A question about viewpoints

Discussion in 'The Club House' started by DarinCraft, Feb 4, 2010.

  1. DarinCraft

    DarinCraft New Member

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    I live in CA, I am retired LE and have a pretty capable grasp on CA gun law.

    NOW ALL POLITICS ASIDE, I REALIZE THAT CA CREATED SOME OF THE MOST LIBERAL CRAP TO EVER COME ABOUT BUT THIS IS ABOUT GUNS AND GUNS ALONE.

    This is not a flame on anyone or anywhere, I just want to understand some mindsets that others have.

    California does have some more stringent laws when it comes to guns...
    No mags over 10 rounds, no detachable mags with evil features, no semi auto shotguns with detachable mags, no semi auto shotguns with evil features, no 50 BMG, etc.

    Some of our laws do not prevent crime, I know that. Gang member have hicap mags and full autos. I didn't see it all the time, but I did run across it. The shotgun laws are flat ridiculous.

    Now I understand from the outside looking in, it looks like a noose is around our neck, but in reality there are states that are worse.

    New Jersey, New York for example have more absurd laws than us. There are some laws you have to hunt large game with a shotgun or you can't use a shotgun at all. Now I am not picking on any of those states, but I do want to know why a lot of people single out California (Commiefornia, Kommiefornia, PRK, the peoples republic, the liberal left and so on) and slams the people who live here. It seems that every gun forum I am on as soon as I or someone else posts something and THEY HAPPEN to live in CA, some people start bashing even if the state has nothing to do with the post. Hell I have even been slammed about handgun law from guys who live in New York. But if I make a comment about New York, then holy crap I am the pot calling the kettle black.

    Why is this? Please, lets keep the attacks out of this. This is not a flame, it is not intended on getting the masses rilled up. I just want to know why this exsists and why the double standard.

    PS I live in the central valley. Trust me there are quite a few Conservative farmers here. The whole state is not liberal like some would like to believe.
     
  2. gorknoids

    gorknoids New Member

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    Well, after breaking out and preparing a bunch of Mk-77 firebombs at 29 Palms for an airshow, they wouldn't let us drop them. That's my only complaint.
     

  3. NGIB

    NGIB New Member

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    One word: Pelosi (and Boxer if you want 2).

    The loonies from CA get all the press and tend to get front page treatment which makes the state look bad. In some ways, GA gun law is stranger than CA gun law as we have the "public gathering" law that no one understands...
     
  4. zhuk

    zhuk New Member

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    California may be the easy target but as far as viewpoints go, it all depends on your perspective...can't you have semi-autos in CA? No permit, no registration, no licence required? Practice/plinking allowed?

    I would personally call that WIN. Perspective is all.
     
  5. DarinCraft

    DarinCraft New Member

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    I can understand that and it would piss me off. But does that justify lambasting everyone from CA, just because they live here? Not saying you did, but for some people they would make it a personal vendetta against CA.

    I appreciate that, that is why I asked about guns and guns alone. Remember who Illinois created or what about Nevada? Even though we have some nuts here, is that good enough to blast people and tell them to move out of CA and into the United States? Once again, not saying you did or ever would.

    What I am seeing in my experience is CA has San Fransisco and LA. Together they create a lot of libs, and a lot of attention.

    Lets say you live in state "A" who has the exact laws that CA has and I live in CA. Now we both post a question about how to build a legal AR. In most cases I have seen, you will get constructive answers with references and links.

    Me...I will most likely get blasted and get told to move to a "free state" or to move to the USA, type comments. Do you see what I mean?
     
    Last edited: Feb 4, 2010
  6. DarinCraft

    DarinCraft New Member

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    Without getting into PC 12276.1, yes for the most part you can have semi autos without any problems at all.
     
  7. CA357

    CA357 New Member Supporter

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    As a resident of Sacramento, I feel I can speak with a bit of credibility on the subject.

    The laws are restrictive. Sacramento County requires identification and a form filled out with a copy of a drivers license and a thumbprint to purchase ammunition.

