How good are Americans at using foreign weapons?

Discussion in 'Training & Safety' started by Mark_Van_Goth, Feb 13, 2014.

  1. Mark_Van_Goth

    Mark_Van_Goth New Member

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    I have read and many articles,watched many videos and heard many stories about it.So now I'm wondering:How many American knows how to operate and maintain foreing weapons(Foreing=Weapons in use in other countries by the police and the military)?How many of us would be able to pick up an enemy/criminal weapon effectively operate and, if necessary, maintain it while in combat/on duty/in service?
    They often say that "American guys don't know anything about foreing weapons and rely only on the American ones".Is it false or true?

    The most common weapons were and are:
    -AKM and its derivatives(Assault rifles)
    -FAL
    -G3
    -G36
    -FAMAS
    -F2000
    -VEPR
    -GALIL
    -AK74 and its derivatives(assault rifles)
    -PKM series
    -RPD
    -SKS
    -MG3
    -HK MP5
    -RK 62
    -RPG
    -Dragunov
    -Zastava M76
    -SIG 556
    -UZI(Standard, Mini and micro)
    -Steyr AUG
    -Vz. 61 skorpion
    -Vz. 58
    -Sten
    -Bren
    -Smle
    -Mauser 98 & 24
    -Luger
    -Mauser C96
    -Mosin Nagant
    -Sterling SMG
    -SA 80

    For those who are wondering what I mean with "effectively operate and maintain".
    1)BASIC KNOWLEDGE
    The shooter is able to aim,shoot, reload(standard reload) and to fix a malfunction(missfeeding, double feed, missfiring, ejection failure,etc) but is not really sure about what he is doing
    2)STANDARD KNOWLEDGE
    The shooter is able to aim, shoot, reload(at least standard reloads), fix a malfunction, clean the weapon as it would be the standard service rifle.
    3)ADVANCED KNOWLEDGE
    The shooter is able to aim, shoot, reload(Standard,tactical, emergency), fix a malfunction, clean the weapon as fast and so confidently as a SPECOPS specialist.He knows every secret about the weapon he is using-including how to take advantage from it while abusing it(using it in an uncommon way).
    4)THE "GOD OF WAR"
    it doesn't matters whay you put in his hand-he knows how to use the majority of the weapons aroung the world.He was trained by several specialist from USMC, Spetnaz,Mossad,etc.If it exists, he knows how to use it or will quickly figure out how to use it.
     
    Last edited: Feb 13, 2014
  2. mountainman13

    mountainman13 New Member

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    I've yet to find a gun that I couldn't figure out how to operate, disassemble and reassemble. My first experience with a nambu was a box o' gun.

    better judged by twelve than carried by six.
     

  3. seancslaughter

    seancslaughter New Member

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    if you are talking about the US Military guys it is generally taboo to use foreign weapons unless its a life or death situation. If you have PVT. Joe Snuffy the unit supply guy he probably knows his M16 and thats about it maybe if your lucky he might know and M249. An Infantryman will know dang near every American weapon in his unit from an M9 up to crew served and will possibly have familiarization with some enemy weapons in the AK family and maybe makarovs and tokerovs. Guys in positions where they get to go train with foreign military like some Airborne soldiers and Rangers will usually have to hump around the host countries weapons while assigned there and will become proficient with them as much as what they carry when assigned to there unit. Now the Spec Ops guys depending on the job they have will be damn near proficient with anything you put in his hands, but the Spec Ops Weapons SGT will be an expert with all of them. Now if your just talking regular Joe the Plumber American citizen the level of proficiency is an individual choice from rabid anti gunners all the way up to the guy who can built anything from scratch and operate it expertly blindfolded.
     
  4. chloeshooter

    chloeshooter New Member

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    I have Russian Mosin Nagants, a Romanian SKS and a few Czech CZ Military/Police pistols (these are not on your list but should be). All Eastern Block designs and manufacture.

