Firearm & Gun Forum - FireArmsTalk.com > General Firearms Forums > Legal and Activism > Where's my constitutional Rights?

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Old 07-25-2013, 02:53 AM   #11
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The rules are ridiculous and arbitrary and most often fly in the opposite direction of our founding documents. We will never know if we have violated those rules a lot of the time unless we find bobthefed standing on thy neck. You got lucky by finding out the nice way that you angered bobthefed and you don't have to weather a hospital stay and heal from the encounter before hiring a lawyer to sort it out on your behalf.

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Old 07-25-2013, 03:28 AM   #12
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Now you may be in a kind of "damned if you do, damned if you don't" situation. Regardless of your state's stance on marijuana legality, it is still illegal federally.

You also may not have understood that your plea may hold the weight of a feline conviction on the federal level. This lack of understanding may have caused you to unintentionally purger yourself on a federal form if you answered "no" to the questions asking if you were ever convicted of a felony, and if you are a user of an illegal substance.

The Feds do the background check. So it's in their jurisdiction not the jurisdiction of your state and it will be federal interpretation of the laws.

This is one of the arguments against a federal carry permit system. They may not interpret or apply the same standard that your state would. Until the federal government gets onboard and makes marijuana a state jurisdictional determination, free of federal restriction, then people on your situation will be denied or forced to forfeit their 2A rights in favor if their marijuana use or medical treatment.
Mental health patients often have to have medicinal treatment and would forfeit these rights as well in favor of the medical priority.

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Old 07-25-2013, 05:17 AM   #13
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And as I'm sitting and watching the evening news I see that the DEA and federal police did raids on marijuana clinics in the Puget Sound area today, though they are legal according to Washington law. So, apparently states rights to determine law in their borders continue to erode. And the rights of individual self determination erode as well.

I'm not a fan of pot personally. I've got no use for it. But my personal choice,regardless of the legality, should not affect someone else, where it is legal for them to use. Where it is illegal, folks need to abide by the law, or move to where its legal or work to change the law.

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Old 07-25-2013, 06:01 AM   #14
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Convictions of Alcohol or prescription drug abuse can earn a refusal from the FBI as well. This not just a marijuana violation issue. Any time you make a decision concerning an unclear law dependent on different jurisdictions be very careful.

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Old 07-25-2013, 07:57 AM   #15
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Originally Posted by SSGN_Doc View Post
And as I'm sitting and watching the evening news I see that the DEA and federal police did raids on marijuana clinics in the Puget Sound area today, though they are legal according to Washington law. So, apparently states rights to determine law in their borders continue to erode. And the rights of individual self determination erode as well.

I'm not a fan of pot personally. I've got no use for it. But my personal choice,regardless of the legality, should not affect someone else, where it is legal for them to use. Where it is illegal, folks need to abide by the law, or move to where its legal or work to change the law.
Doc has pointed out something going on all over the U.S.A. - a pissing contest between states who vote to legalize or decriminalize marijuana and the Fed. In California, State LEOs will not help the DEA in raids, but the DEA says they will continue to do them regardless of what the States want. It's issues like this, regardless of the specific issue, where we need to tell our representatives to enforce state's rights. Whether you believe in marijuana or not, the Fed needs to stop its jack-booted intimidation in violation of state law.

As for the OP, I had a friend that wanted a MMC, so I did a lot of research. When you were issued a MMC, you were screwed out of any firearm ownership. You can't even get it revoked to return your 2A rights. Even without the card, the BATFE still treats you as a current drug user because you had a MMC at one time in your life.

The charges that you pled nolo contendre to were a felony, so you are now a convicted felon. There is no "deal" in the justice system that lets you off the hook unless the prosecution agrees to drop all charges. Any "negotiation" leaves you convicted of something. So, now that you are a convicted felon, you're firearms ownership chances are zero. You're screwed twice. Any 4473 you fill out would have to be perjured or would automatically be denied.

You need a VERY good attorney and you need to explain ALL of this, including railroading your cooperation. Do not be fooled - this may take years to sort out, tens of thousands of dollars and several more court appearances. No matter the outcome, you have paid dearly for your decisions. Going forward, you may consider involving an attorney before any major decisions - they're much cheaper before the problems arise.
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Old 07-25-2013, 12:18 PM   #16
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I believe I was denied based on the fact that I just plead nolo to a charge, a cultivation charge(I'm a MMC by the way)...Well it looks like its biting me in the ass now.

Unfortunately, that's the gist of it. And just for the record, sometimes lawyers will tell you what you want to hear.
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Old 07-25-2013, 06:31 PM   #17
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Unfortunately, that's the gist of it. And just for the record, sometimes lawyers will tell you what you want to hear.
2nd that, finding an honest attorney is harder than finding an honest mechanic and they both bill by 1/4 hr and round up...

I've had friends who fought the system and paid thousands of dollars only to have the same result as a public defender.

For the record: Do a lot of research, get a specialized attorney - they are expensive but will save you $$$ in the long run. It is never easy to remind the govt of its flaws and State vs Federal boundaries is close to a "3rd rail" as it gets.

The trail you set today may be the precedent many follow tomorrow. I wish you the best of luck. The deck is stacked against you but I do like the underdog. Go down swinging & keep moving fwd.
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Old 07-26-2013, 05:58 AM   #18
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Originally Posted by fmj

I am guessing "MMC" is short for Medical Marijuana Card or Consumer or Cultivator....But either way....once you receive your Medical Marijuana Card you are DONE for lawful purchases of firearms. Weed may be legal in your state but its not at the Fed. level..and the Feds control the firearms world.

I dont agree with it, but until more people wise up and get on board with the Libertarians or Constitutionalists thats how its gonna remain.
I think that it would solve a lot of problems if marijuana was legalized, at least someone on it wont be violent like some drunks. I don't think it should be legalized but I'm also against alcohol and tobacco. I know I sound bass ackwards.
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Old 07-26-2013, 11:01 AM   #19
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I think that it would solve a lot of problems if marijuana was legalized, at least someone on it wont be violent like some drunks. I don't think it should be legalized but I'm also against alcohol and tobacco. I know I sound bass ackwards.
Not to derail this thread, but this thought process is what led us to where we are today.

Just because you dontlike something doesnt mean it should be unlawful. What that does is infringe on anothers liberty.

I dont smoke or use drugs, I drink a few beers from time to time. But I have no issue with people using drugs if they so choose. Its a "victimless crime". The only one getting hurt is the one choosing to use the drug.

Its way past time we raise the white flag and call the war on drugs a miserable failure...this also goes for the war on terrorism and poverty etc.
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Old 07-26-2013, 11:37 AM   #20
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To address the original question- Where are my rights?

Well, I have a right to liberty. However, when I am found guilty of a felony, and they put me in prison, that liberty is sharply curtailed. As is my freedom of speech, right not to be searched, etc. You also lose your right to bear arms, vote, have a driver's license, etc.

In your case, you pled no contest to a criminal charge. Under the 1968 Gun Control Act, that now makes it illegal for you to possess a firearm or ammunition. You are welcome to contest the constitutionality of that law.

That same law, codified as US Code, Title 18, section 922 provides that an addict, or unlawful user of controlled substances is likewise prohibited. Please note the term unlawful user. Again, you are welcome to challenge that law.

In the meantime, it IS law, and HAS been law in the entire US for 44 years. This is not something that just popped up on the radar.

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