Any audiophiles out there?

Discussion in 'The Club House' started by 12fretter, Dec 1, 2012.

  1. 12fretter

    12fretter New Member

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    My old faithful Kenwood 5.1 surround receiver bit the dust tonight while watching a movie with the family. I'm looking to replace it with a used 7.1 but am on a limited budget. Maybe $2-300...maybe a tad more if necessary. I've been out of touch with technologies for a while.

    Here is my setup. My front speakers are my beloved KEF floor towers, a Velodyne subwoofer and JBL rears. I'm not interested in adding the 6 and 7 speakers right now, but will in the near future.

    I ran across an NAD on ebay that has my interest and since I have owned an NAD power amp for many years, I know they are quality products. I also ran across this Yamaha (that once listed for $1800) on Craigslist.

    Anyone have an opinion? Right now, I'm leaning toward the NAD for two reasons. One, the name. Two, it's tested from a dealer. But what features should I look for? HDMI is nice to have, but is it really necessary? The quality is no better than s-video or component. It only adds digital audio in the same cable making it convenient.

    Let me know, hopefully soon. I can't deal with watching movies through my TV speakers!
     
  2. Yunus

    Yunus New Member

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    I would not call myself an audiophile because I'm just to cheap. :D

    That said, I just bought a soundbar for my TV and it's a 2.1 and the sub is wireless, it cost $180 and it's nice. It's not surround sound or amazing in any way but it's 100 times better than the built in TV speakers.

    My other comment is about HDMI, I think you should get it. I'm assuming that you have more than one source that you get sound from. This means that you need to run all different types of cables into your receiver or run them through a single device and if that device is a TV it's likely that the output no your TV will downgrade any signal to 2 channel, it's uncommon for TV's to pass through the same signal it receives. For that reason I recommend using HDMI and have the receiver as the hub for all your sound needs. Also it's important to check if the receiver you choose has the ability to adjust the timing of the signal to align it with your TV picture, sometimes with digital conversions the timing is slightly off. Even my inexpensive soundbar has that feature which I don't need for my DirecTv box but I do need for my HTPC.

    One last thing, I have been very happy with items I have gotten from Monoprice. They are cheap and not brand name but if your looking to save money they are usually better than anything else in the price range but I'm not trying to convince you they sound better than an expensive setup just better than anything else in the price range.
     

  3. partdeux

    partdeux Well-Known Member

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    that is so 2 years ago :)

    Best Buy is doing some incredible price matching to online pricing. I just picked up an AWESOME SC-65 for 1,100 out the door. Well worth the upgrade in cost.
     
  4. john300k

    john300k New Member

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    I still have my 1978 McIntosh receiver and 1973 Klipsch speakers..
     
  5. Sonic82

    Sonic82 New Member

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    HDMI is absolutely necessary. We order all our movies through a laptop fed to the reciever on to the TV via HDMI. It's the way to go IMO. I've got a Yamaha upstairs and a Pioneer downstairs...both good units.
     
  6. gunnut07

    gunnut07 New Member

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    YOU can get many great HDMI ready Home Theater REciever for not much money.

    Take a look at this Onkyo for only $250 Granted it is not 7.1 but 5.1 but it has 4 HDMI ports. Plus it is 3D ready (If you want to watch a dim movie in a dark room with sunglasses on). http://www.crutchfield.com/p_580TXS313/Onkyo-TX-SR313.html?tp=179
     
  7. mrm14

    mrm14 Active Member

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    I use a NAD T773 A/V amp as a pre amp by unbridging the internal amp and use (4) Parasound HCA 1500 amps to bi-amp my front and rear speakers. However, this A/V amp run a set of 8 ohm BG hybrid cone/ribbon speakers very nice. The voice channel is still driven off the intergral amplifier section in the NAD T773. NAD has replaced the T773 with a newer model two years ago. I use Wisdom Audio ribbon front and rear speakers with 12" bass drivers and 42" ribbons. The mid channel speakers I can add later when I build a bigger theater room. For now and the size the room, the A/V amp in the 5.1 configuration is more than fine. It is a 7.1 A/V amp however. My sub woofer has twin 12" drivers with a 1200 watt internal amp which is the same as the bass drivers used in the Wisdom ribbon speakers.

    I use HDMI and fiber TOSS link on the OPPO BDP80 BluRay DVD/CD player and component on the NAD M55 DVD/CD player. The NAD M55 is more for sound and the component cableing gives a much warmer, not so digital, sound.

    Also, I run a Thorn semi-auto turntable for the 2000 or so pristine vinyl records I have. Nothing digital beats the sound of vinyl and I still buy new vinyl. The truntable is also using componet cableing.

    That being said the NAD equipment rocks!!! I don't like Yamaha equipment as it deosn't come close to NAD performance.
     
    Last edited: Dec 2, 2012
  8. WebleyFosbery38

    WebleyFosbery38 New Member

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    A $300 7.1 is a challenge in itself especially since you used the word "Audiophile", hard to get a single AP speaker for that much less a SS receiver. NAD has made some pretty good stuff but Ive seen them go up in smoke more than once and they are a bit light on power compared to some of the less Highend names. The Yamaha is pound for pound more powerful, likely class A and will keep the THD to a minimum while giving you plenty of punch. Actually, the Onkyo is a great all around receiver and a reasonable price for what your doing, if you buy it new, you will be sure its gonna work as it should. Also, if you buy new, think about a receiver that has built in wireless Podcasting, handy if you have tons of stuff on an Ipod or Iphone.