    LEO's can buy any damn gun they please, but a regular citizen can't. Don't get me wrong, I'm a law & order guy, but why is a cop more special or better able to handle a firearm than me? In fact, I'm probably more capable and more safe with a firearm than most LEO's.

    The 10 round magazine limit is just plain stupid. When did any of that crap ever stop a criminal from committing a crime.

    A ten day wait to pick up a gun from a dealer? In other states, you can go in, and walk out with the gun that same day.

    The same with concealed carry laws. Unless you're butt buddies with the Sheriff or politically connected and/or wealthy, and ordinary citizen cannot get a CCW.

    I realize that it's not that way in some rural counties, but here in Sacramento with all the gangbangers, perverts and general criminals jerkoffs, a means of self defense is verboten.

    If I were to carry in spite of the law, then I'm the criminal.

    Then there's the fact that California is the capitol of Political Correctness. If it's off kilter, left of center and generally inane and assinine, the chances are that it originated here.

    Friggin' Jerry Brown is still hanging around for crying out loud! We've got Pelosi, Feinstein, Boxer and Matsui in D.C. keeping California left.
    We've got scumbags like Villaraigosa, an Aztlan supporter running L.A.

    We are overtaxed, overcharged and generally abused by damn near every agency or program or politician in the state.

    We pay entirely too much for goods and services, more than other states. There's more, but right now I'm entirely too agitated to continue.

    Trust me, my wife and I are leaving CA asap.

    Btw, thanks for your service.
     
  8. robocop10mm

    robocop10mm Lifetime Supporting Member Lifetime Supporter

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    There is a reason we call it the "Left Coast". Obviously the state is not inhabited by 100% left wing loons. Kali just seems to have a higher percentage of such types. New York City, New Jersey, Chicago and DC have more than their fair share of effed up gun laws. New Jersey seems to be completely out of tough with the population. The politicians have managed to pass overly restrictive gun laws (no HP handgun ammo) in spite of the leanings of the populace.

    California is just plain fun to pick on. Chicago is just a bunch of Daley Ditto heads. DC does not even have any real people left in it, just politicians and bureaucrats and New York city is not even a part of the USA any more (is it?).
     
  9. CA357

    CA357 New Member Supporter

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    I realize that my post didn't adhere strictly to firearms laws, but to not include the political and financial side doesn't give the whole picture.
     
  10. dunerunner

    dunerunner New Member

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    I really feel for you poor Republicans, Libertarians, Conservative Democrats and Independents in California!!

    You're outnumbered by the Communists, Liberals and Social Progressives.

    This is why we talk about California from the corner of our mouths, as if doing so will prevent the same liberal crap from drifting Northward!:eek: God Forbid!!

    I have a Carry Permit in Oregon but must completely dismantle my firearm before crossing the border into California. This requires me to carry a 6 cell mag light or ball bat or a complete set of golf clubs....wait, the last one is something I carry all the time, instead of my .45 or 9MM. This leaves me defenseless against a criminal with a gun, intent to committing a crime and leaving no witnesses.

    We all know it is an individuals right, dare I say responsibility to defend themselves, their family and their property. The police do not protect the citizens they serve. They investigate crime which has already been committed, follow the evidence to the perp, arrest them and deliver them to the judicial system.
     
  11. DarinCraft

    DarinCraft New Member

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    Although I can attest to the correctness of your entire statement especially the part about LE and being able to handle a gun...lol, my post is more for the people outside of CA and their responses to people from CA. I was a little more specific as to what I meant on post #4.

    But trust me, I do agree with your statement, but outside of that I mean the pure interaction on these sites to people from CA.

