blackpowder nfa

Discussion in 'NFA/Class 3 & FFL Discussion' started by JonM, Oct 16, 2012.

  1. JonM

    JonM Moderator

    20,110
    19
    38
    since blackpowder guns arent considered firearms i wonder if its legal to suppress them??
     
  2. willfully armed

    willfully armed New Member

    2,096
    1
    0
    Of course it is. Legality does not fall on the firearm, its on the suppressor.
     

  3. nitestalker

    nitestalker New Member

    6,489
    0
    0
    I would think one shot and the suppressor would be totaly fouled. Black Powder would load the baffles very fast.:(
     
  4. c3shooter

    c3shooter Administrator Staff Member

    21,448
    564
    113
    Besides the problems with fouling, the problem is that under the NFA, a SUPPRESSOR is a firearm. THAT is what gets registered- not the gun it is attached to.
     
  5. Mosin

    Mosin Well-Known Member

    7,450
    356
    83
    Last edited: Oct 19, 2012
  6. c3shooter

    c3shooter Administrator Staff Member

    21,448
    564
    113
    It is not that it is black powder- it is that it uses loose ball and powder (muzzleloader) OR was made prior to 1899 that makes it an antique. However, to give you a straight answer, I would have to go look at the 1934 NFA. They DO fall outside the 1968 GCA, but will not swear they are totally outside the NFA.
     
    Last edited: Oct 19, 2012
  7. nitestalker

    nitestalker New Member

    6,489
    0
    0
    The fellow is using a blank round to a fire a bullet. Besides bordering on stupid what is your point ? Blank powder runs very high pressures. I hope no one trys this stunt.

    As for SBRs there is no Federal law on attaching shoulder stocks to BP handguns. You may buy and own Colt replicas with detachable shoulder stocks. There are some states that control BP arms so check your state laws before using SBR muzzle loaders. Breech loading firearms loaded with black powder does not avoid the law. The rule on SBR firearms is applied to breech loading cartridge firearms not the type of powder.:)
     
  8. c3shooter

    c3shooter Administrator Staff Member

    21,448
    564
    113
    Ummm- don't think that was a blank. Looked like he was using a primed case to ignite the 3 pellets of Pyrodex.

    And no, THAT in the video is not exempted. Although it uses loose powder and ball, it is READILY convertible to modern ammo (replace the upper)
     
  9. orangello

    orangello New Member

    19,156
    0
    0
  10. JonM

    JonM Moderator

    20,110
    19
    38
  11. orangello

    orangello New Member

    19,156
    0
    0
    Isn't there a brass gatlin gun that uses a BP cartridge and doesn't require NFA crap? I can't find it on the web, though.

    Oh, and JonM, they have different calibers available on the Howdah.



    edit* http://batteryguncompany.com/History.php
     
    Last edited: Oct 20, 2012
  12. nitestalker

    nitestalker New Member

    6,489
    0
    0
    A crank operated Gatling is not a machine gun. The Gatling is a repeater like a lever action or a pump. Later on these were steam powered and electric powered weapons and were machine guns. :)
     
  13. JonM

    JonM Moderator

    20,110
    19
    38
    im talking recoil operated of some sort cap and ball 209 primers no cartridges.

    i think its possible but im wondering about legality.

    i mean a 30 round muzzle loading black powder 50cal machine gun. take a while to load one though
     
  14. Patriot98

    Patriot98 New Member

    35
    0
    0
    So a gatlin gun is not machine gun but if I got a power drill and hooked it up to it that would be machine gun?
     
  15. nitestalker

    nitestalker New Member

    6,489
    0
    0
    Yes a motorized fire arm becomes a machine gun. :)
     
  16. JonM

    JonM Moderator

    20,110
    19
    38
    im wondering if it was all muzzle loaded would it still be one??
     
  17. nitestalker

    nitestalker New Member

    6,489
    0
    0
    Under the 1934 NFA rule a machine gun is any fire arm that continues to fire after the first round or pull of the trigger. It has no mention of the type of propellent or loading procedure. It is very clear on building or having parts to assembly such a weapon. It would seem to me even a muzzle loader if it fired from one pull of the trigger and continued to fire multiple rounds you would be in violation of the 1934 NFA Act.:(
     
  18. JonM

    JonM Moderator

    20,110
    19
    38
    except that the official batfe stance on muzzle loading guns that use loose blackpowder without a case is they are not firearms.

    thats why you can get a muzzle loader shipped to your do no paper work to fill out
     
  19. nitestalker

    nitestalker New Member

    6,489
    0
    0
    That is true. But the 1934 NFA Act would then recognize any weapon regardless after it falls under the machine act. A 10-22 can fall under this act if it has a worn sear. As you know a Grease gun is nothing more than a pipe a spring and a bolt. The pipe is not even rifled. Anyone can make one of these in a school shop. The ownership of the pipe with the bolt and spring makes this pipe an NFA firearm.:(
     
  20. nitestalker

    nitestalker New Member

    6,489
    0
    0
    Converting modern recievers into muzzle loaders causes the firearm to come under the NFA rules. The AR-15 in the video maybe in violation of NFA rules. Read the list in paragraph C .

    http://www.atf.gov/firearms/faq/collectors.html