Bcm bcg vs psa bcg

Discussion in 'AR-15 Discussion' started by herp_man2003, May 15, 2014.

  1. herp_man2003

    herp_man2003 New Member

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    Im wondering if it is really worth it to upgrade from the psa full auto bcg to the bcm? I know that bcm is pretty much top of the line but is it worth the extra 90 bucks or so? Seems the specs on both are pretty much the same. So what says you. Thanks Anthony
     
  2. ccase39

    ccase39 New Member

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    I would say it depends on the type of rifle you have and what you use it for. Is it something to take into the woods and bang around? Is it for precision?
    In my experience BCM is a superior product, but weather or not its worth the extra money depends on how much use your rifle gets. If you only put 1000 or so rds a year through it the PSA will be just fine.
     

  3. okdonk

    okdonk New Member

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    I'd rather go for Spike's rather than the PSA.

    [ame]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c2Hk7zeVVXU[/ame]
     
  4. JonM

    JonM Moderator

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    If you already have a working bcg no

    If you dont yes
     
  5. Argyle_Armoring

    Argyle_Armoring New Member

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    If you have a PSA rifle, use the PSA BCG. If you have a Frankenrifle and you need a BCG then go with the PSA BCG. I haven't been met with a situation yet where I would need a more expensive BCG than what's already in a rifle.
     
  6. herp_man2003

    herp_man2003 New Member

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    I have a psa complete upper. I had also considered trading out the bolt for the psa premium bolt. I think it would only cost me a few buck when i sell the old one. The rifle is unfired yet. Im still modding it. A list of build parts are

    Psa mid length chf upper with bcg and charging handle
    Psa classic blem lower
    Rock river nm 2 stage trigger
    Magpul funiture in fde ctr stock
    Kries anti roll trigger pins
    Spikes tactical h2 buffer
    Bcm mod 4 charging handle
    Magpul mbus in fde
    Aimpoint pro red dot

    And im thinking of duracoating the rifle in magpul fde. What you guys think? Thanks Anthony
     
  7. JonM

    JonM Moderator

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    You shouldnt use anti roll pins on lower that doesnt use a 1 piece trigger pack.

    The ar15 pins are supposed to roll. This prevents binding which can cause failure to ignite or slow ignition by retarding the hammer strike.

    A properly built lower will not have pin drift through tens of thousands of firings

    The original pins have cutouts that fit the springs which prevent walking but allow dirty dry or gummed up pins to rotate freely
     
    Last edited: May 15, 2014
  8. chloeshooter

    chloeshooter New Member

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    I see these 'upgrade' posts a lot, especially when it comes to bolt carrier groups

    As of yet, I have not seen reports of these failing to begin with. However, aftermarket manufacturers, tactical dealers and hard core enthusiasts on the inter-web have done a good job of convincing some that their AR's aren't worth a damn unless they re-build the thing with parts that would make a complete build cost $4000.
     
  9. JonM

    JonM Moderator

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    Depends on how its being used.

    Typical user is going to go out 6-9 times a year and run 50-150 rounds each session. For such people anything will do even the most shoddy dpms/bushmaster out there. They serve just fine for such things as well as home defense.

    For the person that goes out and pops off 5000-6000 rounds on a prairie dog shoot a properly made shot peened mpi inspected bcg with a carpenter steel bolt is probably a necessity and they probably still take a spare.

    Same is true for someone that goes to carbine classes frequently.

    Then there are folks that have experienced hell on hunting trips from cheaping out and something critical breaks. I fall into that category. Im done spending several thousand on a vacation hunt with the wife only to be sidelined in the middle of nowhere forced to use a backup gun because i cut corners on gear.

    You dont have to get the best you can but if your depending on it to function its a good idea to minimize the risk of failure and a ruined outing.

    Just my experience with lowend firearms optics and gear
     
  10. chloeshooter

    chloeshooter New Member

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    -anyone who can afford to drop $1000 or so on ammo can probably afford to buy top-end to begin with. If someone with that kind of $$ goes out and buys a Bushmaster Carbon rifle then their issue isn't $$......... it's lack of knowledge

    -never had a bolt action rifle malfunction on any kind of hunt. But I'm no gopher hunter so more power to yaz

    - STILL waiting for one of you high-experience guys to talk about BCG failures (of any kind) that you have experienced.
     
  11. nchunt101

    nchunt101 New Member

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    I have yet to see one fail but have seen a broken firing pin. That said if I can buy a better, more reliable product for fifty bucks more I generally will. I look at my equipment like scopes. I may not buy top of the line I try to get to get quaillity over quanity.
     
  12. JonM

    JonM Moderator

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    My wife had a dpms pnther m4. After a couple hundred rounds it started short stroking. Took it home dug into it and the result was loose gas key from improperly staked and improperly torqued screws one of which sheared off under recoil.

    That was the last cheap bcg i purchased. After rebuilding it with quality gas key and screws and torquing staking it functioned fine. Ended up selling the rifle for 2500$ during the gun craze... She runs a bcm middy now.
     
  13. Quentin

    Quentin New Member

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    My first two ARs have Daniel Defense and BCM uppers with respective DD and BCM BCGs. I also had a spare BCM BCG which I used in my third AR using a PSA upper. The PSA upper with FN barrel and BCM BCG is about as good as it gets. I did get a premium PSA BCG but it's been put back as the spare.