    I do have to correct one thing. LE cannot buy any gun they want. If they want a gun, at least in my experience they have to prove the necessity for that weapon to their Chief. The Chief will either do it or have you take it to the department armorer. The armorer will then determine if the ammo coinsides with the ammo in use by the department, whether or not he can work on that weapon and the Range master would determine whether or not you are proficient on that weapon and in the event another officer picks it up, can they use it? Then if it is approved for field use, you get a letter stating so and you go to the FFL to get it. With my department that didn't happen unless it was an AR. Our department used AR's, UMP 40's (SWAT), G22's, HK G36's (SWAT), Benelli's(SWAT) and 870's. Our Chief and armorer felt we were more than armed enough and there was no reason for anything more than what we had.

    Thanks
     
    Last edited: Feb 4, 2010
  12. NGIB

    NGIB New Member

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    One thing you have to take into account is that the vast majority of folks that frequent gun boards are a tad rabid about "shall not be infringed."

    Only being able to buy a gun from an approved list, limits on mag capacity, and waiting periods - is nothing short of tyranny to the RKBA crowd. To be honest - I couldn't live there myself but I also try not to slam the folks that ask questions...
     
  13. pioneer461

    pioneer461 New Member

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    Darin, I too am retired police, having worked in both California and Oregon. I think it may be because California is an easy, high profile target. Many of us know there are worse states, but Calif. has a long history of nutty laws, Hollywood, the Governator, the legislature and then there is the 9th Circuit Court. Most folks tend to think of California as only having two cities, San Francisco and Los Angeles. Believe me, I know nutty, my family lives in Santa Cruz and I visit often.

    I fled California in 1980 during the Rose Bird state supreme court and Governor Jerry "Moonbeam" Brown's reign. Oregon, in it's own way is just as goofy as our southern neighbor. I work in Portland which prides itself as being "progressive," odd, strange and weird. (see below bumper stickers. Both sold with pride in Portland.)

    Once outside of Portland and Eugene / Springfield, you are among solid, hard working conservative folks, who play by the rules and want government out of their lives. Sadly, Portland and Eugene areas, as are LAX & SFO, are predominantly leftist and because of the large population, are able to control politics and votes. Just last week, Portland and Eugene voters passed a tax hike during very bad economic times. How nutty is that? Most of the rest of the state voted against it, but that doesn't matter.

    Try and take it with a grain of salt, and not personally.
    Congratulations on surviving till retirement.



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  14. bkt

    bkt New Member

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    California is indeed the land of fruits and nuts, and the liberal slop generated there is pretty awful. That said, you're right -- New York, New Jersey and probably some other states are worse in terms of gun laws. As a New Yorker, I feel that particular stab in the back pretty acutely.

    California does have high-profile brain-donors in Hollywood and a big gaggle of commies freaks in San Francisco. New York has a different breed of flaming idiot, but they tend to keep a lower profile.
     
  15. CA357

    CA357 New Member Supporter

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    Darin, I worked part time in a gun shop up until about six months ago.

    LEO's routinely bought AR's, high capacity mags and firearms like the Ruger LCP without any paperwork from their agencies. They also bought pistols like the Kimber SIS which is also not available to guys like me, again without any special paperwork. One Sheriff bought a Barrett 50, again, no special paperwork.

    So maybe it's different where you worked and live, but that's how it is here in Sacramento County and within the Sacramento city limits.

    My CCW should be the 2nd Amendment. I apologize for my anger, but so much of this stuff is just wrong.

    As far as residents of other states picking on California, sometimes it is somewhat unfair. However, we are judged by LA and SanFransisco, our left wing politicians and the media's focus on socialists and goofballs.
     
  16. Yunus

    Yunus New Member

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    California is viewed as a trend setting state. Think of "California emissions" on cars. They try to make laws and then do their best to nationalize them, which they have a better chance than any other state of doing because of the number of congressman they have.

    Also liberal politicians in California like to brag about their strict gun laws, even though they don't stop crime. This brings it to the national stage more often than Illinois or some other states.

