Read this before you decide to carry!

Discussion in 'Concealed Carrying & Personal Protection' started by canebrake, Jun 24, 2012.

  1. canebrake

    canebrake New Member

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    Read this before you decide to carry!

    Note to ALL: This is a canebrake process and in no way to be taken as a "MUST FOLLOW" set of instructions to be followed by the sheeple herd or other Nancy Boys engaged in interwebz flaming. This is not a FireArmsTalk.com endorsed or condoned doctrine. It is however, a philosophy applied by this 66 year old gun totin' codger that has served him well.

    Regardless of whether justified or not, you will feel sad about killing another human being. It is better to be sad than to be room temperature.

    If you are involved in a shooting and are the survivor, this is the canebrake MUST DO:

    During the first second of post-shooting quiet, do a tactical reload and store the ejected, but not yet empty mag in a convenient pocket, DO NOT put it in your mag pouch! This will prevent you from grabbing it later thinking its fresh. During this reload do a 360 sweep clearing the area for additional BGs.

    Draw down on the Bad Guy's center mass and watch his hands as you approach. Hands kill! Everything else is just a distraction! Clear the Tango of any weapons and make sure he is no longer a threat. DO NOT shoot again unless he moves at you. By this time you will more than likely be on someone's candid camera!

    If the Tango is no longer a threat, safe and holster your weapon. The officers responding have no idea what has happened, won't know who the good guy is, won't know who the bad guy is, and if they find you standing over a body with a gun in your hand you're likely to get a bad reaction.

    While keeping a safe distance, stay alert! This guy was trying to kill you just minutes ago! Continue your 360 sweeps for any BG’s that may show up! Start yelling "CALL 911! CALL EMS!". DO THIS until someone confirms they have called!

    If you are alone, use your cell phone to call 911 and tell them "There has been a shooting at **your location**, get here fast!" and say nothing more. Do Not hang up and set the phone down while still connected to the 911 operator allowing then to find you. Do not speak to anyone, frequently visually clear the area for BGs and wait until the police/EMS arrives. When the first responders arrive, hurry them to the Tango to provide assistance. I don't care a rat's bottom about the Tango but what I do care about is having the first responder put in his report that when he rolled up on the scene that I was trying to save the Tango’s life! That single statement in his report will show contrition on my part and instantly protect me from a prosecutor trying to portray me as the CCW permit holder and a blood-thirsty vigilante.

    When asked by the police the only thing you EVER say is, "He said he was going to kill me. I believed him. I'm sorry, Officer, but I'm very upset now. I can't say anything more. Please let me speak with my attorney. I assure you that you will have my full cooperation after I consult with my attorney."

    You will need to surrender your identification, CCW license and weapon. With this completed, request to be released to return home, you’re about to be sick. If everything is in order they should return your ID and CCWL and let you go. With the exception of yes or no answers to ID questions or to point out the location of the Tango's weapon, DO NOT answer any other questions! You have invoked the attorney card and are not required to speak to them. You are upset, sick and want to go home! By now they have run and verified your info, know where you live and should let you go.

    If the police persist with questioning you do have an option. If you are convinced they intend to run you through the grinder tell them you are so upset that you are having chest pains. (You may actually be having chest pains.) They will have to send you to the hospital and admit you to intensive care, probably for 24 hours. You cannot be questioned further and certainly not in intensive care. You will then have time to THINK, gather your composure and visit with your lawyer. This will also be part of your record as to how upset and afraid you really were.

    Remember it is the LEO's job to produce evidence, he is not your friend and anything you say can be used against you. Keep your mouth shut!

    Be sure you have a lawyer prior to carrying. Call the attorney now. If it's late, you will probably get a service or machine. Go on record then, do not wait until you can speak to him in person and leave this message; "This is (You) and I require your services for a shooting I was involved in." NEVER (did I say never?) say you shot somebody, not to anyone other than your retained lawyer and not even to him on the phone.

    If you re-read the above you will notice you have NOT once said you shot your gun much less the Tango. You have not lied but more importantly, you have not provided the Tango's legal defense team anything they can run with. This is very important. Invoke the attorney card and say nothing, even when questioned about you gun being fully loaded. You are not required to! Keep saying, "I'm sick and need to go home."



