.380 FMJ/JHP in mag

Discussion in 'General Handgun Discussion' started by Okie_6Shooter, Jan 5, 2014.

  1. Okie_6Shooter

    Okie_6Shooter New Member

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    I have a Sig Sauer P238, it's a nifty little pistol and as soon as my CCL all goes through it will be my everyday carry gun. I have some of the hollow point defense rounds for it but after reading on these forums about it being possibly underpowered to penetrate heavier clothing, do you feel that it would be best to run some kind of combination of FMJ and JHP in the mag, ie; FMJ chambered follow by JHP? I am curious to hear what y'all think. Thanks!
     
  2. clr8ter

    clr8ter New Member

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    My personal choice would be Hornady Critical Duty or Critical Defense. Uhhhh, if you can find it.
     

  3. eatmydust

    eatmydust New Member

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    Okie_6 - If you search "380 alternate fmj", you'll find an entire thread re.: alternating JHP/FMJ if you check back in about page 4 or 5 of the pages listed.
     
  4. Okie_6Shooter

    Okie_6Shooter New Member

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    Ya I have plenty of that but was just curious if running some solids in the mag would give a backup to make sure if a hollow point doesn't penetrate that I would have something that would out of the shots. Hopefully never need to find out or have to be in the scenario but I want to get the most out of the caliber and gun if myself or my family was ever in that position.
     
  5. Okie_6Shooter

    Okie_6Shooter New Member

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    Thanks a bunch! I will look for it. Sometimes my search function doesn't work on my phone. Do you know what thread that was in and I'll find it that way if need be?
     
  6. Okie_6Shooter

    Okie_6Shooter New Member

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    Found it! Thanks a bunch
     
  7. clr8ter

    clr8ter New Member

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    I should have said earlier; The Hornady CD is designed to penetrate 1st, THEN expand. the Critical Defense, at least in the larger calibers, is designed to meet FBI requirements for penetration. You might want to check if that holds true for the 380 version….
     
  8. Axxe55

    Axxe55 The Apocalypse Is Coming.....

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    you will no doubt get differing opinions on this. i have my opinions as well an think that a 380 is going to be used up close and personal, at say less than 10 feet or so, and it's velocity will be close to it's peak at this distance. my personal preference is JHP ammo simply because of the distances involved.
     
  9. Mercator

    Mercator Active Member

    The JHPs are not exactly underpowered, especially the +P variety. What you probably mean is premature expansion with partial penetration. There are test results widely available. I don't own a 380 so can't tell you first hand. Can only say, if your SIG is reliable on hollowpoints, just stick to them. A Bufdalo Bore HP will hit harder than just about any FMJ.
     
  10. Okie_6Shooter

    Okie_6Shooter New Member

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    Very good. That is all sound advice and pretty consensus to stick with just HP's
     
  11. JonM

    JonM Moderator

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    im in the opposite camp.

    goblins arent made of gelatin. while gelatin is a good medium to test what a bullet is capable of doing and comparing to other bullets in a perfect ideal environment, they will never encounter that in self defense.

    a goblin is made of several layers of skin fat muscle bone bone and fluids. non of which is a gelatin. a goblin is also never going to be standing still facing you square arms at his side like your targets on a range. they will almost slways be holding a weapon of some sort in front of their torso's or be side on to in much the same fashion. in order to hold that weapon they have to put their arms up in front of their chests.

    now for a hp round to work well it has to have a fairly consistant media in which to expand with no bones or other objects in the way. some bullets like the critical defense are pretty good at doing this when in a larger caliber with more mass and velocity. but the 380 has not got much of either comparatively.

    so when the fbi did their thirteen inch requirement they measured the thickness only of the arms as if crossed over the chest. goblins never stand there with their arms hugging themselves while trying to murder you. their arms are almost always straight out from the body for part of their length and then maybe slightly bent meaning worst case your bullet has to go through a lot of arm meat and bone BEFORE it even gets tot he chest and has likely expanded and lost a LOT of velocity dumping them into fleshy arm muscle fat and bone...

    a 380 hp struggles at best under ideal conditions just to get into the chest cavity if nothing else is encountered.

    a 380 fmj has a MUCH better chance of getting through that stuff and THEN getting into the boiler room intact with a lot more velocity. bigger rounds like 9mm 40 45 etc do well as hp ammo even under the worst case scenario. but the 380 isnt like those.

    the 380 is the sharp stick when you got to choose between nothing and a sharp stick. they dont even hold a lot of bullets so you dont have a lot of chances to stop an agressor.

    all my 380's are loaded with fmj in order to give myself the best chance possible to get at least one round into the vitals.

    you can do what you want this is just my thinking and reasoning im not invested in what you choose for ammo.
     