    Good luck with your hunting!

    First question, whats the display (TV), does it have HDMI's already, if so, you dont necessarily need them on the receiver, input all your AV sources to the TV and either take the Toslink or line level Audio-out (Variable preferably) and feed it into your ss input (Easier to use than a system switched through the receiver for most anyways.

    Second, mismatching speakers (OTHER THAN THE SUB) will make the surround less realistic and sound screwy. Its important to match drivers in Mains, Fronts and surrounds if you want accurate reproduction and the sound to be steered without weird transitions and other anomalies. Another thing to keep in mind is the impedance of the Speakers, most good speakers are 8 Ohms, most less expensive ones are 4 ohms or less. A four Ohm speaker is twice the load on an amp as an 8 ohm one and while most new systems can handle that, older ones may not handle anything less than 8 ohms without puking their guts out. The speaker data plate should tell you, if not, a VOM will give you a close measurement on Ohms.



    My main SS system in the house is an Onkyo, they are beefy, affordable and built to integrate with most anything out there!
     
  9. Sonic82

    Sonic82 New Member

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    Never quite understood this. My Monitor Audio RX6 (english made) which i regretfully have sold, ran nominal 6 ohms. I ran the Yamaha at 8 with them. Loudspeaker impedance is not a single number, not sure how they determine nominal impedance.

    By the way 12fretter ...The TV's they put out now have two receivers. Analog and Digital. But the analog one they throw in typically cheap and sucks and dang near unwatchable. Keep this in mind when thinking HDMI. They analog viewing will be horrible on your brand new TV should you be getting one anytime soon... but the digital is first class.
     
    Last edited: Dec 2, 2012
  10. Sonic82

    Sonic82 New Member

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    Ain't nothing wrong with that!...probably sounds better than the new stuff.
     
  11. 12fretter

    12fretter New Member

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    I made some mistakes in my post. My TV has three HDMI inputs which is one more than I need. (Satellite and Blue-Ray). The receiver doesn't need to process video, it needs to process audio. With any Surround AVR, there are ample digital audio inputs. So even though S-Video inputs on the AVR are not HD, I won't be using any video inputs at all since my sources will go direct to the TV. The audio contained in the HDMI cable is the same digital audio signal as from the Digital Audio Out signal from the same device. So if I connect the HDMI from the Blue-Ray (for instance) to the TV, I'll watch HD video and listen to it's digital audio through the TV speakers. If I want surround, I'll also hook the Digital Audio Out of the Blue Ray to the DVD Digital Audio Input of the AVR to listen to the digital audio of the source while watching it's HD video.

    Now, with that explanation out of the way, who feels like I am still making a mistake by not requiring HDMI on the AVR? That is not sarcastic, it's an honest question. Also, is the upgrade to 7.1 from 5.1 a big enough deal to worry about? Does it make enough of a difference that I should make sure I get it now? That Onkyo link above has me thinking, but a non-hdmi, 5.1 receiver opens up all kinds of inexpensive possibilities.

    Thanks to all for your input. Input--ha.
     
  12. 12fretter

    12fretter New Member

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    By the way, I ran across one of these on my local Craigslist. It seems to be able to handle what I need, but take a look at the rear panel and make sure I'm not nuts. One note, I am getting Dish Satellite installed this coming week, and the pictures on the rear panel of the Hopper shows an Optical Audio Output. My Blue Ray has both Optical and Digital Audio Outs, and this Yamaha has two Digital Audio Ins and 3 Optical Audio Ins, so it should work for all my needs. But am I missing something? Thanks again.
     
  13. partdeux

    partdeux Well-Known Member

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    12,

    your plan will work... right up until you run out of inputs to the TV, or you buy a new device that either has analog or HDMI outputs, which was what forced me into the new receiver :)
     
  14. 12fretter

    12fretter New Member

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    Thanks, Partdeaux. I know what you mean, and I get your muted tone of caution. Since I'm not exactly on the leading edge of technology, I'm ok with those parameters for now. By the time those limits are exceeded, there will, I'm sure, be even more to consider upgrading and more technologies to learn about and plan for.
     
  15. Yunus

    Yunus New Member

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    Each TV is different but most tv's will not output anything more than stereo even through Toslink, when the signal enters the TV it is downgraded to stereo.

    12,

    I agree with Partduex, HDMI may not be needed now but it might be in the future and it will let you have a smaller cable footprint. The only disadvantage is that if you run HDMI through your receiver the receiver must be on the pass the signal through, at least that's how I have always seen it.

    Personally I can't tell the difference between 5.1 and 7.1. I would save the extra $$ and buy less but better quality speakers.
     
  16. willfully armed

    willfully armed New Member

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    Btw, if your "amp" doesn't have vacuum tubes, its a toy. ;) marantz!
     
  17. WebleyFosbery38

    WebleyFosbery38 New Member

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    Nominal is a more accurate measurement of true impedance, not resistive but an active measurement. As long as you dont pound the 6 ohm load on a receiver that is rated at 8 ohms, your OK, just wouldnt run 4 Ohm speakers on an 8 ohm amp/ receiver, you will toast the receiver.
     
  18. rhyno13

    rhyno13 New Member

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    Harmon Kardon and Nakamichi are probably the two best I have ever owned.
     
  19. Shihan

    Shihan Active Member Lifetime Supporter

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    Bang & Olufsen makes good stuff.
     
  20. Sonic82

    Sonic82 New Member

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    ....and Porsche makes great cars :confused: