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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Unfortunately, I have to revise my previous opinion:mad: of the Beretta Bobcat, and downgrade it. From our experience, we can no longer recommend it as a reliable, concealed carry option. From my research online, we are not the only ones to have experienced a jamming problem with this model pistol.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n1hJ4S8LnHE?rel=0
This brand new, .22 caliber, Beretta Bobcat 21 has been sent back to the factory twice to fix a jamming problem. We've used the recommended ammunition: Winchester Wildcats and CCI Stingers, and various other versions and brands, all with the same result: this pistol constantly jams. We have followed the recommended oiling and cleaning, but nothing works. The pistol fails often to fire; it fails to eject. This video is our test after getting the gun back after the second factory "service." We are very disappointed.

I'm interested to know if the higher caliber versions (.25 and .32 Tomcat) are more reliable due to increased powder.

My previous hopeful "review" is here.
 

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I would expect either the .25 or .32 to be infinitely more reliable than the .22LR

Both the .25 ACP and the .32 ACP are actually auto pistol calibers. The .22LR is not.

The .22LR, like every other round that was designed for a revolver has an extraction lip at the base of the round that is larger in diameter than the cartridge itself. This is necessary in a revolver so the fresh cartridges will not fall clean through the cylinder, however, when chambered in ANY auto pistol, these extraction lips prove to be non conducive to reliable function because the lips want to hang up on anything they encounter as they slide along one another during the feeding, firing, and ejecting processes.

Many gun makers have sought solutions to this problem as it prohibits most magnum chamberings in semi auto pistols.

Guns such as the AMT Auto Mag, Desert Eagle, Coonan .357, and scores of others have and do produce auto pistols in revolver chamberings and some do work quite well such as Ruger's excellent line of .22 target pistols.

While all of these are fun to shoot, Personally, I would never trust my life to one by using it in a defensive gun role. The inherent mechanical failure potential is simply too high and the potential only increases as the gun gets smaller.

I'm sorry about your disappointment and recommend either steping your auto pistol up to a service grade caliber or if .22LR is a must, going with one of the excellent little revolvers on the market such as the Ruger LCR .22

Good Luck

Tack
 
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When I retired in the 80's I purchased the Beretta model 21A. It had just come out and I grew tired of packing larger guns in the summer and wanted something to throw in my pocket. It was good looking with a very nice grip and being da was real nice. Though I knew guns, this was a big mistake. For the first couple of years I didn't shoot it, but originally I purchased Federal high velocity ammo that worked fine. Eventually when I shot other .22's it ftf numerous times and after that I never trusted it. There's no extractor and those tip up barrels are useless when the shell casing gets stuck. I did carry it once in a while using the Federal, but eventually I traded it to a friend of mine who owned a gunshop and bought the NAA .32. Those .22's all stink as your only weapon where concealed carry is concerned. Any .25, or .32 and 380 would be a great improvement. My NAA's has never jammed, or failed to fire in over 10 years. These all work better than a .22. Colt 1908 .25 and NAA .32.

 

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Discussion Starter · #4 · (Edited)
Thanks guys. I appreciate the insights and explanation. Our friend, the lady in the video, has carpal tunnel, and has trouble with any slide. We were trying to find the right solution for her with a semi-auto. She has a Ruger LCR 38 but, like me, her accuracy with a revolver is not what we think is reliable enough for concealed carry. (I know for me, I am always thrown off by the trigger pull weight and torque it to the right). We thought this 22 would be the perfect solution, small and handy.

After our experience with this Beretta, we weren't so sure about the design itself. From what I read, that while the .25 and the .32 Tomcat are more reliable, they too have a tendency to jam... Just type in [ame="http://www.google.com/search?client=safari&rls=en&q=Tomcat+32+jam&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8"]Tomcat 32 Jam[/ame] into Google and see similar experiences to ours.

Thought about the Ruger® 22/45™ with high velocity ammo, since it has that snap back slide which she can do, although it is a little big for concealed carry. My friends at the gun store think HV 22 at close range is actually sometimes better than a .32 because it goes in and rattles around, whereas they have seen a .32 stopped by a leather jacket. The 22 has more penetrating power, they said.
 

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Also have a Bobcat...and was experiencing issues similar to this. Fixed it entirely by cleaning it regularly. I started out using Stingers which I think helped break it in but after giving it a good cleaning and then spraying all the parts down with Rem Oil it'll shoot Federal rounds as fast as I can pull the trigger. How many rounds have you put through yours? The little gun definitely needs to be broken in.
 

