223 subsonic load data

Discussion in 'Ammunition & Reloading' started by linuxuser3890, Feb 10, 2012.

  1. linuxuser3890

    linuxuser3890 New Member

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    Anyone reloading heavy bullets in 223 to be subsonic? I'm about to load up some and was looking for some proven load data. Also I am having trouble finding heavy soft points or hollow point bullets locally so since I have to order opinions about potential projectiles are welcome.

    If anyone has done this with or without a can please tell me what you have found out. The firearm this is for is an AR.

    Thanks in advance.

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  2. robocop10mm

    robocop10mm Lifetime Supporting Member Lifetime Supporter

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    You will be hard pressed to find a bullet heavier than 80 gr. Berger makes one in 90 gr. You will need a fast twist barrel (1/7) to have any hopes of stabilization. Even then, with low velocity, you may still get key holes @100.

    To load subsonic (under 1100 fps) you will be hard pressed to get enough gas to cycle the action.

    I load a 57 gr Hard cast, gas check bullet at 2500 and it will cycle reliably. I found anything lighter than that lost reliability.
     

  3. linuxuser3890

    linuxuser3890 New Member

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    I do have a 1 to 7 twist rate barrel so not a problem there. I found some 69 gr SMKs locally but I want something that would expand better. As for cycling I already realize its something I may have to give up but its ok for what I want to do with it.

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  4. willfully armed

    willfully armed New Member

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    Trail boss powder does it great. Squirrel and rabbit loads. Accurate to 100 yds, and hits the 200 yd steel with no adjustment.

    Just won't cycle.
     
  5. linuxuser3890

    linuxuser3890 New Member

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    You must use a light bullet with that.

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  6. willfully armed

    willfully armed New Member

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    No.

    We've done 45-77. Experience trumps hearsay.
     
  7. linuxuser3890

    linuxuser3890 New Member

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    Just tested 2 different batches today. Both used 55g FMJs from winchester and 3.9g of trailboss. First batch I used trimmed cases. The second I didn't trim the cases because it is so much faster that way. Both batches were quiet and accurate. For crimping what I did was set the taper crimp on my die for a slight crimp on the trimmed brass, then I left it there for the untrimmed. COAL was 2.235".

    This is a good load that I would suggest to anyone looking to small game hunt with an AR, or if you have a recoil sensitive shooter that you want to start out small. My gal really liked the noise level and the fun she got from it.

    If you want more details on this load just say so.

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    Edit: there was also a girl at the range with her boyfriend that said she enjoyed the sub loads too because they didn't make her jump. I don't think she liked guns because she never shot anything while she was there. So another application for this could be if you have someone that is noise sensitive around you.
     
    Last edited: Apr 8, 2012
  8. sniper762

    sniper762 New Member

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    if you are using an ar15 platform you'd do better in getting a 22lr conversion kit. aquilla has 60gr, subsonics. cycling is not a problem.
     
  9. linuxuser3890

    linuxuser3890 New Member

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    Yeah I could do that if I was going to be shooting a lot of these. But I prefer not to spend money on a conversion for cheap ammo when the 50 I loaded are going to last me a while.

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  10. sniper762

    sniper762 New Member

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    YOU do know that it is not recomended to load jacketed projos in rifles to subsonic velocities (builds excessive pressures). use cast lead. i called sierra reloading tech for .308 susonic info. they said 7gr. of unique behind a cast lead 200 gr. projo for 1050fps.

    also no subsonic loads will cycle semi auto actions. my reason for going with the 22 adapter.
     
    Last edited: Apr 9, 2012
  11. Sniper03

    Sniper03 Supporting Member Supporter

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    3890,

    You will more than likely with out a doubt have cycling problems with a sub sonic round. Also if you go heavy like 80 grain or more? If you could find (80+) them need to plan on a single round at a time. 80s are generally way to long for a magazine to feed properly. If someone has solved the problem with the 80s please share it with us.
    A lot of varmint hunters our west use up to 80 grain for real long shots. However a friend of mine loads one at a time.'

    03
     
  12. linuxuser3890

    linuxuser3890 New Member

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    You are right about them not cycling but, I knew that before I started. With trailboss there is no risk of overpressure. They even have a trailboss load on the IMR website of 4g with a 55g FMJ. They also have instructions for a reduced load with any cartridge. It is something like 20% less weight of trailboss than what fills the case to the bullet depth. This powder is a unique one that was developed for low pressure situations. This load is also a unique one with a very specific application, which I believe others may have a need for. That is why I shared my experiences with this load.

    Next I will be working on some subsonic loads with this powder and some heavier bullets. But for now 55g FMJs are what have been tested.

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  13. Dan308

    Dan308 New Member

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    isn't it a bad think to load super light loads of something like Unique? I recall something about detonation? Something about the case volume and powder charge density? years ago though.
     
  14. sniper762

    sniper762 New Member

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    the load was recomended by the sierra reloading tech so i trusted it. i fired dozens of them with no problem. i think the key is with cast bullets. they dont create much pressure
     
  15. linuxuser3890

    linuxuser3890 New Member

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    www.reloadammo.com/liteload.htm

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  16. sniper762

    sniper762 New Member

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    linux, this implies of light loads using unique with jacketed projos. cast lead projos (as i used) dont produce pressures as do jacketed ones.

    think about it. you can push a .308 lead slug through a barrel with a steel rod but not a jacketed .308.
     
  17. Dan308

    Dan308 New Member

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    wow that's dated 1996! New I read that somewhere. Thanks for the info sniper762
     
  18. linuxuser3890

    linuxuser3890 New Member

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    I don't think it has so much to do with the force it takes to push the projectile as it does the amount of powder burning with respect to time. Although if sierra gave you the data I don't see why anyone wouldn't trust it.

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  19. linuxuser3890

    linuxuser3890 New Member

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    762,
    After reading that again the guy with the T/C had cast bullets and they were smaller than the bore diameter. So if you believe that story it really supports my dA/dt theory.

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  20. ga-tactical

    ga-tactical New Member

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    RTBA has developed a AR upper that cycles his subsonic loads. It works great. I am also a dealer for them. I shoot a 75gr BTHP and groups well and cycles great. Even in full auto.