own point of view, but like I said earlier, I'm not just going to believe everything you say, I'm looking for facts and evidence. Because this is an opinionated question, nobody is correct or incorrect.
     
  9. M14sRock

    M14sRock New Member

    5,549
    0
    0
    He did not care about the propane because he is all about taking guns away from citizens.

    Join the NRA and watch their file videos. They then show the way those speeches were edited for B4C. Disgusting.
     
  10. TheSadPanda

    TheSadPanda New Member

    1,508
    0
    0
    M14- I'm sorry, but I'm not joining the NRA. I would still like to see the videos for myself though. Do you know where those resources can be found? While Moore's agenda seems a little less drastic than that to me, I still don't doubt that he isn't for fully auto weapons and those types of things. I still feel like if you take the movie with a grain or two of salt, in some parts, you can learn some new things, or at least find something you would like to learn more about. You know what I'm saying?
     
  11. freefall

    freefall New Member

    2,325
    3
    0
    I have never seen the movie. I don't care to, I don't need to. I don't care to provide a dime to Michael Moore. Joke him and the horse he rode up on.
     
  12. TheSadPanda

    TheSadPanda New Member

    1,508
    0
    0
    I have a feeling there's a large portion of this forum that feels the exact same way, and everybody here is more than entitled to that opinion. I wouldn't hold it against you for even a second.
     
  13. opaww

    opaww New Member

    4,868
    0
    0
    I will not watch anything that has anything to do with michael moore
     
  14. NGIB

    NGIB New Member

    7,143
    1
    0
    Huge agreement from me. That "person" needs to go live somewhere else - maybe France???

    B4C is very old news - why do you bring this up now?
     
  15. spittinfire

    spittinfire New Member Supporter

    9,663
    2
    0
    I think it is nothing but a giant piece of crap with a goal of aiding the anti gunners so they can completely disarm America. I question why you even bother to bring it up now, years after the fact and on a gun forum. Between this thread and your statement of not wanting to join the NRA I really question why you are here. Is that glock you have pictured even yours?

    I watched it a year or so after it was made for a couple of reasons but made sure that fat, America hating Moore didn't get a dime from me. The stupidity and ignorance he showed in that "movie" is paralleled in everything he says. This country would be better off without him and his propeganda.
     
  16. tomharkness

    tomharkness New Member

    37
    0
    0
    Well, I did not see the movie and have only heard bits and pieces of M. Moore talk. Just listening to him talk is like listening to fingernails on the chalkboard.... but lets talk about Columbine: that I know about.

    First: a 15 year old boy, a 16 year old boy, and a 19 year old boy begin buying pistols and carbines (Hi-Points were some). Then they start buying 100's of rounds of ammunition for these handguns and carbines. Then they start purchasing materials to build low order and high order detonation bombs. The put together more than 90 separate Low order detonation bombs and several more high order detonation bombs (>2000fps). All of this is done over a period of 18 months. By the time they have completed the project, they have just over 100 bombs, 2 carbines, and ? handguns. They are also now ages 17, 18, and 20 years of age.

    They methodically place one high order detonation bomb in a vehicle in the North part of town and another in the South part of town... in order to distract and delay first responders. Then they place a high order detonation bomb in a vehicle where first responders and LEO's will probably park when they do respond. Then they place several more bombs inside the school so that they will collapse the building onto children during lunch. Then they sit quietly on a nearby "Grassy Knoll" so as to shoot students that survive the blast as they exit.

    The final outcome was that the bombs failed to detonate and the boys decided to simply move into the school and shoot as many as they could

    The bottom line here is: Where the hell were the parents over this 18 months of planning and preparations? Where the hell was our overly oppressive government while these children were purchasing firearms that only adults can purchase? Where the hell was that part of the story when Mr. Moore was trying to blame everyone but the boys and their sad excuses for adult leadership?

    No... it was the NRA's fault; the guns fault.... everyone's else's fault.

    Bottom/Bottom line is this: if you have children and they can build 100 bombs, buy illegal handguns and ammunition, and store it all in your garage for more than 20 minutes without you knowing something is wrong.... then you SUCK AS A PARENT!!!!
     
    Last edited: Feb 17, 2011
  17. spittinfire

    spittinfire New Member Supporter

    9,663
    2
    0
    I like this statement.
     
  18. tomharkness

    tomharkness New Member

    37
    0
    0
    What I am waiting for is Mr. Moore doing a documentary about parents that do not supervise their children. It would be interesting to hear how Mr. Moore would address questions like:

    1. How did minor children get hold of these types of weapons without an adult?
    2. Could there have been an adult involved? Should there have?
    3. How were the parents distracted so as to not see bombs, guns, and ammo in the garage for more than a year? and no.... Rush Limbaugh is only on for 3 hours a day, so that does not count.
    4. If these children had issues with a few bullies in the school, then why did they plan on killing hundreds of students and teachers?
    5. If poverty causes children to be angry and want to lash out in anger, then why did these children live in a "Filthy-Rich" part of Colorado?
    6. These children were over the age of 16 and therefore did not have to attend school. If school sucked that bad, then why not transfer, drop out, or ask to be home schooled?
    7. How did the NRA and Charlton Heston influence these boys into such hatred?
    8. What could the parents have done to prevent this? oops! this might be too much for Mr. Moore.... sorry.

    I am sure that Mr. Moore would have some very colorful answers. LOL!!
     
  19. robocop10mm

    robocop10mm Lifetime Supporting Member Lifetime Supporter

    11,380
    1
    0
    To believe ANY thing that comes out of Michael Moore's mouth is, at the very least, naive. I will not spend one red cent toward MM and his lies, distortion and propaganda. Yes Goebbels would be proud of MM's work. I have heard that Moore made over $20 million from the 9-11 movie and has not given one penny to the victims or their families. Now he is bickering over more money (I believe about $2 million) he feels he is owed from that project.

    He is an anti-gun, anti-American slime ball of the highest order. He is certainly on my list of people who would not receive one drop of urinary relief should his body be aflame.

    If you are, as you claim, a gun owner and are willing to give him the time of day, you likely need medication.
     
  20. NGIB

    NGIB New Member

    7,143
    1
    0
    I'd say this thread is pretty much wrapped up. Excellent job there Robo!