We had a conversation about the 5m/m but I can't find it. For thoes of you that have an interest in the 5 m/m Remington discontinued in the early 80's. The new ammo is 30gr as opposed to the 45 gr orginal. My shooting friend actually put down an antilope with the old one. I hit a prarrie dog at about 25 yards and I'm sure it killed him it did not hit him hard enough to keep him above ground. Later I had my granddaughter shoot one that was about 10 yards away. It was evident that he was hit hard but not hard enough to keep him on top of the ground. I think the 5mm is a good gopher gun now with the lighter ammo.