Featured 7.62 x 39 BCA upper. You guessed it...light primer strikes. any ideas?

Discussion in 'Auto & Semi-Auto Discussion' started by CZ Newb, Oct 15, 2020.

  1. CZ Newb

    CZ Newb Active Member

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    and before you ask.....YES I used the "enhanced" firing pin from RED X arms http://www.redxarms.com/product-p/5061.htm

    this is the upper https://www.bearcreekarsenal.com/bc...2x39-carbine-length-gas-system-w-15-mlok-rail

    I put the firing pin in. Went to the range with wolf ammo.

    Pulled trigger. Nothing but a tiny click. Ejected that round, tried again...same thing.

    Eventually I put the regular firing pin from my working upper in and finally it fired maybe 5 times out of about 20 attempts


    The only thing I can think of is that I have a RAVE140 trigger and maybe the hammer spring isnt heavy enough. (I have sent an email to Rise Armaments asking about it)

    I dont remember the exact method used to get it to fire. for instance was the magazine in or out? Dont remember

    btw using ASC mags


    any ideas??
     
  2. Mercator

    Mercator Well-Known Member

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    Were the primers dented on the unfired rounds? Just to be sure.

    Try different ammo. Russian primers tend to be hard. The 7.62 upper does not make your rifle an AK. Try a box of GECO or American made ammo.
     
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  3. CZ Newb

    CZ Newb Active Member

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    primers were dented for sure.

    gonna be hard to try other ammo since I have 1k rds of the wolf lol. I have seen nothing locally but TULA and Wolf....which I understand are both made by Tula

    ATM I am researching triggers with a stronger hammer fall.
     
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  4. Oldoutlaw

    Oldoutlaw Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Tula makes Tula. Wolf uses all manufacturers. Read the labels on Wolf and you will see. Wolf is not a manufacturer, they are only a US based Importer.

    My BCA upper needed an enhanced firing pin. No further problems at this time. Yes, for sure it could be that Rise trigger assembly.
     
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  5. CZ Newb

    CZ Newb Active Member

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    yes i was reflecting on what i saw recently on targetsportsusa where people were asking why the "wolf" ammo went from 123g to 122g (or vice versa, I forget) and they were told it was because the wolf stuff was actually the same as Tula from the Tula plant etc. Im not sure of the arrangement but if its as u say then thats what it is.

    Pretty sure Red Army Standard falls under a similar explanation

    At the local Dunhams they have a few boxes of "Wolf Military Classic" (Berdan primed). I wonder if its just the same Tula? lol
     
    Last edited: Oct 15, 2020
  6. CZ Newb

    CZ Newb Active Member

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  7. CZ Newb

    CZ Newb Active Member

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    evidently the Barnaul stuff has a pretty decent name....but then its funny when he shows the primer end (2:47) and you can clearly see the primer is somewhat recessed lol

     
    Last edited: Oct 15, 2020
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  8. Oldoutlaw

    Oldoutlaw Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Not even close! Barnaul is the Premium plant in Russia for the most part. Tula has always had Quality Control problems. I have not bought one round of Tula for about 25 or so years now. I just won't spend my money on it.
    I suspect that, like you do, the RAV 140 trigger may have a weaker spring in it.
     
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  9. CZ Newb

    CZ Newb Active Member

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    saw this reply on a youtube vid.

    "I’ve been working on more reliability in my AR 47. Kept having those lite primer strikes, even with the stock enhanced firing pin that came with upper 6 years ago. Finally I got to reading and measuring. The problem I found is my tip of the firing pin only protruding through the bolt face about .032. An AK will be around .060 plus. I was way off. Chucked it up and filed the back stop of firing pin. Now it was up to .038 and neck of pin tip was bottoming out on the backside of bolt face. Found the Windom Weaponry firing pin online and fix this aggravation. Now I have .055 protrusion from bolt face to tip. I also found that steel case ammo by measuring my misfired shell primers we’re setting to deep, like .009 to .013. See the problem? I’m 100% now with stock hammer spring and lite trigger spring."


    thats interesting if thats true about the AK pin protrusion. Perhaps even with the enhanced RED X pin its still not protruding enough. In any case it was barely denting the unfired rounds.

    I guess ill have to look at some properly fired rds and see what the primer dent looks like
     
  10. Oldoutlaw

    Oldoutlaw Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Yep. Look at the fired rounds closely. Not all of these enhanced firing pins from different sources are the same either.
     
  11. JTJ

    JTJ Well-Known Member Supporter

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    You might need to go to a milspec trigger. They have to compromise to get a good trigger and I imagine the hammer springs suffer. Milspec is built for reliability not finesse. Can you borrow a milspec lower to try? I have been considering one of the BCA uppers and I do have a milspec trigger in the lower I would use.
     
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  12. CZ Newb

    CZ Newb Active Member

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    no way I could go back(wards) to a milspec trigger on my main AR just to make this new upper work. If anything I want to get another AR to learn how to fully work on them etc. for example there is a DiamondBack DB15 in the LGS for like $599 with something like a milspec trigger. But no guarantee it would work either lol.

    I could see possibly getting another budget AR and putting something like this trigger in it. Hiperfire touts the hammer fall weight of these triggers so they might be a good step up type trigger while still sort of having one foot in mil spec land

    Id feel weird just swapping out the RAVE140 trigger to go to an unknown quantity trigger when I like how my current AR is working. Id feel less weird trying a different trigger in a different AR though lol.
     
  13. JTJ

    JTJ Well-Known Member Supporter

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    My Mini 30 runs fine on Wolf and Silver Bear. Red Army Standard was a no go. Luckily I only bought one box to try. I have not tried Tula in this Mini but the previous one was all about primer depth. People complain about AK triggers but they work.
     
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  14. CZ Newb

    CZ Newb Active Member

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    Im pretty neutral on the whole AR vs AR thing. id say in the end its more about the shooter anyway
     
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  15. CZ Newb

    CZ Newb Active Member

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    1) 500 rds of Wolf Polyformance (Barnaul) on the way
    2) 2 Boxes of Wolf 'Military Classic' to try
    3) 3 boxes of Red Army Standard (probably still Tula, no biggie)
    4) a different enhanced firing pin from Wyndham Weaponry on the way
    5) Rise Armament is going to send me a heavier hammer spring for my RAVE140. That will be one of my last steps to try if nothing else works. I dont really want to mess with the trigger pull of the AR so its conceivable that id actually buy a cheap AR and put some sort of improved mil spec type trigger like an ALG or similar before I mess with the working AR etc

    either way, we gonna get it working, Lord Willing
     
    Last edited: Oct 16, 2020
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  16. JTJ

    JTJ Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Watching to see how it goes. I have the Mini but I would look at an AK if they were available.
     
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  17. Mercator

    Mercator Well-Known Member

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    For the rest of you gun nuts, don’t trust the 7.62x39 conversions. If you’re hell bent on shooting the world’s dirtiest cheapest ammo, get an AK.
     
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  18. CZ Newb

    CZ Newb Active Member

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    and trade one set of teething problems for another set. whatevs
     
  19. Oldoutlaw

    Oldoutlaw Well-Known Member Supporter

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    You are on the right path now.
     
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  20. Mercator

    Mercator Well-Known Member

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    I was addressing others, because I understand you are committed. But teething problems are very unusual in a new factory AK.
     
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