  12. JohnJak

    JohnJak New Member

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    Personally I use FMJ in the winter time here in Michigan and change to HP in the summer. Just my 2 pennies of info.
     
  13. DrFootball

    DrFootball disappointed & disgusted, But DETERMINED... Lifetime Supporter

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    You may want to look into alternating rounds or even extra Mags..I'd ask a few folks here who have the 238 and see what they say. I have only shot one once, belong to a friend who is a Ret. Army SF Lt. Col., he carries 3 spare mags for his( he alternates between the 238 and a PPK) and he's either carrying 95Gr. FMJ's or 85-100 gr. JHP's or JSP's....
    His eyes are what you'd expect a 72 yr. Olds to be, and he puts 5 in the X out to 10yds.(30' for you non-yardage types.... )
     
  14. Wrangler44

    Wrangler44 New Member

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    I use Hornady Critical Defense in my 238. It's my understanding that they were designed to have consistent expansion and penetration regardless of winter clothing.
     
  15. DrFootball

    DrFootball disappointed & disgusted, But DETERMINED... Lifetime Supporter

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    I happen to like that round. Have some in 9MM for me, and 38+P for MzGrn,...she also has a box of the New CD Lite's...in reduced recoil 38...
     
  16. Doc3402

    Doc3402 New Member

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    Go to the link and look through. Don't forget the pretty pictures at the end. They are color coded for your convenience. Choose from the rounds that do not contain yellow or red. Green = Good, Blue = Best. With the shorter barrel on the P238 I would be looking for a whole bunch of blue.

    http://shootingthebull.net/blog/final-results-of-the-380-acp-ammo-quest/
     
  17. John_Deer

    John_Deer New Member

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    If the goblin has any kind of training, boxing, military, martial arts or just a good street fighter he is going to assume a blade stance when he attacks. You are not going to get a shot into his chest. You are going to have to shoot through his weak arm unless you are incredibly lucky.

    In my experience Speer Lawman 380 FMJ ammo functions best. Lawman ammo has a round nose that functions well, it is not overpowered protecting the tiny ejector found in most 380 acp pistols.

    My experience is with the Kel Tec P 3AT and the Ruger LCP.

    If you have a small 380 no matter how much powder is loaded in the ammo your velocity is going to be around 1,000 fps. The short barreled 380 has the same issues as the snub nosed 357 on a smaller scale. There is not enough time for the gas to expand.
     
    Last edited: Jan 31, 2014
  18. eatmydust

    eatmydust New Member

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    I just switched from staggered Winchester PDX1/FMJ to all Federal Hydra-Shok. I'll keep my eye out for Fiocchi Extrema, but I haven't found any yet.

    Check out Doc3402's blog link, you'll understand. There is a corresponding video also.
     
  19. Wrangler44

    Wrangler44 New Member

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    Wow judging from that Hornady CD in 380 is one of the worst performing rounds, I would have never thought that. Thanks for the post I'll be switching out soon.
     
  20. Doc3402

    Doc3402 New Member

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    Keep in mind this is micro-pistol testing. Sort of the LCP size guns. You may get a totally different batch of winners if you add even another inch of barrel with a larger firearm. Some of the marginal rounds may expand better and penetrate deeper. The ones that are so consistent now may actually over-penetrate or fail to expand in the denim tests given a little more velocity.

    I'm not a firm believer in gelatin tests. It's too consistent. There are so many variables that can come into play in gun shot injuries, it's hard to say that one specific load will work in all cases. You just have to go with the one that seems the best, and hope that Mr Murphy is out to lunch.