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.22lr in a small semi-auto is also weather sensitive.
And enough lubrication (and thorough cleaning) is important.

My PPK/s works with any .22 during the summer, but starts to get picky when the weather cools.
 

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I have had an older Beretta 21A for many years. It seems to be relaible with CCI Stingers, and Velocitor ammo. It has beccome more reliable with other high velocity ammo over time, but I found I had to use the hottest ammo for the first couple hundred rounds early in it's life.

I still use mostly hyper-velocity ammo just as peace of mind from my earliest experience with it. I have seen examples that were not as reliable as mine. so, it seems there are some that are more particular.
 

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I also have an older Bobcat, I only run CCI Stingers thru it. It was well broken in when I got it so all I had to do was clean it thoroughly as it was nasty when I got it and figure out which ammo it likes. Then after every 50 rounds it will seem to want to act up somewhat, give it a bath and all is well again.
 

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I also have an older Bobcat, I only run CCI Stingers thru it. It was well broken in when I got it so all I had to do was clean it thoroughly as it was nasty when I got it and figure out which ammo it likes. Then after every 50 rounds it will seem to want to act up somewhat, give it a bath and all is well again.
I also have a little Beretta 21A that is pretty old and bought second hand from Kieth's Sporting Goods, a shop here in Oregon. This wonderful little gun with the tip up barrel fit my hand perfect, and I have never been a fan of racking a pistol (I don't like the idea that to do so you have to not pay attention to where it is pointed, but get it in a position that you can manipulate it). It shot like **** at first, it did everything a screwed up pistol can do -stovepipe, fail to feed, the slide actually fell off while trying to shoot. Of course I tried all the different ammo I could find - which was a lot. No luck, so I took it back and had a conversation with Kieth. He took it back after basically calling me a liar, and they shot it a few time by loading one at a time, gave it back to me and said I was limp wristing it, and it was "real dry in there". well, I can shoot my .44 pretty accurately, so I don't think my wrist is weak, so I took this poor little guy home and analyzed it - I have a high opinion of Beretta, and didn't want to give up.
I discovered that as the firing pin was hitting the casing, it was actually swedging the casing into the chamber. I took a little cylindrical stone and smoothed out the area that was being compressed, and voila - it shot repeatedly without problems. The next time I had problems with it, was the firing pin. I took it out, and again - voila - they had put a bunch of oil in it. So I cleaned this out and my lovely little gun is firing nicely again.
One thing I am doing, though, is using CCI mini-mag ammo, because I have noticed that the Federal I use for my .22 rifle is inconsistent - the casings are slightly thicker, or slightly larger compared to each other, where the CCI mini-mags are quite consistent in size and shape, so my little buddy doesn't end up swedging a slightly larger casing and affecting that chamber. I just wanted to share this info. Sorry if I was long-winded. Oh, I never went back to Kieth's.
 

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Over my collecting career I had several Jetfires and they were very reliable. I have no experience with the Bobcat. It is not encouraging that it went for factory repairs twice and they could not resolve the problem.
 

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"shawbuch", I gave you a like for the information you provided and posted and
to Firearms Talk Forum. When folks like yourself provide some helpful information, who gives a 'ratsass' on how old the post is. It was a post that was done here, on FTF. Thank YOU!
I hope to see more posts from you and please, don't be shy about asking questions, there are some folks here that are actually willing to try and help you! :)
 

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Rules of thumb : 1.When your computer locks up, reboot it .
2. When your semi-auto jams, try a new magazine .
By golly, we found something to agree on. The woods around my range is full of rusting magazines. Them being there fixed a lot of guns.
 

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GENERAL NOTE ON .22 RIMFIRE GUNS

With a few exceptions, many are prone to the problem shawbuch mentioned. Design of the gun, coupled with dryfire, makes the firing pin ding the mouth of the chamber. The "dent" can push metal into the mouth of the chamber, making the case drag on the chamber, and can leave the rim poorly supported to be pinched by the firing pin on next shot.

HOWEVER- do NOT remove that little burr. There is a tool to iron it back into place (Chamber iron). Me, I'm strictly an amoocher gunsmith (no, that is NOT a misspelling) I use a Stanley nail set and a flat tipped pin punch to do the same thing. If instead you removed the metal by filing or grinding, you still have metal missing.

The uncertain reliability of rimfire ammo in an auto was what prompted John Browning to create the .25 ACP cartridge. It was made to duplicate the 22 LR from a 2 inch bbl, but to have greater reliability in feeding and firing. You might sneer at the .25 Auto, but I have a Baby Browning that will sit there and munch thru box after box of ammo without a burp.
 
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