    CCW is what I perceive to be the most personally responsible decision I have made third only to my wedding vows and active service to this great country. Concealed carry is NOT playing cowboys and indians (pardon my age tell) and I’m afraid that’s exactly what many are doing today. When we post encounters as entertainment rather than a positive outcome from our correct decisions we only feed to a “Denny Crain” type response.

    When you decide to carry a concealed weapon, you have burdened yourself with tremendous responsibilities including, but not limited to, physical fitness, firearm and CQB training, in-depth knowledge and handling skills of your weapon of choice and the moral obligation that the issuing authority extracts from you when you applied for the CCW license.

    When your 'go criteria' are met, you MUST draw your concealed carry and if nothing else has changed, it’s not time to talk, it's time to use the deadly force you have trained to render. If that reaction isn’t one smooth ‘muscle memory’, you’re dead! PLEASE NOTICE: I did not say if you draw you must shoot. That’s why I included the “CHANGE” caveat because if the BG turned and ran I would clear the area and then reholster.

    I would also report the incidence to the local police/county sheriff. This gives them a heads-up on the BG in their area and protects me for going non-concealed. Brandishing, here in South Florida, is prosecuted harshly to control the gangsters and road rage.

    There is no fun in concealed carry; it’s a profession that must be executed by professionals. If you do not embrace this school of thought, you have no business being armed. If you don't embrace this, it is my fear that I or my loved ones could become part of your collateral damage.

    I need to emphasize the gravity of this carry decision with these two points;

    A. Use your head (your most powerful weapon) and only draw and fire your weapon to save you or someone’s life. This is the only righteous shooting. Anything else will find you in a cage or a box. Long before you put yourself in the ‘shoot’ position, you better have completed all the legal requirements that allow you to be there. In addition you must complete the following personal conditions;

    1. Training,
    2. Understand and accept the moral obligation that the issuing authority extracts from you when you applied for the CCW license,
    3. Training,
    4. The moral mettle to take a life,
    5. Training,
    6. Know and keep up on the laws covering carry in the location you are armed (political boundaries and building restrictions),
    7. Training,
    8. At a bare minimum have a gun rights lawyer’s phone number on your cell’s speed dial,
    9. Training,
    10. Retain that lawyer if you can afford it,
    11. and did I mention training?
    B. See A or you will get yourself killed!

    We are neither a vigilante nor a hired gun, just a survivalist.
     
  2. kycol

    kycol New Member

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    100% +1 great advise
     

  3. Chainfire

    Chainfire Active Member

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    I think you nailed it down Cane. Great advice.
     
  4. Sniper03

    Sniper03 Supporting Member

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    Cane,

    Great Thread my friend! Could not have said it any better! Great job! And one other final word of advise. After you have followed Cane's advise in this thread to protect you and your rights. Be sure to seek professional help! There is a magnitude of psychological implications that can effect you the victim, who must take a life to defend him, herself, friends, family or innocent person.
    As we know you can be 99% sure of your action and it was a truly righteous act. But if there is 1% of doubt in your mind you will not be able to deal with it. It will literally eat you up and tear you apart as well as your family! So should you ever have to take this action praying to God you never do. Get some professional help from a legally confidential professional source. As Cane said if you carry you must be prepared and willing to take action the instant it occurrs according to the threat. If not you will die or be seriously injured in your first incident The good news is you probably never will! At least we hope and pray you do not!

    03
     
  5. jordan89

    jordan89 New Member

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    Great read and great advice!
     
  6. okdonk

    okdonk New Member

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    Great advice. Thank you so much!
     
  7. jjfuller1

    jjfuller1 New Member

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    very thought provoking. thank you
     
  8. SSCRS

    SSCRS New Member

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    Very informative
     
  9. cheftonyb

    cheftonyb New Member

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    Eye opening thanks great advice
     
  10. Tackleberry1

    Tackleberry1 New Member

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    Excellent Advice. I've had many friends and Familly members seek my counsel on whether or not they should carry. I read the following in American Handgunner years ago and dispence it liberally whenever this question arises.

    "A gun is no different than a fire extinguisher. It does not make you a Cop anymore than a fire extinguisher makes you a Fireman. Both are simply tools that if used properly, can help you survive a deadly situation UNTIL PROFESIONAL HELP ARRIVES."

    American Handgunner

    Those that embrace this idea will most likely never wind up in a cage.

    Tack
     
  11. yayamamasami

    yayamamasami New Member

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    Well said, cane! I've said it a few times here myself. TRAINING, training, training!!! Carrying is not a game.
     