    There is a difference, BCM is better but a premium PSA BCG is good. My main problem with PSA is you never know what's going to be available. You may have to settle for less, maybe even their low end line. With BCM, they're not going to ship out bad product that has their name on it.

    Okdonk is right about Spikes, they have good stuff at low prices so give them a looksee too!
     
  14. JonM

    JonM Moderator

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    i agree. im not saying psa is bad by any stretch.
     
  15. CamoToe1

    CamoToe1 New Member

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    My PSA "Premium" BCG no logo just came in. I had the same question as the OP, but for $89.99 took a chance on it. I cleaned the PSA and compared it to my BCM.

    ImageUploadedByFirearms Talk1400194526.583558.jpg
    Side by side comparison
    ImageUploadedByFirearms Talk1400194564.211804.jpg
    BCM has an even smooth finish
    ImageUploadedByFirearms Talk1400194600.736586.jpg
    PSA has an etched and uneven finish
    ImageUploadedByFirearms Talk1400194637.879435.jpg
    Bcm again has a smooth finish on opposite side
    ImageUploadedByFirearms Talk1400194744.531704.jpg
    PSA has very pronounced tool marks on opposite side

    The tool marks are not on bearing surfaces, so it's more of a cosmetic issue. I'm guessing that when the carriers come in, they are inspected for logo or no logo. The carriers that have rough tool marks/finishes go into a no logo pile and the others go off for laser etching.

    My conclusion: They both have hp/mpt carpenter 158 bolts, both have chrome lined and properly staked gas keys, and both will likely function just fine.

    If it is for a duty gun or has a good chance of being in harms way, I personally would have more confidence in a BCM BCG.(none of my guns fit in that category, btw) Anywhere else, either one would be fine. $180.00 for arguably the most important component of an AR15 doesn't seem like a lavish expenditure to me.
     
  16. Quentin

    Quentin New Member

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    I take pictures of my BCGs when they're still new/near new so thought I'd pull together pictures from the years into one place to compare them (things like staking, gas keys/screws, bolts and other features).

    In all four picture groups my Daniel Defense (no logo) is on top, then my first BCM, then my second BCM, then my PSA Premium (with logo), then my PSA MPI M16 BCG (no logo), then a PSA M16 BCG (not MPI, no logo), then a PSA 8620 BCG which is marked MPI. The last two PSA BCGs are not mine. As you can see the first seven carriers in each group are FA/M16. The very last photo in each group is an ArmaLite BCG, which in contrast has an SA/AR-15 style carrier.

    Again, here is the order top to bottom in each picture group and now I'll shut up and let the pictures tell the story:

    1 Daniel Defense (old unmarked version) (HPT/MPI but not marked, no logo)
    2 BCM #1 (marked HP/MP, with logo)
    3 BCM #2 (marked HP/MP, with logo)
    4 PSA Premium (marked HPT/MPI, with logo)
    5 PSA MPI M16 BCG (marked M, no logo)
    6 PSA M16 BCG (not marked, no logo)
    7 PSA 8620 BCG (marked MPI, no logo)
    8 ArmaLite BCG (not HPT/MPI, no logo)



    Picture Group A - Top view, complete

    [​IMG]
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    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]



    Picture Group B - Top view, gas key

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]



    Picture Group C - Side view, complete

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]



    Picture Group D - Bolt markings

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: May 16, 2014
  17. smarquez

    smarquez New Member

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    OK, so what I'm getting out of this is the BCM looks better? Maybe the bolt goes to grind and polish to become a BCM and the other goes to PSA?
    Remember most of this stuff is made by only a few companies and then the vendors add a logo (or don't). I go for PSA fort the deals. One day I'll torture test my own and see how it really holds up.
     
    Last edited: May 17, 2014
  18. JonM

    JonM Moderator

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    well sorta. most folks that sell bcg and bolts will pick a vendor that mass produces and says here are my minimum specs. i want each unit to be shot peened each unit be mpi inspected and i want them made to milspec with a smooth finish no machine marks and i want this coating so thick.

    company b may say i only want x number out of 10 100 1000 etc inspected and i want so many shot peened and some not and i dont care about removing tool marks. lets also cut cost by using a cheaper thinner coating.

    or any combo of those.

    what doesnt happen is a vendor gets an order for so many bcg and starts sorting through a bucket of premade bcg looking for ones that match the order.

    a parts vendor doesnt make product unless they have an order there isnt a backlog of parts lying around.

    so as an end buyer you pick a bcg with the features important to you go out and enjoy.
     
  19. fsted2a

    fsted2a Active Member

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    I got a BCM BCG right after Sandy Hook, so I paid a premium for it. Nice and smooth all the way around. My current vendor is SAA, and they have really good BCG's and I have no complaints. They have recently started NiB coating their BCG's, and so far I think they are really good. I have heard nothing but good things about PSA. I think you will have a good product with either one. My point is, at this time, as good as they are, I can't see personally spending the extra dough on BCM unless a customer specifies it on a build and wants to put the extra dough in.
     
  20. fsted2a

    fsted2a Active Member

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    DPMS has a spotty track record with regard to QC. Some years they will put out some good guns, then they will throw some crap together on their bottom-of-the-line AR's when demand is high to undercut the competition, and this stuff happens.