    Lastly and maybe most importantly, California has weird laws about what guns can and cannot be owned and what parts can and cannot be on those guns. So when you go to a gun shop online you see many times "Cannot ship to California", while Maryland has some funky laws too, more often than not the 1 place the website says you cannot ship to is California. You mention that you must use a shotgun to hunt large game but that doesn't matter to the gun shop, that's the residents problem, if a gun shop ships an illegal weapon to California, that's their ***.
     
  17. orangello

    orangello New Member

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    I guess i was pretty ignorant about Cali's gun laws until i started browsing the gun forums. I was amazed when a car forum buddy from MD started talking about some of the silly limitations they are subjected to, especially the magazine capacity on the AR he was assembling. After hearing about that, i did read around & was amazed and disgusted by the limitations you poor people in Cali are hamstrung by. I was further grossed out by the sticker on my XD's box that stated that it wasn't legal for sale in Cali or IL with the 13 round magazines. I don't consider 13 to be "high capacity"; i think about the 30+ mags for glocks that stick out several inches from the grip for that predjudicial term.

    I don't think the bashing (for lack of a better term) Cali peeps get on gun forums comes from hate; i think it comes from pity or maybe a desire to encourage Cali peeps to either change their laws or their state of residence to something more in line with common sense. I certainly don't hate people from Cali for having gun laws i consider preposterous, but i do feel bad for them for having to live that way and maybe a bit sad for them that they haven't been able to improve their situation. I guess it is a bit like the way many people look at homeless people, no offense.

    If it helps salve any hurt feelings, i would LOVE to live in a place with the weather & recreational opportunities of Northern California, and i see regular job openings in the field i would prefer to work in, but i don't think i would be happy living with the restrictive regulations concerning modifications of modern cars. I love my car & would rather burn it down than make it Cali-legal & drive it that way (i realize this may seem petty). So, it's not just the restrictive gun laws that make me not want to live in Cali or that make me feel a bit sad for those who do live in Cali.

    At least you have groovy weather & scenery; there aren't many other states from which you can watch the sunset on the ocean. :) And let's not forget those herb-friendly California laws; those certainly tempt me to lust after that good Cali living. I will try to remember to restrict any anti-Cali spewage in your threads in the future.
     
    Last edited: Feb 4, 2010
  18. Benning Boy

    Benning Boy New Member

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    I think if you're on this forum, you're more likely to receive pity than disdain.

    I don't know about personal attacks against you, but I like the Cali guys here. CA357 is a bud.

    I spent 3 years at Planet Ord. I took advantage of my time and saw the whole state.

    The rest of the country views Ca as a sign of things to come. If a silly @$$ policy passes and floats there, there is a good chance that it has the potential to be introduced every where else. May not pass, but that doesn't mean they won't try it.

    My beef with the place comes with the IOUs issued in place of tax refunds.
    I think anywhere else would have revolted and overthrown.

    That, and you have real hippies. Not pseudo wannabe hippies, but people who dropped a dose up on Haight Ashbury, and stayed in 1969 forever.

    Hippies are bad.
     
  19. DarinCraft

    DarinCraft New Member

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    Let me say this, this forum has never done anything that I mentioned in the OP. However, all of the other forums I am on do.

    The reason I posted this question here is solely because of the quality of people on this forum. You guys are by far some of the most professional people I have ever talked to and intelligent to boot. I knew if I posted this question here, I would get genuine answers that had intelligent points and not a bunch of, "Ahhh CA is full of fags" or "CA sucks thats why" type answers.

    Thanks for the answers guys, I have learned more from this forum in the last month than I have anywhere else.
     
  20. DarinCraft

    DarinCraft New Member

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    Oh man then you will be absolutely ecstatic to learn that Governor Moonbeam is favored to win the election for Governor this year. Gavin Newsom (Mayor of liberal left wing San Fransisco) is dropping out to support Brown and run for the LT Gov position.

    The two Republican nominees are too busy fighting with each other to see the dems are banning together and are going to take CA. The sad part is the voting population is too young to know who Jerry Brown is and how bad he was the first time. I still can't believe one of the most anti-gun nuts in CA is the Attorney General and soon to be the Gov again.