    IMHO these weapons are less complicated and easier to take down and operate than American firearms. In many cases they have to be. Eastern block countries have historically needed to build firearms that last out of necessity. Manufacturing processes needed to be simpler and hence designs are typically straight forward and no BS. When I look at the simplicity of the SKS I own and AK's I have examined, then compared to the AR15 platform, for sure the ARs are a more elegant design but at the same time not as rugged.

    In the case of CZ pistols, these shoot better than any American made handguns I have ever fired. A tad heavy but balls-on accurate and dependable to the point that I marvel every time I go to the range. I'd put my CZ 75 up against any 9mm we have ever made in the states for dependability and accuracy.

    Here is an interesting story that properly contrasts the difference between Western and Eastern-bloc thinking: In the 1960's, during the space race, the US spent over a million 1960's dollars developing a pressurized writing pen as the ball-point pen did not work in zero gravity. At the end of the day, a lot of money was spent and you still had a pen that ran out of ink

    The Russian's solution?

    a pencil
     
  5. Mark_Van_Goth

    Mark_Van_Goth New Member

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    Nice answer.I was talking about the police officer(Including the SWAT and other tactical response teams),the military(From the Army to the Seals, Rangers, etc) and the average citizen.
    My personal experience(I'll be honest)
    -AKM and its derivatives(Assault rifles)-ADVANCED-I've shot almost all variants
    -FAL-Basic-I know how to operate it, but not how to disassemble and how to maintain it properly
    -G3-STANDARD-It is a good friend of mine
    -G36-STANDARD-Even a kid would be able to use it
    -FAMAS-BASIC-I HATE IT
    -F2000-BASIC-Shi**y weapon.Useless, hate it more than FAMAS
    -VEPR-STANDARD-Nice bullpup conversion
    -GALIL-STANDARD-I LOVE IT!!!!
    -AK74 and its derivatives(assault rifles)-STANDARD-The Sneaky little brother of the 47
    -PKM series-STANDARD-Used M84 during Yugo war
    -RPD-STANDARD-Used during Yugo war
    -SKS-ADVANCED-M59/66A1...an old friend
    -MG3-ADVANCED-We called the M53 "Šarac"(Sharaz)
    -HK MP5-ADVANCED-Everlasting Classic
    -RK 62-STANDARD-"Westernisation" of the AK
    -RPG-STANDARD-everyone can use it
    -Dragunov-STANDARD-Sweet......my favorite one
    -Zastava M76-ADVANCED-Corretion:This is my favorite one!!!
    -SIG 556-STANDARD-The swiss interpretation of an AK...really well made!
    -UZI(Standard, Mini and micro)-ADVANCED-Still a badass weapon...easy to conceal
    -Steyr AUG-BASIC-Never liked it...need more training-btw:I have bullpups
    -Vz. 61 skorpion-ADVANCED-Compact but nasty...one of the prefered weapons by the paramilitary during YW
    -Vz. 58-ADVANCED-One of the finest 7,62x39 rifles ever made!!!
     
  6. Mark_Van_Goth

    Mark_Van_Goth New Member

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    CZ pistols....Checz knows how to build good weapons...The model 75 would not be my first choice...but only an idiot would say that it is not well made(I prefer a Walther P88 or a Zastava M54+).
    And yes...American weapons are much more "complicated"(somebody would say "better designed and engineered").Would you believe that some private us marines doesn't even know where is the safety lever on an AK?Did you know that some idiots try to hit the targets an AK 47 at 200-250m(220-275yds) while shooting full-auto)?Or that they don't even know how to field strip and AK?

    Partially I can understand this....I knew almost nothing about the AR15 platform until I moved/relocated to the USA...I had very little training with it.
     
  7. danf_fl

    danf_fl Retired

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    Add Sten, RPG, CZ.

    And I even know how to foreign correctly! 4-N
     
  8. Mark_Van_Goth

    Mark_Van_Goth New Member

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    Adde a couple more rifles that are still seen on the battlefield
     
  9. c3shooter

    c3shooter Administrator Staff Member

    Not a lot of street criminals here with RPGs. As far as anyone can use-
    1. What happens if you fire one from the left shoulder?
    2. 10 mph wind from right to left. Target at 300 meters. For windage, do you hold to the right or left of target, and why?
     