  12. ballistix45

    ballistix45 New Member

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    Thank you very much for this advice cane!
     
  13. Kodeman

    Kodeman New Member

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    Thank you Cane for this very informative information.Please explain the reasoning to do a tactical reload immediately following a shooting.
    I'm sure there is a good reason for this but I am unable to figure it out. Thank you.
    KODEMAN
     
  14. canebrake

    canebrake New Member

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    In the first seconds of quiet you will be able to hear your heart beat, feel the hair on the back of your neck start to lay down and taste the gun powder still floating in the air....but........unless the slide is in lock-back, you WILL NOT know how many rounds you expended much less, "do I have any left to fend off more tangos should this guy's friends show up?"

    Removing the mag and replacing it with a fresh one during your 360º sweep clearing the area for additional BGs answers that question. You will/should be fully loaded, safety off (I think in 1911 terms) and booger-hook off the trigger ready to rock-on should the need arise.

    At this time you will draw down on the BG and watch his hands!

    Make sense now?

    If not, ask more questions! [​IMG]?
     
  15. michigan0626

    michigan0626 New Member

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    How many times do you think this very thing has cost someone a conviction vs acquittal? Being grilled on the witness stand on whether you fired once or more than once. You think you fired once or twice, yet there are six to the chest. You get grilled for being blood thirsty.

    Havent they completely proven this in court that it is impossible to accurately and reliably remember how many times you fired. So my philosophy is to fire as fast as I can accurately and controllably while the threat remains a threat. Once he no longer poses a threat, every round afterward is attempted murder. Once you pull the trigger again, you cant take it back.

    Again, another outstanding writeup and posting by Canebrake!
     
  16. primer1

    primer1 New Member

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    Good info, cane. Let's hope we don't ever need it.
     
  17. Kodeman

    Kodeman New Member

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    Thanks Cane, it makes alot of sense once it's explained.
    Great Posts.
     
  18. Doc3402

    Doc3402 New Member

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    I would like to address this one part of your post. I don't find anything wrong with it, but there is a better way to get your actions into an official report. If you can safely do it, render first aid to the man down. Just make sure it is safe to start first aid, and keep checking to make sure it is safe to continue your efforts. If the scene goes south on you, back off. Start chest compressions if indicated, or just take a shirt and attempt to stop bleeding. Giving aid to the man down makes it mandatory that your actions will at least make it into the EMS report.

    If the dispatcher is on the ball, the first people on scene will not be EMS. Until the scene is cleared by the PD or SO you probably won't see anyone except cops and rubberneckers. The rubberneckers observing you trying to render first aid will probably get into the investigation reports as witness statements, but it may not. With the EMS reports they have to document all aid rendered even if it was rendered by someone other than EMS. Make sure EMS and LE know you attempted to render aid and be specific about what you did.

    Rendering aid also ties in with what Sniper03 mentioned. You will probably feel some remorse if there is even the smallest doubt in your mind when you replay this with 20/20 hindsight. Rendering aid to the best of your ability and training goes a long way toward easing this remorse. If you are totally untrained, don't worry about it. Do what any reasonable person would do in the same situation. Attempt to stop the bleeding. Nobody expects sidewalk surgery at a trauma surgeons skill level. Just do the best you can.

    With that said, I do find your post informative and helpful. It's good advice that any person carrying a weapon of any kind should follow if they ever have to use that weapon. From a .44 mag to a Bud longneck bottle, if you use anything but your hands to defend yourself your post should be used as a guideline of what to do or not do.
     
  19. michigan0626

    michigan0626 New Member

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    Im not a cop. I have no intentions on "playing a cop." But, does it make sense to keep a set of handcuffs at home, and maybe carry a small set of zipcuffs in your pocket out side the home? So that while the man is incappacitated you can eith cuff him or ziptie him behind the back then begin to administer any life saving messures. This would prevent him from assualting you while within arms length. Your not arresting anyone, you are simply doing it for your safety. Which is more important than his life. Cops do it all the time, "for their safety" while conducting stops and pat searches.

    It seems like a fine line between performing life saving measures to look better in court and maintaining your upmost personal safety.
     
  20. Polygon

    Polygon New Member

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    Let's say the BG survives. They might try to say you did more harm than good by rendering aid. Just like I'm not the Police, I'm not an EMT. I'm not touching him.