  10. SSGN_Doc

    SSGN_Doc New Member

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    -AKM-VEPR-GALIL-AK74-RK 62-Zastava M76-SIG 556- Are all so similar that they may as well be considered variations of the same basic platform.

    The Dragunov is very similar as well with the exception of the gas system, and the SKS and VZ58 are not that far off, that mastery of the above guns would take much effort to get a basic understanding of.

    As medical personnel I only have knowledge of crew served weapons that I took the initiative to get trained on, So, the M60, Mk43 and Mk46 and M2 are about all I have familiarization with. No real exposure to operation of foreign crew served, or belt fed weapons.

    Most everything else on teh list I've encountered at full auto shoots, familiarization firings, or just other guys at the range, in semi-auto form. Basic principles of operation of most of these platforms are pretty similar and would not require a genius to figure out the basic maintenence requirements. (again refering to the non crew served weapons.)
     
  11. SSGN_Doc

    SSGN_Doc New Member

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    I don't know about #1, but I know the answer for #2. It is a rocket afterall.
     
  12. manta

    manta Active Member

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    I doint see how any countries could say their firearms are better designed than other countries. Some will be better some will be won't . The fact that American soldiers uses these weapons over their own designs is a example of this. So American soldiers are already familiar with some foreign weapons.
     

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  13. rn-cindy

    rn-cindy New Member

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    I watched something on one of the cable news channels a while back on this topic..US Soldiers are not to use enemy weapons unless life or death situation. Reason being..the AK has a distinctly different sound to it..and could draw friendly fire. Some interviewed said units would keep a few AKs they collected around in case they shot somebody they weren't supposed to. and needed to plant one.....Never been there....so dont know how true any of that is....
     
  14. Jagermeister

    Jagermeister New Member

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  15. c3shooter

    c3shooter Administrator Staff Member

    1. The launcher has a gas relief port on the right side. When firing from the right shoulder, vents away from you. Fire one from the left shoulder, jet of gas goes into your neck.

    2. Yep- it is a rocket. However, the exhaust ports for he rocket motor are not at the rear of the round, but forward, right behind the warhead. Fins are on the back. Because of that, the RPG steers INTO a crosswind. If wind is right to left, your point of aim is to the LEFT of target. Wind will turn it back towards the target.

    rpg7.jpg
    Most folks that have seen a round for the RPG see it before it is fired. Fins are not visible, unfold in flight.
     
  16. Jagermeister

    Jagermeister New Member

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    Well....since most of my guns are foreign, I would say this American is pretty good with them.:D :p
     
  17. Rick1967

    Rick1967 Active Member

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    I own or have owned an SKS, Mosin Nagant, Yugo Mauser, Swiss K-31, AR-15, numerous Bolt and semi auto guns. I do my own gunsmithing. I do not believe that a gun exhists that I could not figure out in very short order.

    Any true "Gun Guy" should be able to figure out how to use an enemy's weapon in pretty short order.

    There are a lot of things that right handed people don't consider. If I were to pick up a bullpup type of rifle I would shoot it weak handed so as not to eject hot brass into my own face. That would be important to know as I am left handed.
     
    Last edited: Feb 13, 2014
  18. JimRau

    JimRau New Member

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    That was one of the things I enjoyed in the Army. In RVN I was task with destroying the weapons caches we found so I got to pick through them and keep what I wanted and what I need for 'scrounging'.:cool:
    Secondly, I spent 8 year in an SF unit so part of our 'training' was becoming familiar with as many small arms as possible.;)
     
  19. John_Deer

    John_Deer New Member

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    I hope I never have to find out if I can fix any foreign military weapons. If I am trying to fix a foreign military weapon it is red dawn in real life.
     
  20. Jagermeister

    Jagermeister New Member

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    If you can fix an AR...then you will have no problem with Eastern or Western European weaponry. :D